BRZ vs S2000 vs Cayman S (my take)

[ermax]

Originally Posted by bfrank1972

Hmmm, not sure what you mean by "the engine", i.e. which engine you're referring to, but my statement was more general. I certainly wouldn't run 50W oil in an FA20, but that might be just fine in a Chevy LS. It's not just EPA related.

The 0W-20 really is just an EPA thing. Almost all cars use it these days. It’s not some dramatic change in the engine. A lot of people run heavier weight in the FA20. Someone posted the spec sheet for the factory 86 race car and it has some info on oil weights and if I recall 50W was one of the options. Let me see if I can dig it back up.

Okay the TMG CS-Cup manual says 10W-60

[ZDan]

50 or 60wt should be fine track-only with oil temps at 270F. I wouldn't run that for mostly-street with some track time though...

[Ernest72]

Looks like we all just sell our cars and get Hyundai’s. This way if we miss a shift or just feel like bouncing off the rev limiter all day at the track and our engine or tranny blows, we can get it replaced under warranty. I wonder how many they would warranty for me in 10 years of tracking? I mean I get it they have no issues now, but 10 years is a long time.

You never know. It’s possible.
Even Subaru warrantied some engines from cars they knew were tracked, it depended on the dealership. That ended fast though with all the EJ issues.

Don’t bother responding, I’ll be on the Hyundai forum. ��

Back from the Hyundai world. See link.
https://tiremeetsroad.com/2019/05/28...ur-veloster-n/

It says it in warranty, but still says normal use. Should be interesting to see if they actually honor it. Lots of easy ways to say it was not normal use. Time will tell.

[ninjan00dles]

Originally Posted by Ernest72

Looks like we all just sell our cars and get Hyundai’s. This way if we miss a shift or just feel like bouncing off the rev limiter all day at the track and our engine or tranny blows, we can get it replaced under warranty. I wonder how many they would warranty for me in 10 years of tracking? I mean I get it they have no issues now, but 10 years is a long time.

You never know. It’s possible.
Even Subaru warrantied some engines from cars they knew were tracked, it depended on the dealership. That ended fast though with all the EJ issues.

Don’t bother responding, I’ll be on the Hyundai forum. ��

Back from the Hyundai world. See link.
https://tiremeetsroad.com/2019/05/28...ur-veloster-n/

It says it in warranty, but still says normal use. Should be interesting to see if they actually honor it. Lots of easy ways to say it was not normal use. Time will tell.

If Hoonday produces that mid engine turbo car they've been prototyping you best believe I will be in line to buy that car.

Meanwhile Toyota can't develop a sports car for the North American market that has one of their own engines in it because "reasons".

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by ermax

The 0W-20 really is just an EPA thing. Almost all cars use it these days. It’s not some dramatic change in the engine. A lot of people run heavier weight in the FA20. Someone posted the spec sheet for the factory 86 race car and it has some info on oil weights and if I recall 50W was one of the options. Let me see if I can dig it back up.

Okay the TMG CS-Cup manual says 10W-60

You also conveniently ignore the TMG CS-Cup service intervals.

[Tokay444]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You also conveniently ignore the TMG CS-Cup service intervals.

The oil isn't the reason for the shortened service interval. The duty cycle is.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

The oil isn't the reason for the shortened service interval. The duty cycle is.

The two go hand in hand!

[Tokay444]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

The two go hand in hand!

No they don't.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

No they don't.

okay

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

okay

Just give up

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[Goingnowherefast]

Originally Posted by bfrank1972

Just give up

That man will literally argue any point, regardless of being clearly wrong, to death. Just gotta throw in the towel sometimes

[Tokay444]

You honestly believe the service interval is reduced because of equal parts track use and equal parts heavier oil?
You can run much more viscous oils without reducing the service interval, if you’re not tracking the car. In fact, in many cases, you can increase the service interval.
The intelligent thing to do would be to run UOAs and adjust the service life accordingly.
I’ll go so far as to ask, what do you think the service interval of the Cup car would be if it ran factory fill?

Originally Posted by Goingnowherefast

That man will literally argue any point, regardless of being clearly wrong, to death. Just gotta throw in the towel sometimes

Haven’t been wrong yet.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You also conveniently ignore the TMG CS-Cup service intervals.

So you think running 10W-60 is the cause of the short intervals? Come on man, it’s a race car. If you ran 0w-20 in it, it would have even shorter intervals. My whole point is the 0W-20 isn’t used because of some dramatically different tolerances. It’s about economy in a “daily driver”. On track there are better options.

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by ermax

So you think running 10W-60 is the cause of the short intervals? Come on man, it’s a race car. If you ran 0w-20 in it, it would have even shorter intervals. My whole point is the 0W-20 isn’t used because of some dramatically different tolerances. It’s about economy in a “daily driver”. On track there are better options.

Here is a good/short article on the subject:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/blog.am...ty-of-oil/amp/

Basically supports both general ideas that:

A) modern motors are often designed for lower viscosity oils, indeed designed that way for EPA regulations

And

B) you shouldn't use any old weight you choose and ignore that design. Thicker oil has a harder time flowing through tight bearing journals etc. It really depends on tolerances in the motor.

Maybe the FA20 tolerances aren't that tight? Maybe they are but per Mike's contribution the fact that the oil cannot support flow/heat transfer as well as the lower viscosity oils is secondary to maintaining higher oil pressure during extended track runs - speculating here as I don't participate in any cup series, Mike may have a better idea about the real reason.

It is actually interesting stuff, thicker oils provide a thicker film capable of supporting greater loads (think oil supported journal bearings) but another way to support high loads/force is to use very tight tolerance bearings with thinner oils.

Anyways this appears to be religious, so I'll just leave it as my personal opinion instead of fact

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