(GR86) Second Generation FR-S/BRZ insider info...

[86MLR]

Originally Posted by Spuds

Do we say an inline 4 cylinder engine displacing 2 liters is an inline 0.5 then?

No

122 cubic inches of course, or 6 volts if its a Hybrid.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by 86MLR

Yeah, I just want the badges to match the production.

And not a boxer, I've had a few, I'm not a fan, never again.

Unless I win the lottery, then I'll get a 22B.

Well the Miata has also been a collaboration for several years now so still not badge matching really.

[Lantanafrs2]

Brame it oar on eron musk.

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Well the Miata has also been a collaboration for several years now so still not badge matching really.

Exactly, who gives a shit? Focus on the design/engineering quality, who builds it is irrelevant.

I’ve had cars made in Germany, Austria, Hungary, US, South Africa and Japan. The build quality differences between them aren’t perceptible.

What’s with the hate on the Subaru drivetrain anyway? The most reliable Toyota is the 86*, and Subaru reliability has been above Toyota’s as of 2019. These aren’t EJs that eat their headgaskets for breakfast at 60k miles.

*as of 2019 Consumer reports, 86 is the most reliable Toyota:

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

Brame it oar on eron musk.

Damned Covid!

[alphasaur]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

Exactly, who gives a shit? Focus on the design/engineering quality, who builds it is irrelevant.

I’ve had cars made in Germany, Austria, Hungary, US, South Africa and Japan. The build quality differences between them aren’t perceptible.

What’s with the hate on the Subaru drivetrain anyway? The most reliable Toyota is the 86, and Subaru reliability has been above Toyota’s as of 2019. These aren’t EJs that eat their headgaskets for breakfast at 60k miles.

I know the fa gets so much hate but honestly with an e85 tune and header it's really a great little engine IMO.

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by alphasaur

I know the fa gets so much hate but honestly with an e85 tune and header it's really a great little engine IMO.

The hate comes from people that think you can still build a B18/F20/2ZZ style NA inline-4 and pass emissions with it in a 10k/year platform these days. Their heads are in lalaland.

[Lantanafrs2]

86 is the most reliable Toyota?

[Red-86]

Originally Posted by 86MLR

I'm giving Toyota till the end of the year to build me something, needs:

IL4

All but certain not to happen. If the 2nd gen 86 proceeds, almost guaranteed be a Subi boxer 4.

Not BMW or Subaru

Again, if it proceeds, almost guaranteed to be another Subi collaboration.

If not I don't know what I'll buy, maybe a MX5 RF, but, once I do that's me for the next 3 to 5 years.

Funnily enough, I’m also considering a 2020 MX-5 RF to replace my 2015 86. I want something newer, still small, fun, and RWD, but with a nicer interior and a smoother, better sounding engine. The RF might just fit the bill. Don’t fancy waiting around another year or more on the off chance Toyota release a heavier, uglier next gen twin with just 12 more HP as per the most likely rumours.

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

86 is the most reliable Toyota?

[86MLR]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

Exactly, who gives a shit? Focus on the design/engineering quality, who builds it is irrelevant.

I’ve had cars made in Germany, Austria, Hungary, US, South Africa and Japan. The build quality differences between them aren’t perceptible.

What’s with the hate on the Subaru drivetrain anyway? The most reliable Toyota is the 86, and Subaru reliability has been above Toyota’s as of 2019. These aren’t EJs that eat their headgaskets for breakfast at 60k miles.

Quite a few issues really, they're there when you look, I suppose saying such things on a twin site isn't going to be well recieved.

As for emmisions, who said anything about emmisions, I'm more about, strength, reliabilty, and the ability to easily modify and work on.

But....

The AE888 can run over 200kw and still meet Euro 6, and be more fuel efficient than FA20t.

Plus you can wind up the wick on a AE888 alot more before you and need to worry about luching the engine.

That is one of many examples but, different people want different things, and different things will turn off different people.

Don't get me wrong, you get a really fun car for a small outlay, but, there's always compromises.

Meh, opinions are like arseholes, everyone has got one.

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by 86MLR

The AE888 can run over 200kw and still meet Euro 6, and be more fuel efficient than FA20t.

Plus you can wind up the wick on a AE888 alot more before you and need to worry about luching the engine.

The AE888 is turbocharged, transverse and was designed to be put in anything VW makes up to the golf R. An NA motor is a different beast altogether, and Subaru had less money to pump into the engine considering our RWD chassis costs about 5K more to make than a FWD car.

[86MLR]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

The AE888 is turbocharged, transverse and was designed to be put in anything VW makes up to the golf R. An NA motor is a different beast altogether, and Subaru had less money to pump into the engine considering our RWD chassis costs about 5K more to make than a FWD car.

I was more comparing the 2.0l t powerplants of the different brands.


As for traverse, it isn't hard to swap out at the factory, Nissan, Mazda and Toyota have been doing it for years.

As for the additional cost, I'm happy to pay more for a better package, but in the end they are massed produced disposable cars, but I would be happy to drop around 50k AUD (about 35k USD) on the right car from factory.

Meh

Dreams of rainbows and unicorns

[Red-86]

Originally Posted by 86MLR

As for traverse, it isn't hard to swap out at the factory, Nissan, Mazda and Toyota have been doing it for years.

Yeah, the SkyActiv 2.0 IL4 used longitudinally (as god intended) in the RWD MX-5 is the same 2.0 block mounted transversely in their other FWD cars. Obviously Mazda tinker with it to raise the NA redline and power outputs, as a sportscar deserves.

So transverse vs longitudinal engine availability is definitely not a deal breaker if Toyota really wanted to use one of their existing IL4s in the 86. Low CoG is overblown as the motivating reason for the Subi donk (does anyone think an MX-5/Miata has a high CoG?), it’s as much to do with cost savings and relying on Subi’s platform as anything else.

I would be happy to drop around 50k AUD (about 35k USD) on the right car from factory.

Don’t give them ideas! Top spec/limited edition 86’s already approached AUD50k for no extra power than you get in the base spec GT for >AUD35k. For 50k we deserve a factory turbo, or a lot more NA power from factory.

Having said that, I do agree, I personally would pay more for a nicer engine (pretty much what I am about to do), but I may not represent the average twin buyer. It’s a volume and numbers game for Toyota, and don’t forget that with the B48 2.0 Supra on the scene, the niche for the next 86 in the product stack has a definite ceiling - Toyota won’t let a cheaper 86 outshine the 2.0 Supra, for the same reason Porsche keep base 911 performance just above the Cayman’s.