Wheels - What is legal?

[coyote]

Originally Posted by Type[R]+

I can save 2-3kg per tyre on the IS-F (same sizes), just by going to Michelin PSS from my Bridgestone RE050A's. That's huge!

Yes, that is enormous.

Originally Posted by nix

Ah right sorry, confused myself with your talk of legalities, as 235s are max legal tyre for 86 in SA.

That is ... unfortunate.

[Type[R]+]

Originally Posted by nix

Yes my point though take the same brand/model and increasing width doesn't always mean adding much weight. And yes that is HUGE.

86 has Michelin eco tyres stock right? I'm sure any performance tyre is going to be much heavier! 225 or 255!

[nix]

It's 1inch above placard track width. That gives you enough tyre on most cars, 265 on my supes.

That said I haven't heard of a width based defect, and I know people who've had write offs paid out by insurance with wrong size wheels/tyres.

[coyote]

Originally Posted by JDM Concept

the problem with wide wheels in high offset:
1. is you will end up hitting suspension strut inside (depending on the car model)
2. cars that use this wide normally will end up getting the brakes upgraded (thats at least in japan) and will not work wih high offset
3. it is not cheap to make wheels and only a small market will buy this high offset unfortunately. work wheels for examples discontinued a lot of high offset wheels simply because no one buys them

you are right in the sense retailer and manufacturer will sell what the market demands.

I really don't want to seem argumentative, but:

1. Don't you sell coilovers and didn't you suggest people taking up your group buy may need to fit them to use the wheels they are buying?

2. Many brakes upgrades are more about form than function, but of all the BKKs I've seen yet for this car, I'm yet to see any that wouldn't be easily cleared by most 18x9 +45s ... in fact I'm pretty sure Volk have specified BBK fitment for the 18x9.5 +45 TE37SLs.

3. I'm not referring to stock sizes, but ones specially made for this car. The market is taking what is offered, but I don't think the average retailer realizes the market for this car is much broader than 20 something year old wannabe drifters.

My current daily wheels are actually Work XT7s (18x8.5 +46). I think they are too heavy for a BRZ though and as I have no immediate plans to go for >320mm brake rotors, 17" is preferable to 18".

Again, I don't blame you for a catering for "a" market with heavy wheels that protrude from the bodywork. Please just don't assume that it is "the" market you are catering for, because I don't think it is.

[nix]

Originally Posted by Type[R]+

86 has Michelin eco tyres stock right? I'm sure any performance tyre is going to be much heavier! 225 or 255!

That's not what I was talking about but yep random search:

Michelin 215/45R17: 9.5 kg
Super sports: 9.5
Toyo R1R: 9.8 - 255/35R18: 10.8
Yokohama SD: 10.8
Bridgestone re002: 11.2

[coyote]

Originally Posted by Type[R]+

86 has Michelin eco tyres stock right? I'm sure any performance tyre is going to be much heavier! 225 or 255!

Stock tyres are listed as 20lbs.

Say you want to look at 245/40R17, a quick check (that I may or may not have done earlier) reveals:

ContiSportContact 3 and P Zero Rosso are 1lb heavier

ExtremeContact DW are 2lb heavier

Pilot Super Sport, Proxes R1R and Eagle F1 Asymmetric 2 are 3lb heavier


So yes, heavier ... but not "much" heavier. I think the trade off would be worth it.

[coyote]

Originally Posted by nix

That's not what I was talking about but yep random search:

Michelin 215/45R17: 9.5 kg
Super sports: 9.5
Toyo R1R: 9.8 - 255/35R18: 10.8
Yokohama SD: 10.8
Bridgestone re002: 11.2

Beat me to it.

For what it's worth, I'm tossing up between R1Rs and Super Sports.

[nix]

Point no. 1 is the most important as coilover legality comes into play. To actually be road legal in SA they need to be engineered, not sure about other states.

[coyote]

Originally Posted by nix

Point no. 1 is the most important as coilover legality comes into play. To actually be road legal in SA they need to be engineered, not sure about other states.

Again, unfortunate. At least you have good beer and wine to drown your sorrows.

Having said that, if a 235/45R17 on 17x8 +53 WRX rims will fit (as shown on here), then it's a good bet that a 245/40R17 on a 17x8.5 +45 will too.

And I'm going to need an engineer's cert for a lot more than some coilovers

[JDMC]

Originally Posted by coyote

I really don't want to seem argumentative, but:

1. Don't you sell coilovers and didn't you suggest people taking up your group buy may need to fit them to use the wheels they are buying?

2. Many brakes upgrades are more about form than function, but of all the BKKs I've seen yet for this car, I'm yet to see any that wouldn't be easily cleared by most 18x9 +45s ... in fact I'm pretty sure Volk have specified BBK fitment for the 18x9.5 +45 TE37SLs.

3. I'm not referring to stock sizes, but ones specially made for this car. The market is taking what is offered, but I don't think the average retailer realizes the market for this car is much broader than 20 something year old wannabe drifters.

My current daily wheels are actually Work XT7s (18x8.5 +46). I think they are too heavy for a BRZ though and as I have no immediate plans to go for >320mm brake rotors, 17" is preferable to 18".

Again, I don't blame you for a catering for "a" market with heavy wheels that protrude from the bodywork. Please just don't assume that it is "the" market you are catering for, because I don't think it is.

hi coyote

no worries. i know that you are not trying to start an argument

neither do i, i merely trying give some answer to you what the lack of size in specfically to 17x9 +45 on your comments below

I don't blame the retailers, they are just catering for what the market is asking for. I just can't believe there isn't a market for some nice, light, affordable 17x9 +45ish (that is, LEGAL) wheels.

just to make clarification of the comments that i made,

1. what i mean is that not many manufacturer do size 17x9 +45 is because depending on car model it may hit the suspension even on stock suspension. 17x8 or 17x8.5, yes you see plenty around. wheels manufacturer normally will try to incorporate as many models car models that do up their wheels.

2. i am speaking in the context of the biggest market for japanese wheels (hence i say at least this is in japan), most customer will upgrade their brakes. again referring to your size 17x9 +45, this may not clear easily even if they fit onto a car (not necessarily and 86)

with rays wheels, i am not sure if they can clear or not but then its different size altogether. your are talking about 18x9.5 which is a wider and bigger wheel than 17x9 +45

3. iam referring to again the same size of 17x9 +45 is hard to find because wheels moulding are expensive to make. if people are not buying this size because of point #1 and point #2 that i mentioned earlier. there is no further incentive to make them if the outlaying cost is high and they may not recouped back.

and this is why is the reason i can offer certain size for groupbuy simply because wheels of one spec, say 18x9.5 +38 and one colour are produced in hundreds per one time. it doesnt help the fact that the pcd is 5-100 which no one really use unless you have a subaru. to make matter worse if you are driving sti, the pcd is 5-114.3 except the earlier model sti.

hence why custom made wheels cost more simply there is no economies of scale that you can get from mass produced wheels

4. the reality is there is going to be many market for wheels. some prefer function over form, and some form over function. and those market keep evolving as which is the dominant one. so my comment about the retailer and manufacturing is based purely on my experience as a seller and my discussion with work japan of what sells the most.

just with the recent group buy that i am still having, those size are choosen by how many people approached me with that size. in that sense we sell what market demands and unfortunately we need to left out some who want other sizes.

but this market is very early stage at the moment and if this car going to drive sales and there are a lot of like minded customers who wants a particular size and look, i have no doubt many wheels company will make the size that you want. simply because market demands it.

what will be "the" dominant market for 86 is yet to be form and having seen seen the way the market evolve for other car model, it will be naive and arrogant for me to say this will "the" market. ie everyone going for this chargespeed look.

at the moment, i can only say for a fact that "a" market for chargespeed look exist in 86

and just to add about my comments about work wheels discontinuing those offset in high +40 is based on what they discontinued as early as this year
because no one buys this size:
cr kai 17x9 +44 (would have been perfect for some of you )
xd9 17x9.5 +44
kiwami (the successor of crkai) only come in 17x9 +38

for me personally, i wish work wheels will create more spec because it is easier for me to sell. i just want to sell wheels

hope this clarify further my comments. sorry if i sound against it. i am not at all.

[coyote]

Originally Posted by JDM Concept

hope this clarify further my comments. sorry if i sound against it. i am not at all.

Didn't think you were, but I'm not sure you completely understand what I'm saying. At the end of the day, I'm just one guy and it doesn't matter.

I know the wheels we are talking about are Japanese and the Japanese are great followers of fads and fashion. Such is life, I'll keep trying.

[Nafe]

Why would you put 245s on an 8.5??!!? that would bulge a hell of alot...
whya re you assuming the 8.5 +25 and 9 +30 will stick out alot?? You haven't seen it for yourself. I have very little doubt that they will stick out at all,
I am assuming you think a 9in +10 can't fit on an s13 silvia as well?

[tibsy92]

for nsw RMS(rta) says for the 86 the max rim width is 9inch and allowable rim increase is 2 inches above largest optional rim.. so stock gts is 17inch and legal max would be 19inch..

i got my rims in 19x9 with 235/35ZR19 tyres to keep the speedo happy and no re-tunes needed..

fills the gaps, no rubbing, ride comfort and handling is better too.. doesnt touch any components or hit anything on speedhumps.. no bulging or extreme size.. so its good..

[click_lenny]

Originally Posted by tibsy92

for nsw RMS(rta) says for the 86 the max rim width is 9inch and allowable rim increase is 2 inches above largest optional rim.. so stock gts is 17inch and legal max would be 19inch..

i got my rims in 19x9 with 235/35ZR19 tyres to keep the speedo happy and no re-tunes needed..

fills the gaps, no rubbing, ride comfort and handling is better too.. doesnt touch any components or hit anything on speedhumps.. no bulging or extreme size.. so its good..

Pic pls tibsy!!!