Scion Pure Price Haggling?

[Texas BRZ]

Originally Posted by Chewie4299

Best place to negotiate is on a trade in. That's what I did.

If you don't have one then it's pretty cut and dry. If they are charging you for Vin etching you can usually get that removed and the doc fee is negotiable.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

+1 to this comment and another +1 to the thorough explanation(s) provided by Chewie4299 afterwards.

Upon placing the order for my FR-S and visiting three dealers (and also reading on the internet), I quickly realized that MSRP (Pure Price) would be what I would have to swallow for the FR-S... Therefore I knew that the only way to gain the most out of the deal would be to target negotiations for my trade-in... And so I did.

[Mpowered]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

Think long and hard about law school. The legal profession is saturated in CA, and unless you are going to a state school, you will have 150K in loans when you graduate...

I left my firm because I got tired of the insane workload (6-7 days a week/10-12 hours a day) and crap compensation (relatively speaking).

Not trying to dissuade you, just be certain it is truly what you wish to do...

I'm an attorney and I'd echo this statement.

If you're looking for a 160K a year starting salary, you need to go to a top law school. Think Georgetown or better.

This is what you're facing:

A buddy of mine graduated with me and works at the same firm. He took out loans for 100% of the cost of law school. He pays 2K in student loan payments. Our take home pay is about 7K/month. 5K/month seems like a lot but after rent and expenses he lives paycheck to paycheck, billing 2600 hours a year and works 50% of the weekends.

Granted, we get raises every year and his situation will improve, but youre working a damn lot.

Just imagine if you graduate from the middle 50% of a 50ish ranked law school where your best job option will be at the DA's office where you were making half or one-third of BIGLAW...

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by Mpowered

I'm an attorney and I'd echo this statement.

If you're looking for a 160K a year starting salary, you need to go to a top law school. Think Georgetown or better.

This is what you're facing:

A buddy of mine graduated with me and works at the same firm. He took out loans for 100% of the cost of law school. He pays 2K in student loan payments. Our take home pay is about 7K/month. 5K/month seems like a lot but after rent and expenses he lives paycheck to paycheck, billing 2600 hours a year and works 50% of the weekends.

Granted, we get raises every year and his situation will improve, but youre working a damn lot.

Just imagine if you graduate from the middle 50% of a 50ish ranked law school where your best job option will be at the DA's office where you were making half or one-third of BIGLAW...

Another attorney, co-signing.

[ssmtsx]

Originally Posted by alluringreality

Truecar agrees with you that invoice for a Mini is dealer cost, but how does that support your claim about Scion? I finally found the link where FR-S employee pricing was posted. Do you seriously think dealerships pay more for Scions than employees?

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4614

Seeing as i am a dealership employee..I would know. I can post an invoice of an FR-S if you would like. You will see that there is no holdback listed.

And yes TMS employees do get better pricing than invoice (dealer cost) its the same for any toyota associate purchase. A TMS employee purchase is someone who employed by Toyota motor sales (regional mgr/etc)--not a dealership employee.

[alluringreality]

Originally Posted by ssmtsx

Seeing as i am a dealership employee..I would know. I can post an invoice of an FR-S if you would like. You will see that there is no holdback listed.

Going back to the Edmunds description of holdback, I fail to see what good it is to look at the invoice. Unless you own the dealership, or take care of all the transactions with Toyota, why would it necessarily be your business to know dealer cost? Even if that is your position, as stated in the Edmunds piece, there are reasons why people in such positions may wish to obscure actual dealer cost.

http://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/dealer-holdback/

And yes TMS employees do get better pricing than invoice (dealer cost)

I still consider it preposterous to think any self-respecting dealership owner would buy cars from Toyota at a cost above where it sells to employees. Employees are buying one car, while dealerships are buying possibly hundreds. From a volume standpoint, which is Toyota's interest, it makes no sense.

[Chewie4299]

Originally Posted by alluringreality

Going back to the Edmunds description of holdback, I fail to see what good it is to look at the invoice. Unless you own the dealership, or take care of all the transactions with Toyota, why would it necessarily be your business to know dealer cost? Even if that is your position, as stated in the Edmunds piece, there are reasons why people in such positions may wish to obscure actual dealer cost.

http://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/dealer-holdback/



I still consider it preposterous to think any self-respecting dealership owner would buy cars from Toyota at a cost above where it sells to employees. Employees are buying one car, while dealerships are buying possibly hundreds. From a volume standpoint, which is Toyota's interest, it makes no sense.

Dealership employees are not TMS employees.

I work at the corporate HQ of an international franchise. Store employees are employees of the store's owner and not corporate employees. They do not have access to the same benefits that I do.

Neither do the owners.

It's part of their compensation package as a corporate employee. Toyota needs to make money on the vehicles sold to dealerships but they may be willing to let vehicles go to their own employees at a much lower price.

I worked for Verizon Wireless for a time and paid about 50% of what a consumer pays for service and sometimes even less for equipment.

An employee of Wireless Zone or another retail store that resells the service of the big wireless companies will not get these benefits.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[alluringreality]

Originally Posted by Chewie4299

I work at the corporate HQ of an international franchise.

My takeaway is that you did not address the "Invisible" Dealer Profits discussed in the Edmunds link.

I worked for Verizon Wireless for a time and paid about 50% of what a consumer pays for service and sometimes even less for equipment.

Do you think as a Verizon employee you bought time at a lower rate than the company sells in bulk to resellers, such as Page Plus Cellular?


The only item really in question is the accuracy of the Truecar dealer cost numbers for Scion. I brought up Toyota employee pricing simply because it supports the idea that Scion dealer cost could plausibly be hundreds of dollars below invoice. Based on some of the advertised prices I've seen on other Scion models from KC and OKC dealers, I have a hard time believing that Scion dealer cost is actually invoice, but the Truecar dealer cost would appear reasonable.

[IntotheOcean]

Originally Posted by caliboy15

bring your mommy and daddy to get a good deal!

Hey if it saved him a 100 a month whos one to laugh.
Hell, I wouldn't mind his parents taking a trip with me

[raul]

Originally Posted by Chewie4299

Best place to negotiate is on a trade in. That's what I did.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

^This. I got them to give me $1k more on my trade. Also tit for tat works well for haggling with Scion. They knocked off $500 off sticker because I got LoJack. You can try to get more for your money, but they will do everything possible not to get the sell price down.

[TurnOne]

Pureprice isn't that great of a deal. It helps those who don't know how to negotiate. Regarding the BestBuy example, that's wrong as well. Walk into best buy and offer them 5% off of a big ticket item and I am sure you will pay less than the sticker. Most things in life are negotiable. Whether it's worth the hassle is up to you.

[TheMarkness]

Originally Posted by alluringreality

Truecar agrees with you that invoice for a Mini is dealer cost, but how does that support your claim about Scion? I finally found the link where FR-S employee pricing was posted. Do you seriously think dealerships pay more for Scions than employees?

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4614

Thanks for the link been trying to nail down employee pricing (friend works for Toyota so I'm hoping to get Friends / Family employee discount).

[kilrb]

So it sounds like Scion's pure price thing is really about as good of a price as you're going to get. What I don't understand is, there are dealers in markets that are saturated with BRZ's (snowy markets) at the moment that are selling those at invoice. I know this, because I have a deposit down on a Premium BRZ at invoice plus $89, which puts it about $111 higher than the MSRP of an FR-S. It seems odd that Subaru dealers can sell at invoice, but Scion dealers can't, and that you can get the BRZ with the HID lights, and navigation for hardly any more money...

[shawnperolis]

I just bought an FR-S and I really liked my dealer/salesman. The pure pricing was awesome because it took the hassle out of buying a car. Just go in and buy the damn car, no fighting with the guy trying to sell you it.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by shawnperolis

I just bought an FR-S and I really liked my dealer/salesman. The pure pricing was awesome because it took the hassle out of buying a car. Just go in and buy the damn car, no fighting with the guy trying to sell you it.

I had to fight for nearly 4 months to buy this car without dealer installed nav, rear bumper applique, paint protection, leather seats, lugnuts, Bespoke etc. etc. etc.

I ordered a car (put down money and had an agreement) with "no options", get a call a month later "It's here!", "Ok how much?" "...$26.5k, but it has Bespoke!"

An entire month wasted trusting a dealer, never again.

Glad it worked out for you but "Pure Pricing" can work against the consumer as well.