Spec Twin?

[DaWorstPlaya]

Originally Posted by Briankbot

I was supposed to co-drive that car with James and Kinch at the SCCA event but as you know it was cancelled and I decided to skip the Time Attack. I am very curious as to how well that car was set up being that it had only been out to one previous event. I have a hard time believing that most SSC cars (or any car for that matter) are going to be set up optimally after being driven at only a few events unless the driver(s) are set up/testing experts and knowledgeable in the chassis. While the PAX number may still be off once the cars are developed and driven to their full potential, the possibility of a tune is still on the table which could also help bring the car closer in line to the current number. If I were Rick Ruth, considering those factors, I would take a wait and see approach before announcing any changes.

James told me the setup was very balanced. He said there was very little more the car could offer. He knows what he doing when it comes to suspension setup as he messes with much more than what is allowed in SSC on other cars. He is the one that told me the car should probably be in the GS/HS Pax range. Looking at the results I tend to agree with him.

[tony_r]

Yep. On BFGs we were running with mid & upper-mid STX. Now either being raw'd by ES or barely edging out.

On the flip side, spent a ton of time with setup today. Over 30 runs on abrasive concrete just today. Probably 60ish total. Falkens are barely worn. Would easily be flipping BFGs.

[iLuveKetchup]

The Falken tire doesn’t sound promising. I can understand the cost savings but wished it wasn’t done to the most important part of the set up - tires. It’s kind of like where the rubber meets the road.

[Briankbot]

Originally Posted by DaWorstPlaya

James told me the setup was very balanced. He said there was very little more the car could offer. He knows what he doing when it comes to suspension setup as he messes with much more than what is allowed in SSC on other cars. He is the one that told me the car should probably be in the GS/HS Pax range. Looking at the results I tend to agree with him.

You may be right Suraj but I believe James was on brand new Falkens being used at their 1st event. Please see the relevant discussion on the SSC FB group regarding tire break in and apply it to last weekend's above referenced single data point.

[Imp]

Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup

The Falken tire doesn’t sound promising. I can understand the cost savings but wished it wasn’t done to the most important part of the set up - tires. It’s kind of like where the rubber meets the road.

So what if it is slower than every one else? The primary goal of this class is a spec class, we only compare times against those that run in the class.

If PAX is more important to you, it is NEVER right, never even close, 1st couple years for any new class. So, don't run the class if it is.

At that, Falken is only on a 1 year commitment. May have a different tire next year if there are more than average complaints. It goes to show how much better "street tires" have come over the years. I'd love to take this tire, go back in time, and pit them against the old RT215s that I won STX on in 2003.

And on a more serious note ILK.... If you hate what's going on in this class that much that you incessantly have to have your fingers vomit on the keyboard with negativity, why do you stay in this thread or run the class? It seems like at least once a week, someone pisses in your cheerios and you find something else to complain about.

--kC

[dowroa]

Originally Posted by Imp

So what if it is slower than every one else? The primary goal of this class is a spec class, we only compare times against those that run in the class.

If PAX is more important to you, it is NEVER right, never even close, 1st couple years for any new class. So, don't run the class if it is.

At that, Falken is only on a 1 year commitment. May have a different tire next year if there are more than average complaints. It goes to show how much better "street tires" have come over the years. I'd love to take this tire, go back in time, and pit them against the old RT215s that I won STX on in 2003.

--kC

Agree with the above. I think the purpose and people the class is attempting to aim at is correct.

Also with the following stated:

Yep. On BFGs we were running with mid & upper-mid STX. Now either being raw'd by ES or barely edging out.

On the flip side, spent a ton of time with setup today. Over 30 runs on abrasive concrete just today. Probably 60ish total. Falkens are barely worn. Would easily be flipping BFGs.

This sounds like the right tire with the intent of the class.

[iLuveKetchup]

Originally Posted by Imp

So what if it is slower than every one else? The primary goal of this class is a spec class, we only compare times against those that run in the class.

It doesn't have to be mutually exclusive. We can run spec and also a faster tire.

Originally Posted by Imp

And on a more serious note ILK.... If you hate what's going on in this class that much that you incessantly have to have your fingers vomit on the keyboard with negativity, why do you stay in this thread or run the class? It seems like at least once a week, someone pisses in your cheerios and you find something else to complain about.

--kC

You are right! I am going to leave this thread & class.

[Twinz]

What if I told you the top 200TW tires weren't actually 200TW?

[steverife]

Originally Posted by Imp

So what if it is slower than every one else? The primary goal of this class is a spec class, we only compare times against those that run in the class.

If PAX is more important to you, it is NEVER right, never even close, 1st couple years for any new class. So, don't run the class if it is.

At that, Falken is only on a 1 year commitment. May have a different tire next year if there are more than average complaints. It goes to show how much better "street tires" have come over the years. I'd love to take this tire, go back in time, and pit them against the old RT215s that I won STX on in 2003.

And on a more serious note ILK.... If you hate what's going on in this class that much that you incessantly have to have your fingers vomit on the keyboard with negativity, why do you stay in this thread or run the class? It seems like at least once a week, someone pisses in your cheerios and you find something else to complain about.

--kC

I ran ES*, so I don't mind being slower, but it is super tough to find direct competition in a lot of places without PAX. You can still make comparisons, but competition is always more meaningful when your competitor knows they are competing.


* It is kinda frustrating when you are at the start line and the starter asked you what you are running, you tell them, and they are like, "Well, are you at least having fun?" when you are winning PAX class.

[JakeRogue]

So does anyone have alignment spec recommendations?

With camber bolts I will try to get as much front negative camber I can without rubbing, I will do just a little toe out for the front, a little toe in for the rear, but I’m at a loss for rear camber. With the kit, we can get more rear camber in the rear than the front, but hoe much is the question? Square the set up? More in the rear? Not sure what I should do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[cjd]

Originally Posted by JakeRogue

So does anyone have alignment spec recommendations?

With camber bolts I will try to get as much front negative camber I can without rubbing, I will do just a little toe out for the front, a little toe in for the rear, but I’m at a loss for rear camber. With the kit, we can get more rear camber in the rear than the front, but hoe much is the question? Square the set up? More in the rear? Not sure what I should do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

STX is typically anywhere from -2 to -3. Maybe not helpful, but I'd be starting -2.3 to -2.5.

[Racecomp Engineering]

Just FYI, we're going to start carrying BRAID wheels and will have a 17x8 +40 wheel. Approximate weight is 18-19 lbs (will confirm) so not the lightest, but very strong flow formed wheels. Just another option.

- Andrew

[tony_r]

Originally Posted by steverife

I ran ES*, so I don't mind being slower, but it is super tough to find direct competition in a lot of places without PAX. You can still make comparisons, but competition is always more meaningful when your competitor knows they are competing.

This is the main argument that I can see regarding the PAX issue. The current modifier does not serve the competitors who might be trying to gauge where they need to be in terms of speed, and have no direct competition. The fallback of "SCCA does not use PAX" is false. They use it in seeding for the Match Tour challenges, and pretty much all the regions have indexed classes. If the regions are not a part of SCCA, then they should stop paying all the fees. :P

ProSolo uses it's own index, too, and is just as screwed there as it is in Solo.

[steverife]

Pro Solo should be fine as long as SSC makes a class. Compete against class. Do well in class, go to challenge. Challenge is based on class dial in, so you are good there.

Match Tour? Sleep in and hit the road early if you want. You are boned for shootouts.

Also, I'm sure we'll get a significant PAX change for year 2.