Low and flush but close to stock feel, advice?

[Silver Cervy]

This turned into a spring thread super fast, when we should also be discussing tires as well. The DW's are good tires just by reading the reviews but they probably give too much grip for what you're looking for. I definitely wouldn't go wider than 225's and definitely don't buy Michelin as they're obsessed with grip, unless you decide to just get bigger Primacy's which actually wouldn't be such a bad idea.

Just to touch on springs, though, my car is lowered 1" on Hotchkis springs and that alone did not change the overall feel of the car much for me. In fact in some instances I'd say it feels even better than stock, but I wouldn't go any lower w/o getting new struts as well. If you want to go with 18" wheels then I would 100% recommend either keeping the stock springs or getting a nice soft set of coilovers, as doing both springs and bigger wheels will really make your ride harsh. As everyone's been saying, you have to be willing to give up something to get more of another thing.

Ultimately, if you say you like the feel of stock then you should try to keep it as close to stock as possible.

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by Silver Cervy

This turned into a spring thread super fast, when we should also be discussing tires as well. The DW's are good tires just by reading the reviews but they probably give too much grip for what you're looking for. I definitely wouldn't go wider than 225's and definitely don't buy Michelin as they're obsessed with grip, unless you decide to just get bigger Primacy's which actually wouldn't be such a bad idea.

Just to touch on springs, though, my car is lowered 1" on Hotchkis springs and that alone did not change the overall feel of the car much for me. In fact in some instances I'd say it feels even better than stock, but I wouldn't go any lower w/o getting new struts as well. If you want to go with 18" wheels then I would 100% recommend either keeping the stock springs or getting a nice soft set of coilovers, as doing both springs and bigger wheels will really make your ride harsh. As everyone's been saying, you have to be willing to give up something to get more of another thing.

Ultimately, if you say you like the feel of stock then you should try to keep it as close to stock as possible.

Yeah i was debating getting primacys again! Ive enjoyed them. I think im going with trd lowering coils and probably keep 17" wheel. With 35
Offset will my tires be close to flush?! Im tempted to just get spacers but i drive really hard. Just this weekend i was driving the tightest narrowst s curve/hairpin canyon road with no barrier. The car was being pushed to its limits. Nonstop rollercoaster for 5 hours straight haha. I need to be able to rely on my cars components or its inevitable something potentially fatal might happen

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by Teseo

Why not save a bit more and buy coilovers? You can adjust heigh and dampening, best of both worlds

Mmm im debating it but why spend an extra 600$+ when i domt plan on dropping any lower and i enjoy the dampening now. Im not a fan of really low cars


Really its a performance debate for me. And i feel
Stock dampeners with trd coils would be some
Of the best quality i can run in my car. I trust toyoburu engineers.

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by MeisterR

The MeisterR ZetaCRD coilovers might also be a candidate for your need.
It is a little more expensive than what you can get the Stance for, and it also may not go as low as might still be a small arch gap.

You can see more here: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...57&postcount=8



However, the ZetaCRD setup comes with a very sensible springs rate (5kg/mm front, 4kg/mm rear), long travel rear damper for good compliancy, and a rubber insulated press steel top mount to help avoid noise issue commonly associated with coilovers upgrade.

Just another option to have on your table.
It may or may not fit your need, but no harm putting it on the list if you want an adjustable suspension that can lower the car but retain stock feel.
Especially important for a car that drives on the road and need to be compliant for uneven road surfaces.

Jerrick

Love that photo. What are your wheel and tire spec? How much do you think youre lowered?

[Silver Cervy]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

Yeah i was debating getting primacys again! Ive enjoyed them. I think im going with trd lowering coils and probably keep 17" wheel. With 35
Offset will my tires be close to flush?! Im tempted to just get spacers but i drive really hard. Just this weekend i was driving the tightest narrowst s curve/hairpin canyon road with no barrier. The car was being pushed to its limits. Nonstop rollercoaster for 5 hours straight haha. I need to be able to rely on my cars components or its inevitable something potentially fatal might happen

Good quality spacers, if installed right, will be able to handle some major cornering forces. I would get ones made from forged aluminum. But you also need to make sure that your wheels allow spacers to fit around the hub equally, and also provide enough space for the lug nuts. Most spacers come with bolts directly attached to them so it shouldn't be a big issue.

If you're debating on offset then just check the wheel directory sticky. I'm pretty sure the ideal offset for a 17x8 wheel is +36mm.

[MeisterR]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

Love that photo. What are your wheel and tire spec? How much do you think youre lowered?

Don't have an exact number on the lowered amount.
It is not the lowest setting on the MeisterR coilovers, but I would say it is getting close.

The wheel is Enkei Kojin, 18x9.5J ET45

Jerrick

[MeisterR]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

Mmm im debating it but why spend an extra 600$+ when i domt plan on dropping any lower and i enjoy the dampening now. Im not a fan of really low cars


Really its a performance debate for me. And i feel
Stock dampeners with trd coils would be some
Of the best quality i can run in my car. I trust toyoburu engineers.

The questions is how low you want to go, and how much control you want to have over the car.

If lowering springs will work for you, it isn't a bad option.
If you want to go lower than what lowering springs can provide, the coilovers is the only option.

Now, if lowering springs and coilovers both can achieve the ride height you want, then it is getting to the dampers.

Stock are fine, but adjustable dampers will give better damping response as well as control through the adjustment.

With coilovers and adjustable dampers:
You can have it softer for road use, compliant but will exhibit less roll normally.
You can have a stiffer setup for spirited driving / track use, will provide better body roll control as well as increase steering response.

Basically you can have 2 suspension setting build into 1 suspension, and you can pick what you want to use base on what you need at the time.
Lowering springs with OEM dampers do not have that flexibility.

So it is weighting up what you want to spend, what you want the suspension to do, and what you want to do with the car.

Jerrick

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by MeisterR

Don't have an exact number on the lowered amount.
It is not the lowest setting on the MeisterR coilovers, but I would say it is getting close.

The wheel is Enkei Kojin, 18x9.5J ET45

Jerrick

What is the offset!? 45? How is it so flush with stock offset!?

[Norinradd]

So im thinking 17x8 or 18x8 with +35 offset. I dont want any poke and i dont want my tire inside the well. Id like it to be as flush as possible.

How come ive seen users with 8-9" wide rim and an offset in tbe 40s and their tires are flush!?!? Is the only answer they must be using a spacer!? Then i ask who the hell spends money on aftermarket rims and gets a spacer. 90% of why im buying aftermarket wheels is to get the tires flushed up with a different offset.

Also ive heard so much on tire sizes. Id rather have less sidewall but i dont want a tiny bit of tire makin ride super harsh.

[NLSP]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

So im thinking 17x8 or 18x8 with +35 offset. I dont want any poke and i dont want my tire inside the well. Id like it to be as flush as possible.

How come ive seen users with 8-9" wide rim and an offset in tbe 40s and their tires are flush!?!? Is the only answer they must be using a spacer!? Then i ask who the hell spends money on aftermarket rims and gets a spacer. 90% of why im buying aftermarket wheels is to get the tires flushed up with a different offset.

Also ive heard so much on tire sizes. Id rather have less sidewall but i dont want a tiny bit of tire makin ride super harsh.

Flushness isn't solely determined by offset; the width makes a difference as well. A 8-9" width wheel will be more flush than stock even if it has the stock offset of +48. Having the same offset just means they have the same centre point. E.g. an 8" wide wheel with +48 offset will poke out more half an inch, and the other half inch will go into the wheel well. This tool may be helpful for you:

www.willtheyfit.com

[NLSP]

Regarding tire size, if you want less sidewall, I'd assume you want to maintain the same overall diameter (stock tire diameter is 24.7") so that you don't throw off your speedo and don't make it look like you have more wheel gap. In that case, go with the 18x8 and 215/40/18 tire size. You'll lose about half an inch of sidewall, so there's no avoiding the fact it'll feel firmer than a 17" setup. Your tire choice will also impact ride quality.

Another useful tool for tire sizes:

www.1010tires.com/Tools/Tire-Size-Calculator

[Norinradd]

Originally Posted by NLSP

Regarding tire size, if you want less sidewall, I'd assume you want to maintain the same overall diameter (stock tire diameter is 24.7") so that you don't throw off your speedo and don't make it look like you have more wheel gap. In that case, go with the 18x8 and 215/40/18 tire size. You'll lose about half an inch of sidewall, so there's no avoiding the fact it'll feel firmer than a 17" setup. Your tire choice will also impact ride quality.

Another useful tool for tire sizes:

www.1010tires.com/Tools/Tire-Size-Calculator

Thanks those websites were awesome

So the wheel im looking at is xxr 530

Im debating on, keep in mind ill be dropping car 1" and cambering in wheels a tad.

17x8.25 +35 infront and +25 in rear. Will 10mm of stagger effect cars feel drastically? If i go 17 ill be swapping the stock primacy onto that rim.

Or 17x8.25 +35 all around with stock tire

Or 18x8.75 +35 all around on 225/40

I cant tell if i like bigger or smaller rim.

What do u guys think?

[NLSP]

Originally Posted by Norinradd

Thanks those websites were awesome

So the wheel im looking at is xxr 530

Im debating on, keep in mind ill be dropping car 1" and cambering in wheels a tad.

17x8.25 +35 infront and +25 in rear. Will 10mm of stagger effect cars feel drastically? If i go 17 ill be swapping the stock primacy onto that rim.

Or 17x8.25 +35 all around with stock tire

Or 18x8.75 +35 all around on 225/40

I cant tell if i like bigger or smaller rim.

What do u guys think?

Since you've put an emphasis on trying to maintain stock feel, 17x8.25, +35 would be the ideal choice. They also weigh about the same as the stock wheels. The 18x8.75 model weighs 23lbs; the car's going to feel more sluggish.

The 17's actually look big already since the spokes extend all the way to the edge of the wheel. Fits good too. This guy is lowered on Eibach Pro-Kit (1" drop), but running 245/40/17 tire.

[bfrank1972]

For reference, here's what the 18" 530's/8.75 width look like, dropped about 1.6" on coilovers. Sorry for the poor color, it's Argento but looks kind of greenish



Don't really notice any difference in acceleration, it goes pretty quickly (especially with the headers added).