Flex Fuel + E85

[tm86]

I've seen the other technical threads about flex fuel and E85 but not much here in the Africa forums.

Who's running it and where are you sourcing E85?

[86 South Africa]

Originally Posted by tm86

I've seen the other technical threads about flex fuel and E85 but not much here in the Africa forums.

Who's running it and where are you sourcing E85?

I am... Loving it.
Flexfuel is a great... No messing around with maps / re-tuning etc. I have the delicious Flexfuel kit, installed by RMS (in Pretoria).

E85 isn't easy to get in SA... I have been using Rolfes chemicals, but they only deliver on R5,000 orders and up! So I've been driving to Germiston to fetch.
I'll be ordering 2 barrels soon though - then they'll deliver.

I also know of a company in Randburg that sells ethanol, but when I contacted them they didn't want to sell to the public. Going to try them again though and see if they'll make a few exceptions.

Ethanol rocks!

[tm86]

That sounds awesome. Do you have dyno results?
What ratio of petrol to ethanol do you run?

[86 South Africa]

No dyno results... but it's a reliable 20-25% increase on the wheels.

I normally run between 65-85% ethanol. The gains in that range seem to be the best (as judged by my butt-dyno!)

It definitely gives the car more torque because it pulls that little bit harder when accelerating.

[FT_86_SM_GP]

Originally Posted by tm86

I've seen the other technical threads about flex fuel and E85 but not much here in the Africa forums.

Who's running it and where are you sourcing E85?

Here's an interesting article to read,
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

Also with our $/ZAR exchange rate, make sure you explore the local FI routes(Superchargers/Turbo) before you go NA - UEL header / exhaust / Flex Fuel kit

I don't know the pricing, but I am sure they are not significantly far off,

[tm86]

Originally Posted by FT_86_SM_GP

Here's an interesting article to read,
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

Also with our $/ZAR exchange rate, make sure you explore the local FI routes(Superchargers/Turbo) before you go NA - UEL header / exhaust / Flex Fuel kit

I don't know the pricing, but I am sure they are not significantly far off,

Interesting read.

[steve99]

Full flex fuel system is great but its going to cost you a fair bit of money.


not sure on SA money so ill just talk USA dollars


The only "easy" way to go full flex system is with ecutek so you will need


Someone to flash the ecutek tune for you or a $350 cable/dongle kit
Ecutek licience to flash $350


A flex fuel kit around $700 or so USD, the moto-east ones come with tune
else your up for around $250-350 or so for a flex fuel tune.




If you just want to go a dedicated E85 tune with OFT or other non ecutek tune system will just cost you price of tune, not sure what that is in SA.


But your stuck on E85 till you flash back a petrol tune.




E85 on stock car
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67310


or read a few of the relevant links below

[FT_86_SM_GP]

Originally Posted by steve99

Full flex fuel system is great but its going to cost you a fair bit of money.


not sure on SA money so ill just talk USA dollars


The only "easy" way to go full flex system is with ecutek so you will need


Someone to flash the ecutek tune for you or a $350 cable/dongle kit
Ecutek licience to flash $350


A flex fuel kit around $700 or so USD, the moto-east ones come with tune
else your up for around $250-350 or so for a flex fuel tune.




If you just want to go a dedicated E85 tune with OFT or other non ecutek tune system will just cost you price of tune, not sure what that is in SA.


But your stuck on E85 till you flash back a petrol tune.




E85 on stock car
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67310


or read a few of the relevant links below

Currently at our ZAR weakening currency, as at 16 May 2016 9am,
R15.4695 / USD...

(With our current political landscape, its more volatile than a season than GOT).

As per Steve's estimates above,

Approx $1000 to get a flex fuel kit and tune? (R15,000) (Excluding shipping and customs)
Add Local UEL Headers, and exhaust (R15,000 - R20,000?)
(Not sure what the going rates for RMS is at this stage).

That's approx R30,000 - R35,000
(Including shipping and customs, maybe R40,000 - R45,000?)

Value for money ?

Not in my opinion.

Rather save up another R25k and go FI.
But then there's even more costs involved there
(depending on how much power you want , bigger brakes, upgraded clutch etc).

Fish Eagle runs the RGM kit, and hasn't upgraded clutch or needed a BBK.

Depends on your application @tm86

[steve99]

Another option is a ecutek map switch tune


From moto-east tuning in usa you can get licience plus a 4 map switch on the fly tune via cruise stalk.


95/98/E40/E85 tune, tune and licience is 350 + 100 tune so $450 all up
as long as you have someone to flash it with ecutek cable kit.


no flex fuel kit required and you not stuck on E85, but you need to manually switch maps. the e40 tune is for 50/50 petrol E85

[FT_86_SM_GP]

Originally Posted by steve99

Another option is a ecutek map switch tune


From moto-east tuning in usa you can get licience plus a 4 map switch on the fly tune via cruise stalk.


95/98/E40/E85 tune, tune and licience is 350 + 100 tune so $450 all up
as long as you have someone to flash it with ecutek cable kit.


no flex fuel kit required and you not stuck on E85, but you need to manually switch maps. the e40 tune is for 50/50 petrol E85

What is your opinion on Flex fuel kits ?

Versus running a e40/50 tune and mixing slightly higher ratios to aim for e55/e60, given that our ECU kind of adapts to fuel as per Shiv tunings article:

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

[86 South Africa]

Originally Posted by FT_86_SM_GP

What is your opinion on Flex fuel kits ?

Versus running a e40/50 tune and mixing slightly higher ratios to aim for e55/e60, given that our ECU kind of adapts to fuel as per Shiv tunings article:

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

My 2c from my own experience...

Flexfuel is really just a saving on the hassle factor.

If you have e50 or e85 tune on the same car you'll still get all the same power increases etc as a FF kit, just that you need to manually have the correct map.

On my FF kit I have the 4 options on the cruise control stalk... but it's a case of a 1. normal map 2. aggressive map and the 3/4 is the same for 'octane boosters'... so I really use map 1 and 2 only.

Mine also has flat-foot shifting, auto blipping and launch control as some fun extras.

[86 South Africa]

Originally Posted by FT_86_SM_GP

Currently at our ZAR weakening currency, as at 16 May 2016 9am,
R15.4695 / USD...

(With our current political landscape, its more volatile than a season than GOT).

As per Steve's estimates above,

Approx $1000 to get a flex fuel kit and tune? (R15,000) (Excluding shipping and customs)
Add Local UEL Headers, and exhaust (R15,000 - R20,000?)
(Not sure what the going rates for RMS is at this stage).

That's approx R30,000 - R35,000
(Including shipping and customs, maybe R40,000 - R45,000?)

Value for money ?

Not in my opinion.

Rather save up another R25k and go FI.
But then there's even more costs involved there
(depending on how much power you want , bigger brakes, upgraded clutch etc).

Fish Eagle runs the RGM kit, and hasn't upgraded clutch or needed a BBK.

Depends on your application @tm86

Again, my 2c from my own experience, but this is obviously going to be a little different now because I got SUPER lucky and ordered/paid for everything literally 1 day before the Rand crashed in December!

I paid approx 35k... but I got;
Headers (12k was just for the headers).
FF hardware + install + tune (Ecutek cable etc).
Transmission and rear bushings (Whiteline)
Bonnet dampers
All of the above was installed and tuned etc.

All in all... I think it was perhaps a little bit pricey - but when you consider I basically dropped my car off for a day or two then went back and collected with everything installed, ready to go, then I don't think it was too bad.

It has DEFINITELY improved my car and my driving experience.
FF is really a luxury though. If you're just looking for a simple bit of extra power then go for headers + a tune.

___

The problem with FI is that the same Rand weakness will affect FI options because we import pretty much everything (even if someone is going to build you a kit locally).

At the end of the day this is all actually a luxury, so it's really a case of what
you're prepared to spend on your car (and the risk you wanna take to make some of the power).

I still have FI and better brakes on my personal wishlist.
Brakes I have a 6k and a 20k option.
FI... I have no options just yet cos it's very expensive!

[86 South Africa]

Originally Posted by steve99

95/98/E40/E85 tune, tune and licience is 350 + 100 tune so $450 all up
as long as you have someone to flash it with ecutek cable kit.

We only have 93/95 where I live, and I'm told it ain't great quality fuel either.


We also don't have easily available ethanol (which is 1 reason why I personally went FF... so I don't have to worry about the % content each time I run out or need normal fuel etc).

[FT_86_SM_GP]

Originally Posted by 86 South Africa

My 2c from my own experience...

Flexfuel is really just a saving on the hassle factor.

If you have e50 or e85 tune on the same car you'll still get all the same power increases etc as a FF kit, just that you need to manually have the correct map.

On my FF kit I have the 4 options on the cruise control stalk... but it's a case of a 1. normal map 2. aggressive map and the 3/4 is the same for 'octane boosters'... so I really use map 1 and 2 only.

Mine also has flat-foot shifting, auto blipping and launch control as some fun extras.

Agreed,

NB. I am not against FF kits,

If we lived in the US, that will probably be the first thing i'd buy,

But we live in South Africa, where the ANC kind of determines if Car parts are value for money or not.