F/I Blowing motors facts

[kch]

Originally Posted by RichardsFRS

I would love 200 at the wheels after loss. Can you do that without turbo or blower?

Yep. Full exhaust, E85, tune.

[RichardsFRS]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

GD everyone saying "300 HP would be crazy" or "250 is enough" is getting old on this board.

You need less caffeine

[RichardsFRS]

Originally Posted by kch

Yep. Full exhaust, E85, tune.

That's awesome and that's what I would want. What header what exhaust muffler, cat or no? I think this is sufficient HP for that little car. I've had well over 300 with my last car but I didn't trust its handling like I do my FRS.

Also how does it sound. I would hope not to sound like a (old addage) bumble bee in a can) I like the nice kinda quiet kinda throaty sound the stock is giving. How does your set up sound

[kch]

Originally Posted by RichardsFRS

That's awesome and that's what I would want. What header what exhaust muffler, cat or no? I think this is sufficient HP for that little car. I've had well over 300 with my last car but I didn't trust its handling like I do my FRS.

Also how does it sound. I would hope not to sound like a (old addage) bumble bee in a can) I like the nice kinda quiet kinda throaty sound the stock is giving. How does your set up sound

pmed

[mrk1]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

Hey everyone I just want to put a few facts out there for you new F/I guys who are not really tech savvy on this platform or to the people that are considering F/I. I don't mean to offend anyone but I am sure I will because someone always knows more or has their own opinions.


Here it goes, THE NUMBER 1 REASON the fa20 blows up under F/I is THE RODS SUCK they are nothing more than TIME BOMBS under the STRESSES that F/I PUTS OUT!!!!!!!!! PERIOD the END!!!!! Will the rods hold up to 8000 to 8500RPM N/A sure they will no problem oil will be the issue then at that RPM if it stays at that rpm for while. So to drive this point home their is no real way for anyone to claim a certain psi is safe. NO WAY!!!!! A gt45 at 18 psi and a GT28 at 18 psi are completely different. And the stress that goes with the bigger turbo are harder on a stock engine.. Sure you have companies out there telling you its all good no worries go for it but they sell products its there job to sell. I don't know of any company that will replace your engine if it pops and that should tell you something... I personally know guys pushing 500 whp on stock motors for close to 2 yrs with no problems. I also have friends that popped around 325 to 350 hp.. Its a roll of the dice.....
Which leads me to the next point. Please please please for the love of whatever you love, stop blaming the tunes....If a rod went its most likely not the tune if you have a huge hole in your piston it could be the tune but it could also be mechanical. Faulty fueling like a bad pump bad injectors. Please find the source before placing blame it's the right thing to do. Their are some really great people on this forum that have years of experience with this craft and have tremendous knowledge about this platform that are more than willing to help you. Most of them for free... Just ask..... So is it safe to boost a stock engine well that depends on what you call safe. Can it be done at a low psi and live for awhile? sure it can but don't' expect it to go 200k and not have a problem.... My thought are this if I bought a new frs/brz the first thing I would do is boost it to 300hp for everyday driving. That's my personal feeling of remotely safe and a risk I would take to have a car that feels amazing to drive... Anything above 300hp I would replace the rods and pistons. Just be aware that the 6k you invest in your boosted fa20 and what the truth is behind F/I
One more quick thing don't get caught up in the numbers game, 30psi or 650hp. Do what feels good to you and stop, numbers are for bragging smiles are where its at. If you get a big cheesy grin at 300hp that's all you need and your car will last a lot longer.. Trust me 640 hp on the street isn't much fun so I just dial my boost down and cruise along. I only run wastegate springs set at 5 psi on the street that's all I need. I hope this helps some of you new F/I guys. Peace and let the flaming begin lol

Definitely agree, I think people are quick to blame tunes because it something they cant really see or don't fully understand so its easy to point fingers. Regardless this motor didn't leave factory with the intentions of being boosted so of course the rods aren't up to the task. If you boost your motor and don't accept some sort of gamble in doing so thats your fault. I started a forged internal piggy bank the day I decided to install a turbo.

TC or SC. It doesn't matter your increasing cylinder pressures.

[hmong337]

I've come to accept that it's best to keep this engine under 300whp. Anything more, just get another car.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

If a fa20 could make 300hp n/a on a stock bottom end I would faint!!!

It can, and has been done.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

My 1997 Dodge 5.9 Cummins is only 16.3.1 compression and those rods are huge in comparison

Perhaps you don't understand a fundamental difference between a gasoline and diesel engine....

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by ajc209

Everyone loves how I like to harp on about Cosworth. I'd put lots money on them having done the most extensive R&D of any of the FI kits avaliable for the FA20. So here we go, they have tested the rods. Snapped rods. Done materials analysis on the rods. Done engine simulations using some cleaver software. Done enduracne testing on an in house engine dyno. Done a number of trackdays all over europe in sub zero to 35C temperatures.

Their engineers determined 250WHP was the absolute max they could stretch from the stock block and maintain 100k mile levels of reliability.

I know of a centrifugal charged car (not naming anyone or any kit) recently blew a rod at about 300WHP. The other 3 rods were showing signs of high cycle fatique too...

I feel for guys like Delicious as they always get blamed. Just because one car survives 350WHP for 3 years while being thrashed, doesnt mean that is a safe power level for every engine.

The CSG BRZ must be an outlier, because we've been north of 300whp (standard dynojet) for quite a while, and I'm 100% confident the car has been beaten on, and beaten on, and beaten on.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by RichardsFRS

Agree with Sub. 300whp would be crazy. I would love 200 at the wheels after loss. Can you do that without turbo or blower? Can you buy a small displacement blower or turbo that won't wreck the engines? 300 would be fun but a lil dangerous for the engine

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88696 << 199.6 on CA 91 with just a header, front pipe, and tune.

300whp can be done with any of the bolt-on superchargers + E85.

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

It can, and has been done.

Where is this unicorn?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

Where is this unicorn?

It was just an experiment, but back in 2013, huge cams + valves + Q16 + (effectively) open header (it was an on engine dyno).

Add some nitrous to the mix and I would expect to have seen north of 350.

[FRS Justin]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

It was just an experiment, but back in 2013, huge cams + valves + Q16 + (effectively) open header (it was an on engine dyno).

I call bullshit

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by FRS Justin

I call bullshit

Why? You can take a stock FRS, put on a header, front pipe, C23, nitrous, and easily make 300hp.

You're really just showing how limited your experience is with these posts. Think outside the box, instead of limiting yourself to what you commonly see on this board.