Why do we pay for music?

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I am wondering if it is just us older guys that think this way? ...

It is definitely a changing mindset and isn't new, its been a long time getting to this point. I suppose to some extent it happens with every generation as technology advances and intellectual property becomes harder to control and "profit" from directly. What's a real shame is that the best way to make money off intellectual property is to "give it away" so you can collect information about individuals and sell that to other people so they know who to "give away" things to gather even more information about them.

Ughh. OK everyone....get off my music lawn!

There I said it, I feel better now.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Ughh. OK everyone....get off my music lawn!

There I said it, I feel better now.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Nobody cares where you got your Barney songs from.
(Couldn't let you waste that flamesuit)

Probably more like this...

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

The difference is those "free" web servers are making money in other ways. The product they provide you for "free" is not the real business they are in. It is what makes the money that defines their business. So, for example, Google is an advertising company pure and simple. Anything else they do is aimed at driving that portion of their business.

That's because Google has figured out a way to make money off providing something for free. If everyone used Adblock they would have problems, but that's not the case and it's working out well.

Just like the movies and concerts have security guards to make sure the revenue comes in for the goods, artists need to be able to secure their work too. Unfortunately, a sound or video clip is not securable at all, and thus bad business.

Just like the book industry, the music industry needs to come up with a model that is in tune with technological limitations and realities. Producers and publishers just don't add as much economic value anymore in the digital age where distribution costs are zero.

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

There are lots of people that make money off producing something once, then reaping the rewards. Patents are another example. You can license the patent to someone willing to produce it, sit back and enjoy the fruits of your labor.
What you don't see is the time it took to get there, and the effort required to produce the product.
[/SIZE]

Yup, videogames, films, web apps, mobile apps, websites, digital graphic design, and on and on and on...

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I am wondering if it is just us older guys that think this way? I generally shy away from the whole "kids these days" thing (we were the "kids" referred to once upon a time) but it seems to be socially accepted that if it is on the internet it is free to take as you wish.

Nah, it's not... but you older guys tend to be less self-absorbed and realize how things actually work in life. Less entitlement. More understanding.

I'm only 27, but I'm a software developer and a musician... so, software & music... two things which fall prey to heavy theft via online P2P pirating... so, maybe I just have a more unique perspective than most younger guys. haha.

I think it also has to do with maturity though. When I was younger, I was incredibly poor and had no problem stealing anything... Now, I'm older, have a stable career & a lot more money, and now I WANT to support people who make things I like, because I realize that they wouldn't be able to make those things if nobody supported them. I like to call it "growing up" and "not being a douchebag."

With that said, I don't think pirating things to try them out is necessarily wrong. I do it all the time with music, games, music production plugins, etc.... The difference is I will actually go out and buy those things if I like them. If I don't like them, I delete them. No harm, no foul.

[gramicci101]

I pay for music because I have no problem supporting artists I like. If no one buys their music then they make no money and they stop making music. Plus, CDs have better sound quality than digital formats.

As far as making something once and getting paid for a lifetime on it, that's just how the world works. If you mass produce something you get paid every time one of those items is sold, not just once for actually creating the original item. Kraftwerks gets paid for each supercharger that goes out their door, not just the first one they made. Same with music, cars, coffee cups, toothbrushes, whatever.

Originally Posted by TCoat

How would it be if you walked into a business and everybody there is using your PPT but you never got paid a cent for it?

This is actually super fucking irritating. I've made products purely for me to use to help me do my job better, and somehow these get shared out across the Air Force. A year later at another base, I find the exact same thing: same layouts, same buttons, same formulas, same output products, even down to the same colors used in the same spots, and I get told that someone at that base came up with it. Fucking sure they did.

I've gotten a lot more stingy and controlling about who I even let see my products, much less use them, because I don't get credit for my work. Which sucks, because I'm supposed to be training my subordinates to replace me. They'll have to find their own way; it just won't be as effective or efficient as mine.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Just like the book industry, the music industry needs to come up with a model that is in tune with technological limitations and realities. Producers and publishers just don't add as much economic value anymore in the digital age where distribution costs are zero.

I don't disagree with that, the industry has to keep up, and I have no issue with independent artists doing, distributing and producing their own stuff. More power to them, it's what I would do. But none of this happens if they don't get paid. Despite what most folks seem to think it is still not "cheap" to produce a quality product in the music industry. Let's face it, the real money in the music industry is in equipment, and now software.

Also distribution costs are not zero. Someone is paying for it in some fashion or another. iTunes is not free. Placing your song on the interwebs at a reputable site is not free.

I'm afraid that the real solution to this is subscription services like Amazon Music, etc. I hate subscription services but they work when the public no longer wants to pay to own a quality product.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

I pay for music because I have no problem supporting artists I like. If no one buys their music then they make no money and they stop making music. Plus, CDs have better sound quality than digital formats.

As far as making something once and getting paid for a lifetime on it, that's just how the world works. If you mass produce something you get paid every time one of those items is sold, not just once for actually creating the original item. Kraftwerks gets paid for each supercharger that goes out their door, not just the first one they made. Same with music, cars, coffee cups, toothbrushes, whatever.


This is actually super fucking irritating. I've made products purely for me to use to help me do my job better, and somehow these get shared out across the Air Force. A year later at another base, I find the exact same thing: same layouts, same buttons, same formulas, same output products, even down to the same colors used in the same spots, and I get told that someone at that base came up with it. Fucking sure they did.

I've gotten a lot more stingy and controlling about who I even let see my products, much less use them, because I don't get credit for my work. Which sucks, because I'm supposed to be training my subordinates to replace me. They'll have to find their own way; it just won't be as effective or efficient as mine.

It is amazing how that happens.
A lot of my job (yes I work) is writing policies and procedures. Few years back I had an auditor ask for electronic copies so he could review them. Against my better judgment corporate instructed me to send them. Couple of years ago when I started at my current employer I was reviewing the policies and started thinking "damn these look familiar". Checked the author and sure enough there it was "created by Tcoat" (actually says precisely that). This is in a totally different company in a city an hour away from the other! Turns out the auditor was also a "consultant" and he shared my stuff without even changing the documents enough to remove the created by tag.
Mind you it made the transition really easy since I knew exactly what everything said.

[f0rge]

I recently bought a digital copy of Bloddborne for PS4. Should it have been free?

If it was free then how would the people making it get their paychecks?

Similarly, your powerpoints are indirectly making your company money via whatever product or service they sell. If your company gave everything away for free (including your powerpoints), how would you get paid?

[tahdizzle]

I think bloodborne should be free :P

That game has like 0 replay value.

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

I think bloodborne should be free :P

That game has like 0 replay value.

Longer than most games? Check. A more unique and interesting experience than most games? Check. Literally the best PS4 exclusive game outside of The Last of Us Remastered? Check.

You are a fool, sir.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

It is amazing how that happens.
A lot of my job (yes I work) is writing policies and procedures. Few years back I had an auditor ask for electronic copies so he could review them. Against my better judgment corporate instructed me to send them. Couple of years ago when I started at my current employer I was reviewing the policies and started thinking "damn these look familiar". Checked the author and sure enough there it was "created by Tcoat" (actually says precisely that). This is in a totally different company in a city an hour away from the other! Turns out the auditor was also a "consultant" and he shared my stuff without even changing the documents enough to remove the created by tag.
Mind you it made the transition really easy since I knew exactly what everything said.

Makes doing the interview easy.

- Can you give us an example of work you've done in your previous position?
- I wrote all your policies and I don't even work here.

[tahdizzle]

@Sideways&Smiling

You sir, are ignorant.

Did I say that game was bad? No.

Did I say it had 0 replay value? Yes.

Does it have replay value? I guess if you like playing the same thing over, but this time using the sawblade instead of the threaded cane.