For stockish power Nitto NT01's R-Comps overkill?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by glamcem

I have to disagree with "use stock tires " comments, Nitto NT01s are not real R Comp tires..they don't heat cycle out and let go at the limits like the real R comps or slicks, couple laps with the stock tires (or any Summer performance street tires) and they will feel very greasy in other words inconsistent, it's somewhat harder to learn and educate yourself when variables change

They do indeed heat cycle out, if you're driving hard enough.

NT01 are R-compounds, but not slicks.

[Pat]

Yeah, there's no question they heat cycle. Hell, my buddy's wife commented on how drastically different a new set was compared to the old set when she touched them. That should tell you something.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Perhaps a matter of semantics but I think some folks consider an R-Comp something like an RR/R1/R7 where there's no tread blocks for channeling water and they have a better TW rating (Stickier). The NT-01 and RA1 perform better than advertised simply because folks shave them to 4 or 3/32nd's before heading to the track.

R comps are called such because of the softer compound, not the tread design. You're talking about the difference between an R compound tire and a slick.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They do indeed heat cycle out, if you're driving hard enough.

NT01 are R-compounds, but not slicks.

Yes, but will he be able to notice? When I was still green behind the gills I couldn't tell when a tire was cycled out or not and saved a lot of money by buying used take-offs from other racers. So cycling out may not be an issue for him.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Yes, but will he be able to notice? When I was still green behind the gills I couldn't tell when a tire was cycled out or not and saved a lot of money by buying used take-offs from other racers. So cycling out may not be an issue for him.

I'm under the impression that he has a decent amount of seat time, based on the activity I see in the Kraftwerks thread.

Even to novices, going from worn R-comps to fresh R-comps is pretty dramatic

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by wparsons

R comps are called such because of the softer compound, not the tread design. You're talking about the difference between an R compound tire and a slick.

I could see how you would think that but I wasn't doing such. I was specifically discussing R-Comps (AKA: DOT Competition tires). A slick is simply a competition tire that isn't DOT compliant in its markings or design and is not part of the conversation.

An R-Comp is a DOT competition tire regardless of whether or not it has a tread blocks. NT01/RA1/RR/R6/R7/R1.. All R-Comps, but vastly different performance. It's that performance difference that I was referencing. Some folk may feel that the rcomps on the lower end of the performance spectrum aren't really "Rcomps". That was the jist of it.

The NT-01 and the Hoosier R7 are on opposite sides of the performance spectrum of Rcomps:



An R7 is "ready" to race but the RA1/NT-01 aren't, they need to be shaved to be competitive. Since "R-Comp" is a somewhat loose term I think it's acceptable for some people think a tire that meets that definition should be ready to go without needing modification or should be faster than what the lower ends of the spectrum deliver.

I think my other original point stands too; RComps have come a long way in not being so knife edge and harry.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

I'm under the impression that he has a decent amount of seat time, based on the activity I see in the Kraftwerks thread.

Even to novices, going from worn R-comps to fresh R-comps is pretty dramatic

Groovy.

A little off topic on tire talk...

I definitely notice life cycle performance differences with the Hoosiers and Hankooks but with Toyo (Nitto is Toyo btw), their performance life cycle count is so high that many folks are still fast on them down to the cords (the RA1s were like that but recent iterations have not proven to be so). I've burn through 3 sets of RR's, down the cords, and they were every bit as fast on cycle 25 (when corded) than they were on cycle #5 (their fastest). The cycle life of Toyos has really won me over and the fact that the RR is within .1-.2 seconds of an R6 really sold me.

After racing on R6's and RR's I just can't see myself going back to the RA1/NT01 unless it was a spec tire for a class I was in.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Pat

Yeah, there's no question they heat cycle. Hell, my buddy's wife commented on how drastically different a new set was compared to the old set when she touched them. That should tell you something.

Was Your buddy's wife also be able to tell that they perform the best right before you drive them to the cords? that alone is a good indicator that they are not in the same league as the "Real" R comps like the RRs, R6/R7s or the Z214s due to treadwear rating and street-ability, whereas with the "real" R comps with 60 or less TW rating consistency might be an issue, and that is the reason why many people run them down till the cords.. ever looked at the rennlist forums, 911 owners flip them on the wheels and still run them till the cords when they see abnormal wear on in/outside the tire..

there are of course some exceptions like Toyo RRs like @rice_classic mentioned and maybe Z214s( I only had couple sessions on them) this may have to due a lot with the weight of our cars.. I was simply chewing tires when I had my vettes or Evo, luckily our cars are relatively lighter and therefore easier on thetires..


also, tire technology came a long way so there are now hybrid tires where you can benefit of using them as DD (summer of course) and at the track .. look at the new MPSC2 tires that come with the new hypercars damn things are nearly 200 TW rated new Z06, SLS AMG , and supposedly the new GT350 R..all these cars need to be operated at street as well (wet/dry)

... NT01s are more like in the same league with MPSCs, MPSC2, R888s , RA1 (with less tread of course) and one of the most consistent tires for those who want to drive or from tracks..

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They do indeed heat cycle out, if you're driving hard enough.

NT01 are R-compounds, but not slicks.

see my above post

[CSG Mike]

RR's cycle pretty dramatically in my experience.

[jflogerzi]

After reading comments, currently the last several events have been done on MPSS which have a TW of 300. I would rather save these for the street. Would a decent 140-200 TW tire be an improvement but not going as far as an slick/R-Comp?

[Pat]

Are your lap times close to what most instructors would do in your car? If so, and you have an extra set of wheels (or a bunch of money) laying around, get some RS3s or similar. If not, just stick with your current tires. They are spectacular tires. Just because they are street tires doesn't mean they can't be fast.
Once you're driving them at their limit everywhere on the track, get some stickier rubber.
People are frequently concerned about buying things for their cars to lower lap times. I probably had 25 track days under my belt before driving on used RA1s and my lap times immediately dropped by 3 seconds on a very short track. I'm very glad I took the advice of those more experienced than I at the time and did it that way.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by jflogerzi

After reading comments, currently the last several events have been done on MPSS which have a TW of 300. I would rather save these for the street. Would a decent 140-200 TW tire be an improvement but not going as far as an slick/R-Comp?

For learning? 86CUP? Use the contingency tires, so that you qualify to win free tires.

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by jflogerzi

Next season will be a AP BBK in the front.

I'm suggesting you should do the brakes before the tyres.