Scion VP on Jalopnik

[tahdizzle]

Kind of curious. how many ft86s have been sold, year to date?

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

Kind of curious. how many ft86s have been sold, year to date?

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10766

It's a little behind, total numbers as follows in the USA
FR-S: 43,806
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2012/05...s-figures.html
BRZ: 20,235
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2012/05...s-figures.html

Worldwide they surpassed 100,000 units within the past year, initial goals were 100k per year but it seems like reception has been lukewarm in Europe, exact figures aren't known as many regions don't publish them. I would not be confident claiming >160k without some evidence as we near the end of year 3.

On the topic of the engine, I'm personally impressed at what they've done, this engine meets worldwide emissions standards putting out 100hp/l naturally aspirated in an affordable package with economy car fuel economy, that's a goddamn feat of engineering not marketing fucking with you 'holding out for a better model'. If they didn't need D4-S they would have gladly left it off the car and knocked a thousand bucks+ off the sticker, but then we'd be down to the 160 hp range (at that point: Miata). And now we get Subaru Direct Injection turbos, this car was a slam dunk imo, it will be a long time before we see another one.

[juliog]

Sounds like the twins already matched or surpassed the S2000 in lifetime US sales (66K).

2016 should bring a face-lift to the FR-S, same power but maybe revised standard equipment. Then, perhaps another 4 years on sale, to be replaced by a completely new car around 2020.

[Tromatic]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

Kind of curious. how many ft86s have been sold, year to date?

Over 60K by now.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10766

[Tromatic]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

On the topic of the engine, I'm personally impressed at what they've done, this engine meets worldwide emissions standards putting out 100hp/l naturally aspirated in an affordable package with economy car fuel economy, that's a goddamn feat of engineering not marketing fucking with you 'holding out for a better model'. If they didn't need D4-S they would have gladly left it off the car and knocked a thousand bucks+ off the sticker, but then we'd be down to the 160 hp range (at that point: Miata). And now we get Subaru Direct Injection turbos, this car was a slam dunk imo, it will be a long time before we see another one.

Plus Juan. LOL, all facty and shit.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by juliog

Sounds like the twins already matched or surpassed the S2000 in lifetime US sales (66K).

2016 should bring a face-lift to the FR-S, same power but maybe revised standard equipment. Then, perhaps another 4 years on sale, to be replaced by a completely new car around 2020.

They have blown away every Japanese sports car in the past 15 years with regards to production numbers with the sole exception being the first ~3 years of the NB Miata.

inb4 some 4 door sedan or hopped up econobox who's sales numbers are lumped in with the base model (*cough*imprezza*cough*civic*cough*genesis)

[juliog]

350z was arguably more successful. It sold close to 80K units in the US between 2002-2004, and another 80K between 2005-2008. Though the 370z failed spectacularly in terms of sales. It's sad that after 13 years, Nissan still hasn't followed up with a new lightweight RWD platform.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Well said!
Not just a matter of credentials either though. There is also the whole "what are your priorities?" thing going on.
The guy wanting a wild weekend play toy should not be slamming the guy that wants a fuel efficient DD and vice versa. A forum such as this is the very worst place to determine if the "vast majority of owners" want "more power" as it consists of maybe 5% of them and we tend to be the group that leans that way to start with.
It has been said many, many times in threads already but the guys that think they just slap a on turbo on the assembly line and charge you $500 more just don't understand how the auto industry works. The companies exist to make a profit and if there is not enough payback they will not do anything just because a relatively small group wants it.
And for the last time - If they are planning a turbo/higher HP version it is already in the works!

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I know, I know but it just confuses the hell out of me!
Am I, Am I not?
Damn I can't sleep at night anymore!!

Same with the whole more power thing! Sometimes I am all 'this is just perfect" then others all like "well a bit more would be nice"

Doesn't change the fact that they will only make what earns them the cash.
At least there are loads and loads of options out there for anybody that must have more!

Originally Posted by Tromatic

If you read the story of the 86 development, they spent a whole lot of time trying to decide on how much engine it should have. The vast majority of owners are more than happy with the result. Willing to bet that this forum does not even represent 10% of the ownership. If you can turn a profit catering only to 10% of your customers, props to you.

It's a minor miracle this car got built at all. Shit people bitch about is amazing.

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

He has marketing VP replies is what he has. Say what people want to hear but don't really say anything firm!
Being "open" to things does not for one second mean they will do them.
What I tool away from the comments was that there was a lot they may "like" to do but the repeated references to cost and "affordability" seem to cancel out the "likes".

As a marketing professional, this.

This is pretty much the mentality of everyone in marketing/PR. You can't get too mad at marketing and PR folks for always beating around the bush, because they often have to be non-committal for legal reasons. Can't go promising something that hasn't been through all the red tape yet.

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by funwheeldrive

Revised suspension too. It has already been hinted that these cars will get a facelift soon. I'm thinking it will be for the MY16 .

SACHS Dampers FTW!

[Shark_Bait88]

Reading comments on threads like this really speaks to the age, or perhaps the education, of many Toyobaru owners. There seems to be an incredibly poor understanding of how things work within major corporations, who is privy to what sort of information, and how new products are developed/introduced.

There's far too much unfounded speculation and incredibly generalized assumptions based off of societal misconceptions/stuff you might learn in movies.

[tahdizzle]

Originally Posted by Shark_Bait88

Reading comments on threads like this really speaks to the age, or perhaps the education, of many Toyobaru owners. There seems to be an incredibly poor understanding of how things work within major corporations, who is privy to what sort of information, and how new products are developed/introduced.

There's far too much unfounded speculation and incredibly generalized assumptions based off of societal misconceptions/stuff you might learn in movies.

You take that back! Frozen was an awesome movie!

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

You take that back! Frozen was an awesome movie!

Still haven't seen it. I really enjoyed Big Hero 6 though!

But The Great Mouse Detective is still the best Disney movie.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by juliog

350z was arguably more successful. It sold close to 80K units in the US between 2002-2004, and another 80K between 2005-2008. Though the 370z failed spectacularly in terms of sales. It's sad that after 13 years, Nissan still hasn't followed up with a new lightweight RWD platform.

You're right, Nissan's '03 and '04 sales outpaced Toyobaru's '13 & '14
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html

36k & 30k vs. 26k & 21k

And it's likely that the '05 & '06 sales will outpace '15 & '16 but I would expect similar dropoffs. I'm not surprised at all by the Toyobaru's sales trends, the RX-8, S2000, and NC Miata all follow similar trends to the 350Z, and now add the Toyobaru to the dataset.

It's also arguable that Nissan has had any lightweight RWD platforms since the 240sx, at it's lightest the 350z clocks in ~3,200 lbs...

Edit: Also worth noting Nissan had more resources to dump into chassis, suspension, styling and interior as the powertrain is sourced from their trucks and larger sedans/utility vehicles which seemed to fit the American market at the time (muscle car strategy, big beefy utilitarian powertrain stuffed into a small body).