Running E85 without tune and hardware

[Flasher]

So I read through a couple of threads concerning E85 usage and I'm still not sure what the current experience is with this type of fuel.

Apart from my AVO turbo kit, what do I actually need to run E85? Another fuel pump and/or bigger injectors? Other seals and hoses? Is a tune mandatory or not?

Or another question: would I see any performance increases of running E85 on a purely stock 86?

[Freeman]

Why not call and talk to whoever you used to tune your AVO kit?

It seems like the quick and easy way to get the info you want

[Flasher]

As a matter of fact, my tuner offers flex-fuel kits with a specific tune.

But I actually just want to know, if it's safe and beneficial to run E85 on a stock twin.

[Foobar]

No, not good without a tune.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by Flasher

As a matter of fact, my tuner offers flex-fuel kits with a specific tune.

But I actually just want to know, if it's safe and beneficial to run E85 on a stock twin.

Which is it, a stock 86 or one with an AVO turbo kit? For either, a tune is absolutely necessary if you're to run E85. If you're running a turbo, you'll very likely need bigger injectors/tune.

[Flasher]

Originally Posted by Foobar

No, not good without a tune.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

See, that's also my understanding but ppl like Shiv tell you it actually doesn't matter, because even the stock ECU is capable of adjusting for E85.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

[Fred E]

Originally Posted by Flasher

See, that's also my understanding but ppl like Shiv tell you it actually doesn't matter, because even the stock ECU is capable of adjusting for E85.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

He is definitely not saying it's okay to run E85 with a 91/93 tune. He's saying it's okay to run anywhere from E60~E85 (maybe less than E60, but definitely not E10) on an E85 tune because the ECU can adjust (to an extent) for the difference in ethanol concentration.

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash

Of course, I don't recommend testing an E85 tune on straight 91 gasoline. Not only would it take a good amount of time for the ECU to make that big of a LTFT adjustment, it would also result in knock retard (from the aggressive timing maps) when it finally does. So my suggestion is to keep the fuel mix between E50 and E90 which is well beyond the range you would see at the E85 pump.

The reverse (running E85 on a 91/93 tune) is also true (to an extent). Whatever tuning solution you plan on using, an E85 tune is pretty much required to run E85, or things are just not going to work properly (leaving power on the table, knock/retarded timing, reduced gas mileage, etc.)

[raven1231]

Originally Posted by Flasher

See, that's also my understanding but ppl like Shiv tell you it actually doesn't matter, because even the stock ECU is capable of adjusting for E85.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

Yes it says it is with an e85 tune

[texasbound972]

Www.Delicioustuning.com

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Flasher

See, that's also my understanding but ppl like Shiv tell you it actually doesn't matter, because even the stock ECU is capable of adjusting for E85.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

The ecu programming or tune needs to change not the ECU.

you dont need a flex fuel kit but it does make changing fuels easier and safer but you can run e85 on a stock car with just an appropiate tune if you follow a few simple steps.

see below

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67310


.

[DesertFrs]

Originally Posted by Flasher

So I read through a couple of threads concerning E85 usage and I'm still not sure what the current experience is with this type of fuel.

Apart from my AVO turbo kit, what do I actually need to run E85? Another fuel pump and/or bigger injectors? Other seals and hoses? Is a tune mandatory or not?

Or another question: would I see any performance increases of running E85 on a purely stock 86?

Originally Posted by Flasher

As a matter of fact, my tuner offers flex-fuel kits with a specific tune.

But I actually just want to know, if it's safe and beneficial to run E85 on a stock twin.

Originally Posted by Flasher

See, that's also my understanding but ppl like Shiv tell you it actually doesn't matter, because even the stock ECU is capable of adjusting for E85.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53477

Flasher. All you need to run E85 is a tune. Stock fuel pump and injectors can handle E85. Stock Pump and Injectors can handle about 10-12 psi. I ran stock Injectors and fuel pump on E85 daily for 7k miles. Had no issues. I then upgraded injectors and fuel pump because I wanted more power. Just get yourself a tune. I used Map 1 and 2 for 91Oct and Map 3-4 for E85. I'm gonna be using Delicious Tuning Flex Fuel kit in the months to come. Wish this information helped. Plus E85 really wakes up the AVO kit.

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by Flasher

So I read through a couple of threads concerning E85 usage and I'm still not sure what the current experience is with this type of fuel.

Apart from my AVO turbo kit, what do I actually need to run E85?

A tune to account for the additional fueling requirements (+35% on avg) and potentially fuel system upgrades.

Originally Posted by Flasher

Another fuel pump and/or bigger injectors?

Depends on your current fuel system capacity. If you are already boosted, your kit will determine if you need to upgrade the pump and injectors. Talk to whomever you got the kit from.

Originally Posted by Flasher

Other seals and hoses?

no

Originally Posted by Flasher

Is a tune mandatory or not?

yes, if you want the car to run correctly

Originally Posted by Flasher

Or another question: would I see any performance increases of running E85 on a purely stock 86?

Yes, about 10 - 15% power and and torque gain.

[GotBRZ1691]

I have been running shivs tune on my car which is basically stock for about 5k miles. You will see an increase in power for sure, even when using stock header. You will see a decrease in MPGs but E85 is cheaper per gallon.

One thing I did not see mentioned in this thread was engine oil. If you switch to E85 you should switch your oil to something more E85 compatible. There are multiply threads to read on this topic to come to a conclusion. If you still use factory oil it would be a good idea to cut your service interval in half.

[DeliciousTuning]

Originally Posted by Flasher

So I read through a couple of threads concerning E85 usage and I'm still not sure what the current experience is with this type of fuel.

Apart from my AVO turbo kit, what do I actually need to run E85? Another fuel pump and/or bigger injectors? Other seals and hoses? Is a tune mandatory or not?

Or another question: would I see any performance increases of running E85 on a purely stock 86?

A little more info:

E85 is a fuel (with a similar octane level to 105). The ECU can be tuned to run E85 with any tuning system and will adjust correctly when tuned currently and there is definitely more power potential from running E85 on a tuned vehicle at the expense of MPG. The drawback is when switching between fuels you will need to switch maps in order to adjust for the fuel differences. Switching to which map is where is start to get a little more complicated but can be worked out usually with 4 simple maps (what we suggest), 2 transition maps, 91 octane map and an E85 map.

FlexFuel is a mechanical/electrical system in the vehicle that communicates with the ECU to provide proper ethanol content for people that switch between fuels easily. Basically once the FlexFuel system is installed you can fill up at any gas station with 91 or E85 at any time with any combination and the ECU (using EcuTeK and RaceROM) will auto adjust the timing, fueling, cams, boost for your vehicle.

Cheers,
William Knose
Delicious Tuning