Stage 2 Cosworth Kit Preview!!!!

[weederr33]

[QUOTE=Model Citizen;2007950]

Outside of the bluetooth, usb port and direct injection do you see anything that didn't exist in the 90s?


Scion.

[Model Citizen]

Originally Posted by abraxis

FTFU

Btw, backup cameras with screens are about to become mandated federal safety equipment. So those 'features' are moot based on your own argument.

If you want to shave $2K-$3K off the price of a BRZ/FRS, ask them to make it in the USA and take your chances with all that brings.

I believe i was deepthroating honda also sir.

[s0sl0w]

I honestly have no doubt that this is an excellent kit. And I don't have a problem with how it's priced.

But here is the reality:

6.5K for an extra ~45whp, 6.5k to just break 200 whp. Even if the 60 hp gain is measured wheel hp that is still 6.5k to hit ~230 whp.

Meanwhile the Innovative kit (and all it's problems) sells for ~2.5k less and makes just as much power.

The Jackson Racing kit and Kraftwerks kit bill out for ~1.5K less and push out ~250+ whp.

We won't even discuss turbo kits.

Personally, I'm not even a little interested in a positive displacement, fall on it's face at high rpms, supercharger. So yes, the Cosworth name is nice, and if that's important to you, then buy on. For me, I want something that preserves the high rpm nature of the car and gets me to 250 wheel for my 5k.

[ATL BRZ]

Originally Posted by s0sl0w

I honestly have no doubt that this is an excellent kit. And I don't have a problem with how it's priced.

But here is the reality:

6.5K for an extra ~45whp, 6.5k to just break 200 whp. Even if the 60 hp gain is measured wheel hp that is still 6.5k to hit ~230 whp.

Meanwhile the Innovative kit (and all it's problems) sells for ~2.5k less and makes just as much power.

The Jackson Racing kit and Kraftwerks kit bill out for ~1.5K less and push out ~250+ whp.

We won't even discuss turbo kits.

Personally, I'm not even a little interested in a positive displacement, fall on it's face at high rpms, supercharger. So yes, the Cosworth name is nice, and if that's important to you, then buy on. For me, I want something that preserves the high rpm nature of the car and gets me to 250 wheel for my 5k.

Agreed.

[qqfob]

I just got the email from Cosworth.

Stage 2 is +60hp on stock exhaust retails $6495
Stage 2.3 is +80hp, which includes the full 1.3 kit, retails $10745

All together, you get 280hp at the crank, and even with weight increased to 2800lb, you are looking at 10:1 weight/hp.

Lets say you take what I have, which is a fully loaded Blue Series, priced at $29,500, add the Cosworth on it $10,745, you get car with (95) RX7 speed at $40k. Totally worth it in my opinion considering I have more luxuries, still much better reliability, and much cheaper if you account for inflation.

As far as fall on it's face s/c, you don't know that yet as there are still no dyno charts. However, I have been told that the charger itself is good for the 380hp that Cosworth will ultimately put out.

[qqfob]

And the debate on gimmicks, I totally agree there is quite a lot out. It makes the cars heavier, more expensive to repair, and ultimately make the driver ever so dumber. I considered a RCF, but do I need the 450hp just to power 4000lb, much of which is the sound system and power seats. I'm the only driver. Blind spot monitoring is useless and junk in my opinion, and the active rear wing really isn't all that flattering, even if carbon. Sorry, I'd pick the BRZ over it any day.

[Deep Six]

I am really struggling to connect the potential of 380 ?hp with the advertised gains that really have to be described as meager compared to other FI offerings. Exactly what is missing to go from stage 2(260hp) to 380?


Unlike some others I would be very interested in a PD unit if it could continue to build power up to 6K (ala ZR1) and kick hard down low like a GT28. Countless 7.5K shifts at the track will take its toll eventually.


I personally couldn't care less about the exclusivity of the Cosworth name, I don't go to Cars n Coffee(my car is used, bruised and abused) and at the end of the day its still a BRZ/FRS minus powertrain warranty that no exotic car owner will care about. I do understand Cosworth heritage and reputation but that does not necessarily diminish alternative offerings with less costly price points, many of which are showing excellent sustained reliability on track and off. Unless I am missing something I don't believe that Cosworth is replicating the Calloway and Dinan business model of replacing your factory warranty with their own.

[abraxis]

Originally Posted by Deep Six

Exactly what is missing to go from stage 2(260hp) to 380?

New pulley, internals and remap if I had to guess.

[qqfob]

We can only guess that stage 3 is a complete long block. Seeing from some of the builds we have here, 380hp is completely possible.

Who knows, maybe if you did buy a complete longblock and run all the Cosworth parts, if you do have an engine failure they will swap you an engine. Just maybe

[xwd]

Originally Posted by abraxis

New pulley, internals and remap if I had to guess.

I think it might involve a different supercharger. I kind of doubt the 900 is good for 380hp even on E85.

[Insurme1]

Originally Posted by Supercharged

Problem is this crowd isn't the F1 crowd swimming in cash. This is a 25k car. If you have that much money, why even bother with the 86? Go get your exotic. Cosworth is a great name, but this is the wrong car/crowd to be working with.

The OP asked for thoughts and opinions and people are voicing. Yes, this is highly overpriced and a turbo with internals will still be better than this when it comes to money well spent.

Dude you're not the only type of owner for this car. I happen to own it and have this Stage 1.3 kit. Love that Cosworth brings their expertise to this platform.

[Insurme1]

Originally Posted by qqfob

I'm getting tired of every single thread being over run by price complaints. Someone needs to set you all straight.

First of all Cosworth is a company that has a name, a heritage, and a history. They are a company with over 50 years of high performance research and development competing, and winning, in the best of anything automotive. Their win list surpasses just about every aftermarket BRZ parts makers/manufacturers combined, and more than Subaru and Toyota combined.

Heritage. Pull up to any exoticar car meet, race event, any rallies, and you might get a look or two at your $25k car... until someone notices your Cosworth badge. That guy in the Mclaren, he knows. Heck, he might even buy his own BRZ/FRS because of the Cosworth name. I would.

They have spent countless hours on the developement of all these parts and before anybody even has a chance to purchase anything you kids are shooting them down because of something as petty as their pricing. They don't need to discount anything for your guys because their research and developement doesn't stop at 40hrs/week. Any and all of their parts are run on their engine dyno relentlessly, their parts hitting easily 60k, 120k, even 300k miles on the dyno before rumors of it even spreads. And it doesn't stop with their parts, as you can bet the dyno tuning maps follow the same R&D procedures. I don't know about you, but I rather have a tuning map that isn't programmed in a "rush" 3 hour scenerio. or even 8 hour, 16 hour.

Cosworth currently has a contract with Nameless to produce their exhaust parts. As far as headers go, they are the same. However many of you think Cosworth just rebadged the Nameless items and charge more, but I'm not so sure you can draw that conclusion. Nameless had a different header design prior to the Cosworth collabration, more than likely, Cosworth provided their expertise in the design of the new, or current, Nameless product. From Cosworth, it does cost more but again it comes with the proper tuning.

With that said, I'd appreciate it if this thread is not hijacked by off topic $$ complaints, instead, we can discuss the engineering, eye candy, exclusivity, etc of Cosworth engineered parts.

Well said bro! I totally agree with you. It's sometimes hard to have good knowledgeable discussion here because of the hijacks and insults. I've been waiting on the the details of Stage 2 for a while and can't wait to get it. Have Stage 1.3 now and love it.

[Styx]

here are the dyno numbers for the stage 2 and with stage 1.3
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/to...eo-88493.html#

[Calum]

Originally Posted by Styx

here are the dyno numbers for the stage 2 and with stage 1.3
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/to...eo-88493.html#

For the lazy