Sticky tires still progressive?

[pseudo]

I am considering moving up to some 17x9 +35s for street use and mild autocross/hpde. However, I am just looking to have fun, not necessarily put up competitive times.

What I love about this car is that when the rear comes around, it does so in such a slow, and progressive fashion. It makes it super easy for a beginner like me to find where the limit is, while not punishing me if I push too hard.

Will upgrading to wider/stickier tires change that progressive nature of oversteer in this car? I feel like the added grip would make it easier to pull the tail back in, but I have never driven a car with good rubber.

[murdoc]

With stickier tires the car will let go at higher speeds, and likely with less tire noise as warning before hand, so everything will be happening much faster.

The stock tires have a habit of screeching at the limit that is very reassuring.

What type of tires are you considering?

[pseudo]

I've heard good things about Hancook Ventus R-S3's. Preferably something sticky but with decent treadware.

[continuecrushing]

Originally Posted by pseudo

I've heard good things about Hancook Ventus R-S3's. Preferably something sticky but with decent treadware.

where are you located? Is this a DD?

If you're looking to have fun, there are other tires that still grip well, but will last quite a bit longer than the RS3's

[pseudo]

Originally Posted by Shutter

where are you located? Is this a DD?

I DD my 86 in southern new hampshire. Got a nice snowy winter inbound!

Originally Posted by Shutter

If you're looking to have fun, there are other tires that still grip well, but will last quite a bit longer than the RS3's

I am all ears for tire suggestions!

[continuecrushing]

do you still have stock wheels? I'd maybe keep those and throw some winter tires on there.

For the 17x9's, "good" tires are subjective

But,
Michelin Pilot Super Sport
Continental Extreme Contact
Hankook Evo V12 2
BF Goodrich Gforce sport comp 2
Dunlop DZ102
Bridgestone RE760
Dunlop Sportmaxx RT
Potenza S-04
Dunlop ZII Star Spec
Bridgestone RE-11a
Kumho Ecsta XS
and I'm sure I missed a few

Some of those are better, some are worse...what size tire were you gonna run? Budget? How long do you want/need them to last? Looking for a max performance/summer tire? or something that can take some rain/weather?

Obviously any of the tires I just listed would be HORRIBLE to use in the snow/dangerous.

[pseudo]

I am keeping the stock wheels to use solely in the winter with yoko ice grips

For the 17x9 I was thinking of running 245s on a lightly modified suspension - koni/rce tarmacs, bushings, maybe sway bars/lca's

I guess that my first priority in a summer tire would be treadlife. I'm not sure what a realistic number is, but if I could get 10k out of a tire with decent grip I would be happy.

Would you guys recommend big wheels and sticky tires for a beginner? I have read that sticky tires have a tendency to mask underlying problems when driving at the limit.

I keep flip flopping between upgrading or keeping the stock rims for another year, but the itch to mod is upon me and I figured that you need to pair your spring rates/sway stiffness with the level of grip you have. Not sure if it makes sense to keep the oem rubber when I plan on upgrading eventually.

[Texas BRZ]

Originally Posted by pseudo

I am keeping the stock wheels to use solely in the winter with yoko ice grips

For the 17x9 I was thinking of running 245s on a lightly modified suspension - koni/rce tarmacs, bushings, maybe sway bars/lca's

I guess that my first priority in a summer tire would be treadlife. I'm not sure what a realistic number is, but if I could get 10k out of a tire with decent grip I would be happy.

Would you guys recommend big wheels and sticky tires for a beginner? I have read that sticky tires have a tendency to mask underlying problems when driving at the limit.

I keep flip flopping between upgrading or keeping the stock rims for another year, but the itch to mod is upon me and I figured that you need to pair your spring rates/sway stiffness with the level of grip you have. Not sure if it makes sense to keep the oem rubber when I plan on upgrading eventually.

I'm not a fan of bigger wheels. In my opinion, the stock wheels and tires are fantastic in regards to my prior experience.

Sticky tires may help with the speed / grip for this car, but the stock tires w/ stock wheels definitely have the fun and learning factor as an ace up the sleeve. They have a good amount of life as well, with a combination of both track and daily time.

Looks like you got it covered with the appropriate tires when icy weather approaches though.

[DarkSunrise]

When I switched from 215-width Sumi HTR ZIII to 235-width Nitto NT05, it did lose some of that progressiveness. Not a whole lot, but enough to be noticeable.

But the bigger difference is how much less audible the NT05's are. They won't squeal to tell you you're approaching the limit, just howl when you get there.

The NT05's are definitely the stickier tire when warm and hold up to track abuse better, but if you want a very progressive tire, I'd recommend the Sumi's. To me, they feel more progressive than even the stock Turanzas, despite having more grip.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by pseudo

and I figured that you need to pair your spring rates/sway stiffness with the level of grip you have.

This is not necessary for the twins. Stock suspension and sway bars work well with stickier tires. Twin's designers knew that a lot of people will upgrade their tires. There was a relevant test video from tire rack. Of course, in this test they went 1-2 sizes up (18" wheels and 225 width if I recall correctly).

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by pseudo

Would you guys recommend big wheels and sticky tires for a beginner?

I keep flip flopping between upgrading or keeping the stock rims for another year, but the itch to mod is upon me and I figured that you need to pair your spring rates/sway stiffness with the level of grip you have. Not sure if it makes sense to keep the oem rubber when I plan on upgrading eventually.

Not really. Driver mod is always the primary mod. Not the first mod - the primary, on-going mod.

Why not spend the money instead on (more) seat time at autocrosses and on track time at Loudon or Lime Rock. You'll have just as much fun and will have more seat time under your belt when you finally upgrade.

BTW, I run 245s on my 318 RWHP fully-built race car. If performance is the main driver of a tire size change, you'll probably not need 245s without major mods to the car, or possibly for max performance at autocrossing.

[pseudo]

Originally Posted by dradernh

Not really. Driver mod is always the primary mod. Not the first mod - the primary, on-going mod.

Why not spend the money instead on (more) seat time at autocrosses and on track time at Loudon or Lime Rock. You'll have just as much fun and will have more seat time under your belt when you finally upgrade.

Unfortunately, I have yet to autocross. I am terrified of a freak accident hurting my car and insurance denying a claim. Once my loan is paid down a bit more, I plan to start autoX. In the mean time I am just planning on doing some insured HPDE's next summer.

Maybe my fear is unjustified, but I have heard of accidents happening at autoX and I don't have the funds to eat the cost of a new car. Endangering public safety on canyon roads seems to be the safer solution for the time being.

In a perfect world, I would stay stock for a bit while hitting up every auto/rally cross event I could find. The funds I don't spend on that will be going to mods of one kind or another, though - for the time being.

[Akari]

This is part of the reason why I decided to go with Michelin Pilot Super Sports. They're quite close to the OEM tires in progressiveness but offer quite a bit more overall traction. They don't scream as loud as the stock tires by any means but the progressiveness is still very much there.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by pseudo

Endangering public safety on canyon roads seems to be the safer solution for the time being.

This got a genuine laugh from me, thanks.


I agree that insurance is more likely to cover an accident on a public road, but autoX or HPDE really is safer. It's a controlled environment with a known road surface and known traffic conditions. You're not going to come around a blind turn on a track and come face-to-face with a group of cyclists going 3mph across the full lane. Nor are you going to come around a corner to find that large rocks have fallen across the roadway.