Subaru's FT-86 Version still alive and coming confirms Automotive News

[C-Bone]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

iirc Subaru said they gonna work on Hybrid ver around 2013ish (someone posted that news while ago)... so every online auto news f'ckers write "Toyota delays FT86 to 2013 and it'll be hybrid" without confirming w Toyota. Then Toyota official said/write "FU, online auto news f'ckers! Who said we gonna delay it til 2013? That's Subaru and not us. We're still aiming to release at 2011." (my ver of Toyota official translation lol)

Just all those online and mag writer need to get the info straight

Tru dat peeps

[DantKR]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

but WRX isn't coupe.

But again, making the FT AWD would kind of cancel out the entire point that they were trying to achieve with this project. And adding in a AWD system would add quite a few lbs wouldn't it? I wasn't able to find out exactly how much subys AWD system weighs in comparison to a RWD system so I can't come up with a really good comparison.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by DantKR

But again, making the FT AWD would kind of cancel out the entire point that they were trying to achieve with this project. And adding in a AWD system would add quite a few lbs wouldn't it? I wasn't able to find out exactly how much subys AWD system weighs in comparison to a RWD system so I can't come up with a really good comparison.

Achieve what? They can use same chassis and other parts, just tranny & engine mount have few mods. Isn't that good enough? It's not like Toyota or Subaru gonna loose profit. As long as they both use same exact chassis and other parts then it's both win win situation. IDK what they gonna be loosing.

As for Subaru's AWD system prob weight less than 100lbs (STI 6sp tranny & cv axle shafts vs Aisen Tranny).

[Allch Chcar]

The problem isn't weight alone. If they made it AWD there would be more weight up front and the engine would need to be mounted higher to allow for the front driveshaft to go into the center of the front axle. The whole front subframe would need to be different. Not stating their reasoning, just my humble opinion.


If you want an AWD coupe why are you so interested in the Ft-86? There has been nothing about this car that says it will be AWD other than the nonstop input from Subaru fans. You can wish upon your stars but we'll see.


@ 2jz-gte4life
Maybe you just need a better RWD car for winter .

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

The problem isn't weight alone. If they made it AWD there would be more weight up front and the engine would need to be mounted higher to allow for the front driveshaft to go into the center of the front axle. The whole front subframe would need to be different. Not stating their reasoning, just my humble opinion.

Matador, where was that Legacy GT pic went? If they do that design, it might work w current FT86 design.

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

If you want an AWD coupe why are you so interested in the Ft-86? There has been nothing about this car that says it will be AWD other than the nonstop input from Subaru fans. You can wish upon your stars but we'll see.

Who said I only want AWD coupe? I don't care Toyota & Subaru ver only came in RWD. I'll be happy for both of em. I'm just putting out the possibility.

[70NYD]

i still think that they will both be (if ever released) the same configuration. thats what badge engineering is about. just a few different pannels difference.. changing the basic components like drivetrain layout which leads to a different engine position, differnt gearbox and different parts used through out is not what a joint venture is at all. thats making two seperate cars loosely based on each other
if the subaru version has AWD (just for example) then it would need a new floor plan, new vehicle dynamics as the weight is in different places, new suspension design. new everything except for the doors and roof.. that would be a whole new car..

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by 70NYD

i still think that they will both be (if ever released) the same configuration. thats what badge engineering is about. just a few different pannels difference.. changing the basic components like drivetrain layout which leads to a different engine position, differnt gearbox and different parts used through out is not what a joint venture is at all. thats making two seperate cars loosely based on each other
if the subaru version has AWD (just for example) then it would need a new floor plan, new vehicle dynamics as the weight is in different places, new suspension design. new everything except for the doors and roof.. that would be a whole new car..

what dynamics? Weight in different places? What, it's not like we have put bigger engine before? Look at current Legacy. You have option of Base model - 2.5 Liter H4 NA. GT - 2.5 Liter H4 Turbo. 3.6R - 3.6 Liter H6 NA. 3.6 Liter vs 2.5 Liter w 2 extra cylinder weight on the front isn't changing dynamic of the weight in different places? Toyota is well know to put bigger engines (Lexus IS 2.5 Liter v6 & 5 Liter v8).

Another example for tranny: Acura TL. Current TL have option of FWD or AWD (technical term SH-AWD). Isn't that change the floor plan? In Toyota they do it too (they're well known for it). GS, IS, and lists goes on and on. What's happening to their suspension designs? I don't see much different in suspension set up on RWD vs AWD.

Look at most of Lexus that has RWD & AWD. Their performance lack cuz of engine is mounted way in front? I don't think so. Look at Lexus IS-F, they're not FMR set-up. They're just FR, but they sure kicking @ss in some of the events.

Yes, I do agree, and want FT86 to have engine lay around middle to make it FMR & I do agree w a lot of stuff you have pointed out. BUT that doesn't mean you can /thread saying "Oh it's impossible" or "It'll mess w floor plan" and other stuff. We haven't fully seen the blue print or even under the hood. They still have time to do what ever they want. When they show the final production design from both Toyota & Subaru w whole entire chassis & under the hood design THEN we can say all those stuff.

[70NYD]

acura tl is a transverse mounted engine so the floor plan can be used easily on both FWD and AWD (with no need to move the engine further back the tunnel doesnt change much, jsut has to be bigger to accomodate the prop in AWD and be biger fo no reason on the FWD..) legacy is not a "performance" car its a saloon and its hardly a agile car
with a change in the engine there comes a change in suspension (not the arrangement of suspension but rates for springs and different jounce settings)
i dont think you understood what i said. and if this car comes with AWD from subi it will also come as a AWD from toyota. both models will be same is what i was getting at. one will not be prefered over the other, otherwise its not a joint venture like it has been claimed from the start.. thats just my point of view.
and ofcourse cars that have overhung engines can perform well.. doesnt matter where the engine is it will perform well, but take that IS-F and fabricate the brackets that will make the engine sit as far back and down as possible (possibly modifing the firewall and tunnel, run a dry sump system with a ultra low profile sump) have properly setup suspension and watch the handling improve.. thats what i was getting at mate
dont think i expressed my self properly 1st time around

[Snaps]

I think what he's trying to say that, if the Subaru version is AWD, and the Toyota version is RWD, at the very least the Toyota version will have the same indents in the floor pan for the room the AWD system would usually take up.

Because it's a Boxer engine, it's probably already mounted very low, so if an AWD system was added, the engine would have to be raised, and then the trans and floorpan would have to be raised, along with all of the rear diff positioning, to make room for the front driveshaft and front diff underneath the engine.

And I very much doubt this.... If the Toyota version is already being designed for RWD, the engine WILL be mounted low, and the Trans, and the diff will be mounted low. It would not be cost-effective for subaru to make the necessary modifications to make it an AWD.

[70NYD]

Originally Posted by Snaps

I think what he's trying to say that, if the Subaru version is AWD, and the Toyota version is RWD, at the very least the Toyota version will have the same indents in the floor pan for the room the AWD system would usually take up.

Because it's a Boxer engine, it's probably already mounted very low, so if an AWD system was added, the engine would have to be raised, and then the trans and floorpan would have to be raised, along with all of the rear diff positioning, to make room for the front driveshaft and front diff underneath the engine.

And I very much doubt this.... If the Toyota version is already being designed for RWD, the engine WILL be mounted low, and the Trans, and the diff will be mounted low. It would not be cost-effective for subaru to make the necessary modifications to make it an AWD.

exactly what i was trying to say, summed up much more nicely but
cheers

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Snaps

I think what he's trying to say that, if the Subaru version is AWD, and the Toyota version is RWD, at the very least the Toyota version will have the same indents in the floor pan for the room the AWD system would usually take up.

Because it's a Boxer engine, it's probably already mounted very low, so if an AWD system was added, the engine would have to be raised, and then the trans and floorpan would have to be raised, along with all of the rear diff positioning, to make room for the front driveshaft and front diff underneath the engine.

And I very much doubt this.... If the Toyota version is already being designed for RWD, the engine WILL be mounted low, and the Trans, and the diff will be mounted low. It would not be cost-effective for subaru to make the necessary modifications to make it an AWD.

Never seen this Legacy before?


This that low enough?


and yes, it's AWD (but they changed it to FR mid of last yr).

Yes, I know it's GT cars, so of course it has ridiculous amount of tuning on it. But that doesn't mean they're not using some of the technology.

What make it "It would not be cost-effective for subaru to make the necessary modifications to make it an AWD."? Just say Toyota sell theirs for $22k-ish and Subaru sold theirs for $27k. $5k more to add the technology they used on Legacy B4. Is it worth it? IDK

edit: Before you guys get upset or anything. I'm just debating this topic, cuz everyone say "It's RWD only", so I'm just been the black-sleep of the group to say "It's possible to have AWD". I'm not saying they WILL have AWD. Just saying it's not impossible to make it AWD

[C-Bone]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Never seen this Legacy before?

haha, Legacy before - Legacy B4 (on the drivers door). sorry im tired, made me chuckle a bit

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Snaps

I think what he's trying to say that, if the Subaru version is AWD, and the Toyota version is RWD, at the very least the Toyota version will have the same indents in the floor pan for the room the AWD system would usually take up.

Because it's a Boxer engine, it's probably already mounted very low, so if an AWD system was added, the engine would have to be raised, and then the trans and floorpan would have to be raised, along with all of the rear diff positioning, to make room for the front driveshaft and front diff underneath the engine.

And I very much doubt this.... If the Toyota version is already being designed for RWD, the engine WILL be mounted low, and the Trans, and the diff will be mounted low. It would not be cost-effective for subaru to make the necessary modifications to make it an AWD.

Also with the Subaru AWD system, the entire motor must be forward of the front axles. This is the biggest issue that I see. In the FT/R-86/S the motor will likely be completely behind the front axles for balance (look at the design very forward wheels with little front overhang).

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by C-Bone

haha, Legacy before - Legacy B4 (on the drivers door). sorry im tired, made me chuckle a bit

and now, it's SUPER Legacy. lol

Originally Posted by Dimman

Also with the Subaru AWD system, the entire motor must be forward of the front axles. This is the biggest issue that I see. In the FT/R-86/S the motor will likely be completely behind the front axles for balance (look at the design very forward wheels with little front overhang).

It's can be done, just like that legacy I posted. Engine is way way way behind the front axle w way way way low to the ground. Before they made it into FR, it was AWD.