Open Source Electric Supercharger

[rusty959]

Originally Posted by neutron256

Building this compressor design may be easier then I was expecting. I ordered a collet style prop adapter. It's almost perfect. The only real problem is that the nut is right hand thread so I would need to make sure it doesn't loosen with use. Maybe a castle nut and lock wire or cotter pin.

With this one I would also need to make a custom washer to make sure the wheel is centered on the shaft. I'm looking for a version with an M10 thread that will fit the 10mm hole.

I've even got an idea for mounting the motor that should be pretty simple, but I need to fully disassemble the compressor firts which requires some speciality tools which I just ordered.

A cotter pin/wire will just be more to throw the assembly off balance. Some max strength threadlocker will probably do the job fine.

[AN]

Ahan .. missed the outrunner part .. here is the in-runner version.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...watt_12s_.html

This one has slightly lower rpms but higher thrust ... I am guessing it has higer torque numbers .... suited for your new larger fan.

[neutron256]

Originally Posted by rusty959

A cotter pin/wire will just be more to throw the assembly off balance. Some max strength threadlocker will probably do the job fine.

I had the same thought, for some reason I never completely trust loctite. I always want a more visibly solid solution. But it might be the right answer for this application.

[AN]

found another charger/isolator for 24v setup. Not much cheaper but a lot more compact. Roughly 4X4X2 inches.

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/r...r-combiner.htm

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/r...lator-inst.pdf

Also, found this company neu motors that make high power DC motors. The have some nice gear drives too. But from the language, it looks like they are step down gears ...

[neutron256]

Originally Posted by AN

found another charger/isolator for 24v setup. Not much cheaper but a lot more compact. Roughly 4X4X2 inches.

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/r...r-combiner.htm

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/r...lator-inst.pdf

Also, found this company neu motors that make high power DC motors. The have some nice gear drives too. But from the language, it looks like they are step down gears ...

Nice find, however I think this is just an isolator that will work with 12V or 24V systems not a mix of voltages. I could be wrong, but that's how it reads to me, and it looks way to small to do this sort of step-up charging at 25 amps. I'd love to be wrong because this would be a great compact charging solution.

Neu motors are top notch from what I understand. You can buy them from Castel Creations http://www.castlecreations.com/
I've been looking at a few of their motors, but yes they are very expensive. The motor I was looking at would be almost $800.

[AN]

Originally Posted by neutron256

Nice find, however I think this is just an isolator that will work with 12V or 24V systems not a mix of voltages. I could be wrong, but that's how it reads to me, and it looks way to small to do this sort of step-up charging at 25 amps. I'd love to be wrong because this would be a great compact charging solution.

Neu motors are top notch from what I understand. You can buy them from Castel Creations http://www.castlecreations.com/
I've been looking at a few of their motors, but yes they are very expensive. The motor I was looking at would be almost $800.

You might be correct. I scanned through the PDF and could not see the 2 batteries connected in series anywhere.

Also, is Rob charging his batteries @ 12v or 24V ?

I was looking at the compressor map of his TQ250 and looks like his motor is running at above 37k rpm. Any idea what kind of motor he is using ?

Also, have you looked into using a hobby ESC for controlling the motor at a variable speed and if so which one. (apologies if it has been covered).

The more I look for a reasonable motor, more it becomes apparent that we should raise the voltage to 36V ... higer rpm and lower current. Unless we can find an off the shelf motor for this very purpose.

[AN]

Originally Posted by neutron256

Neu motors are top notch from what I understand. You can buy them from Castel Creations http://www.castlecreations.com/
I've been looking at a few of their motors, but yes they are very expensive. The motor I was looking at would be almost $800.

Which motor are you looking at ?

[neutron256]

Originally Posted by AN

You might be correct. I scanned through the PDF and could not see the 2 batteries connected in series anywhere.

Also, is Rob charging his batteries @ 12v or 24V ?

I was looking at the compressor map of his TQ250 and looks like his motor is running at above 37k rpm. Any idea what kind of motor he is using ?

Also, have you looked into using a hobby ESC for controlling the motor at a variable speed and if so which one. (apologies if it has been covered).

The more I look for a reasonable motor, more it becomes apparent that we should raise the voltage to 36V ... higer rpm and lower current. Unless we can find an off the shelf motor for this very purpose.

Originally Posted by AN

Which motor are you looking at ?

The phantom supercharger uses a 24V charging system. From what I gather Rob hast tested a 36V system but found 24V to be much more practical. I think Rob is getting around 40K RPM. He's supposedly using a custom motor. Just how custom, and where he gets them from I have no idea.

I am using a hobby ESC and one of the key things I want is variable speed and a system that doesn't use a mechanical switch connected to the accelerator. Right now my plan is to tap into the 0-5V signal from the Throttle Position Sensor. I have a few of them I'm testing but for now I'm using the Turnigy Fatboy V2 300A controller. http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...15S_OPTO_.html This way the system is scalable if I want to go with higher voltages or more current. Larger also means less heat issues.

There are a couple of motors I want to test with the SeaDoo (Rotax) compressor I'm currently building. Because it has a much larger impeller it should need less speed then the Phantom SC but more torque. In general I would say the motor needs to be capable of at least 4000W and speed is really dependent on the compressor being used.

Turnigy AquaStar T20 (currently owned)
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ess_Motor.html

Turnigy CL580L-870 (on backorder)
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...m_Fan_5kw.html

I really want to stick to a 24V system because it will mean a much more compact system and cleaner install. I'm not looking for every bit of power possible from this, just a nice on demand boost.

[AN]

3500 total watt but plenty of rpm .. specially at 26V.
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1-8-R...441218734.html

This thing is pretty powerful too...
http://www.rclander.com/default.aspx...2-18c15b54e69b

I found this really powerfull truggy motor ... cant find too many specs though ... By basic calculations ... this thing should have a max V of around 44v.
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1-5-s...620153973.html

another link :
http://www.rovanrc.com/Brushless_100...SC_p/rv137.htm

appears to be a leopard hobby motor.
Robs motor is 3500W btw.

------

sorry for all the edits .. but leopard hobby appears to have so many .. with a lot of power ... with High KV
http://www.leopardhobby.com/proviewe...=1&gid=65&pt=3
check their larger sized motors too ...

[AN]

OKay .. I think I got a good motor at a reasonable price .... its a leopard hobby motor.

http://www.helipal.com/leopard-lbp56...ess-motor.html

You are looking at around 38k rpm in a 24v setup. Assuming your peak V = 2x14.5v.
5500 watts, 180 Amps ....

Time to start learning about compressors and maps .. I wish there was a digital parameter searchable database for these ... may be a turbo guru can help out here...

[neutron256]

Originally Posted by AN

OKay .. I think I got a good motor at a reasonable price .... its a leopard hobby motor.

http://www.helipal.com/leopard-lbp56...ess-motor.html

You are looking at around 38k rpm in a 24v setup. Assuming your peak V = 2x14.5v.
5500 watts, 180 Amps ....

Time to start learning about compressors and maps .. I wish there was a digital parameter searchable database for these ... may be a turbo guru can help out here...

Leopard motors are pretty good from what I understand.

Compressor maps are a little tricky at first but once you get the hang of it they aren't that hard to understand. Just know that turbo compressors are pretty much all designed to work in the 50k+ RPM range. They will provide boost below that but not a lot and at lower efficiency. Part of Rob's solution seems to be machining the housing to accept a larger impeller. This requires a CNC lathe, a tool I don't have. That's why I'm very interested to see how the SeaDoo supercharger with its relativity huge impeller does.

[neutron256]

I came across a nice site for RC motors and ESCs.

http://www.espritmodel.com

A lot of higher end motors and ESCs. A few that would probably work really well for an E-Charger if you're willing to spend the money.

[neutron256]

KDE Brushless Motors

I came across these and they look nearly perfect for the compressor I'm building

I went ahead and ordered this one.
http://www.kdedirect.com/KDE600XF1100.html
It's 1100kv so at a 28V Peek voltage it could run at 30K rpm. How did I not stumble across these sooner? The even have an integrated cooling fan.

[bigdawg86]

I'm just thread bombing having not read much about this, but Scorpion brushless motors for use in large scale RC helicopters are huge on performance.

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