Handgun hiding spot in brz

[f0rge]

Originally Posted by Mooseknuckle44

You must be a child. I say that in an assuming way, not demeaning. Up until I was about 22-23 I felt the same way you do. Now that I
understand criminals don't follow the law, I'm not ever going to assume the other guy doesn't have agun JUST because I'm a law abiding citizen.
To say you're not "allowed" to conceal carry so no one has a gun is truly ignorant of fact and possibility.
We're not "allowed" to speed, run stop signs, make illegal uturns and so on and so forth in the states either, but we ALL break at least one traffic law everyday.
Just because you're not allowed to do something doesn't mean you can't.
I truly hope you never find out the hard way. But just be aware of the facts and possibilties before thinking that you'll ever ONLY need your physical abilities to defend yourself. I've never met one person who was bulletproof just because they were ignorant.

Originally Posted by DocCola

I just want to make sure we're clear here...what you're saying is that you KNOW that anyone who tries to mug you, kidnap you, rape you or do other bodily harm to you has NO chance of having a gun. Congratulation on having Canada be the ONLY country in the ENTIRE world where a criminal doesn't have and/or can't obtain a gun. That in and of itself is one hell of an accomplishment.

Listen man, I think I see what you're saying. You're assuming that if I got into some sort of altercation with another citizen who was carrying a gun that we would automaticly draw down on each other like it was the wild west and start a shoot out. No. Not going to happen. I personally have never heard of that happening. If that were the case every time someone got into a debate at a gun range about which gun was better, who's truck was better or which beer was better it would turn into a mass shooting. There is a heavy screening process in damn near all of the states before you can get you conceal carry permit. I know in my home state (Massachusetts) not only did I have to pass the screening and prove I was capeable of handling a gun, I then had to give the police chief of my town a good reason as to why I thought I should be allowed to conceal carry. In Washington where I'm stationed now I just had to pass the CORY and not have a criminal background.

TL-DR: Don't confuse legal conceal carriers with thugs, gang bangers and criminals who go around shooting each other like it's the wild west.

We're getting away from my original point here which was that other dude saying anyone living in a state/country where you're not allowed to have a gun is just asking for the government to show up at your house and put you in a concentration camp and take away all your civil liberties.

I never said I had a problem with people owning or carrying guns.

That being said, even counting criminals, the likelihood of someone having a gun in a place where concealed carry is illegal is MUCH SMALLER. So yes I feel safer, even without a gun of my own.

[RFB]

Originally Posted by f0rge

Contrary to what most people think, Canadians are actually allowed to own guns, even handguns. Shotguns and rifles are terribly easy to legally obtain. Handguns are harder but you can still get them. Hell a couple of my buddies go shooting and hunting all the time.

I've also fired several guns and have had to defend myself before (although not with a gun).

The main difference is that we're not allowed to conceal carry. So when I do have to defend myself I don't need a gun because they other guy doesn't have one either.

Yes arming the population might have worked in 1775, but this is 2014. Just ask the citizens of Iraq and Afghanistan how well it worked when they tried to push the US army out. Not well I'm afraid, and it won't go any better for you.

For the benefit of truth over misinformation, I offer the following -

"the other guy doesn't have one either" ???????

It appears you don't watch or listen to the news or read newspapers.
Seems the daily news reports in Toronto disagree with you.

Shootings in the streets almost daily - an 8 yr old kid watching tv shot through the window, people shot at Dufferin mall, 2 girls shot in the food court at a community college, people shot at the Eaton center, multi shootings at a neighbourhood barb-q, a young girl at the California sandwich shop, an old man answering a door bell, house invasions, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

Both targeted villains and innocents are being hit.

The "other guys" are not just like you.
The "other guys" include goblins.
And in Toronto most goblins just rent their guns off the street.

And oh yeah - unlicensed possession or an unregistered handgun is highly illegal. Doesn't stop the shootings though.

"The main difference is that we're not allowed to conceal carry" ???????

Again I attribute this to you being under informed.

Canadians ARE ALLOWED TO CONCEAL CARRY ! - In every province.
Legal provisions are administered by the Chief Firearms Officers of the provinces and they can issue a concealed carry permit. There must be 3 legitimate police documented life threats before a permit will be considered by the CFO. (police informants with a price on their head get the permits automatically).

Anyone with a hangun licence can get a carry permit only if a member of a restricted handgun club. However carry must be with a trigger lock in a locked box and only directly to the club named on the permit and directly back to the residence of the owner.

Again, I present the above for the sake of truth of facts that exist rather than opinions and misinformation that infest the internet.





CERBERUS

[DocCola]

Originally Posted by f0rge

We're getting away from my original point here which was that other dude saying anyone living in a state/country where you're not allowed to have a gun is just asking for the government to show up at your house and put you in a concentration camp and take away all your civil liberties.

I never said I had a problem with people owning or carrying guns.

That being said, even counting criminals, the likelihood of someone having a gun in a place where concealed carry is illegal is MUCH SMALLER. So yes I feel safer, even without a gun of my own.

Dare you to ask the UK, Australia and Chicago how well that works out. IL has 0 conceal carry and the highest murder rate in the country.

[SkAsphalt]

Meh, stats dictate I will get stabbed or hit with a bat couple thousdand times more likely than getting shot in Canada.

But I don't give a crap - this is actually an interesting topic, those 1911's are very attractive weapons.

[Target70]

Originally Posted by f0rge

Yes arming the population might have worked in 1775, but this is 2014. Just ask the citizens of Iraq and Afghanistan how well it worked when they tried to push the US army out. Not well I'm afraid, and it won't go any better for you.

...

We're getting away from my original point here which was that other dude saying anyone living in a state/country where you're not allowed to have a gun is just asking for the government to show up at your house and put you in a concentration camp and take away all your civil liberties.

I never said I had a problem with people owning or carrying guns.

That being said, even counting criminals, the likelihood of someone having a gun in a place where concealed carry is illegal is MUCH SMALLER. So yes I feel safer, even without a gun of my own.

All I can say is that these are not just thought exercises, we have acutal relevent examples to use. What about this Bundy rancher thing going on last week? No matter what side of the fence you come down on about the legality of his actions, When the federal government started stealing property, and threatning the lives of the family over a simple administrative dispute, after he and outraged members of the public pushed back by brandishing their own firearms, the feds backed down. Will they still go ahead with the court cases yes, but they are no longer pushing people around at the point of their guns.
Have you heard about that guy who was thrown in prison because he didn't use the propper boxes to import his fish? Or the guy who had his house and property taken because the epa said a frog "might" live on his property?.. probably not, have you heard of Ruby Ridge? Waco, Texas? I'll bet you have, why? because those who do fight back, right or wrong, act as a reminder, and a deterrent. No politician wants to be responsible for the shit-storm of cops killing citizens or citizens killing cops over otherwise non violent legal disputes. Not to mention that if it ever did come down to it, How many members of the US military do you think will open fire on US citizens for standing up for their rights? And even if they did, the US has about 350million people, stats say that over half of those are armed. I don't know the numbers of soldiers in the Armed forces, but I believe they only number in the tens or low hundereds of thousands.

"the likelihood of someone having a gun in a place where concealed carry is illegal is MUCH SMALLER."

Almost every single mass shooting in recent history happens in places that citizens are not allowed to carry their weapons: schools, movie theaters, shopping malls. Look at the rates of gun crimes in cities where gun ownership is illegal or difficult to the point of illegality: DC, Chicago, NY, LA, true, the gun laws can not be the only factor, but it also can't be "not" a factor. Criminals Do Not Follow the Law.

[f0rge]

So what is it about places that have concealed carry makes them safer?

What these stats imply is that I'm less likely to get shot in a place where almost everyone has a gun than I am in a place where almost no one does. How does that follow?

[pche]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

Hard to beat DW (unofficial member of COTEP here ;-)). For *ahem* "bang" for your buck, a Dan Wesson is hard to beat. Sure, I'd LOVE to own a Nighthawk, but the level of NH over DW isn't worth the $3.5k price difference. Yet. Maybe once I'm done modding the BRZ, I'll think about it :-P.

I also own a sig p938 (great mouse gun) & love it, as well as a s&w m&p357c. Wonderful guns all, but my heart lies with Saint Browning's handgun masterpiece.

I first learned to shoot handguns back in 2006 at the late Col. Cooper's academy (Gunsite in Paulden, AZ). As I didn't own a gun at the time, I rented one, thus it was a 1911. It's what I was taught with, and 6 years afterwards, I finally was able to own one after having owned several other pistols.

To me it's like having always wanted a Cayman & finally being able to afford one.

On phone I am. Therefore, if mistakes I make, Frank Oz blame you should.

You're absolutely correct sir. I carry a 800 Sig 1911 while the 3k and up 1911s sit in the safe and stay pretty. Because if I ever have to use my ccw for it's intended purpose, the po po would try to it for as long as they can. It's easier to give up a Sig than a Wilson.

If I sell my guns my BRZ would run 10s lol.

[SirBrass]

What it is is that the criminal has no idea if his target is likely to be unarmed. It ups his risk of getting dead, and that itself reduces crime b/c the survival-minded scumbag wants an easy & sure thing, not a target who is likely to fight back.

On phone I am. Therefore, if mistakes I make, Frank Oz blame you should.

[DocCola]

Originally Posted by f0rge

So what is it about places that have concealed carry makes them safer?

What these stats imply is that I'm less likely to get shot in a place where almost everyone has a gun than I am in a place where almost no one does. How does that follow?

Criminals are likely to think twice about an action if they know there's a high chance of the person they intend to rob or harm is carrying a gun.

I'll do you one better. I'm lucky enough (for the time being) to be stationed in a state that allows open carry. Before my near car jacking I always carried concealed. After it I started open carrying. for 2+ years now I've open carried about 75% of the time. I will switch to conceal when I am going in a resturants, movie theaters and other heavily public places. But when I'm riding my motorcycle, running errands or doing whatever, even taking my dog to the park, I open carry. Why? Because just SEEING that gun on my hip is enough of a deterant for most would be criminals. For those that may think they could get the gun off my hip and use it against me, good luck. The blackhawk holster I use has been proven to be extremely difficult to remove the weapon from if you're not the wearer. It even took me a little time to get confident with a fast draw from it.

So, that being said, simplified it's a deterant. Plain and simple. Washington state is a very open carry friendly state. I've had police officers come up to me and thank me for open carrying when I half expected them to give me grief about it. I've had one "bad" instance with a managers at a resturant asked me to go put my gun in my car because it was "making a patron nervous" so I went outside and switched to conceal carry and continued my meal with my family.

I respect your opinion, but I'll stick to mine. I feel safer with my gun not just because it's there but because I know how to use it.

[Target70]

Originally Posted by f0rge

So what is it about places that have concealed carry makes them safer?

What these stats imply is that I'm less likely to get shot in a place where almost everyone has a gun than I am in a place where almost no one does. How does that follow?

sirbrass: What it is is that the criminal has no idea if his target is likely to be unarmed. It ups his risk of getting dead, and that itself reduces crime b/c the survival-minded scumbag wants an easy & sure thing, not a target who is likely to fight back.

^ this.

It is not that almost no one has a gun in those places, it's that Only the Wrong people will have guns in those places. Look at it like this, you go out driving on the road every single day, you put your life in the hands of thousands of strangers behind the wheel of potentially lethal weapons, yet everyone on the road isn't playing some kind of bumper car death match, Why? because those who are responsible enough to follow all the rules, to license, insure themselves are also more likely to behave in a responsible manner once behind the wheel. In the same way, those who choose to follow the law and get their permits, or only carry in legally allowed areas do not tend to behave irresponsibly.

Here is a short story that actually happend to me. mom dad devorced, they would meet in a waffle house in Atlanta to every couple of weeks to exchange custody. My dad always carried his service 1911. One week we went up there and a customer saw the gun on his hip, and although it was completely legal for him to have it, the other customers complained and the manager asked my dad to take it outside and leave it in the car. He did. We came back 1 week later and they had a sign on the door saying "No Guns Allowed". The next week we showed up for the child exchange, and the sign was gone. We asked the manager where the sign went... he told us that they got robbed. My dad never had an issue carrying his pistol into that waffle house again.

oh yeah, when I was listing places that have become targets for mass shootings I forgot one place.. Military bases.. you got it, twice now at fort hood our firearm trained military members have been gunned down yet are not able to carry a weapon to defend themseves, go figure.

[retoocs]

Here in Kommiefornia, legally carrying a gun can often get you out of traffic tickets.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by f0rge

So when I do have to defend myself I don't need a gun because they other guy doesn't have one either.

Yes arming the population might have worked in 1775, but this is 2014. Just ask the citizens of Iraq and Afghanistan how well it worked when they tried to push the US army out. Not well I'm afraid, and it won't go any better for you.

I see others already responded to your statements.

You're so right, every time a country uses its own military, it wins. Ergo, citizens don't need guns.....


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4f0_1397768278

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by f0rge

We're getting away from my original point here which was that other dude saying anyone living in a state/country where you're not allowed to have a gun is just asking for the government to show up at your house and put you in a concentration camp and take away all your civil liberties.

Yes, read a proper history book ffs. Or let your children find out the hard way by relearning what you failed to teach them. But again, you're psychic and know that won't ever happen to you or your descendants.


Some other stats to think about: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...un-free-zones/

[pche]

Arguing with an anti is like pissing in the wind, I'm surprised this thread is not locked yet.