CSG and RCE tag-team suspension Q&A thread! Ask us anything!

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by Captain Snooze

Mike@CSG and Andy@RaceComp
This is just for curiosities' sake.
From all the trawling I have done about Tein SRCs it would seem they are not pressurised. Does this mean that gassed dampers are a bit of marketing fluff? I like the theory that pressurised dampers are less prone to cavitation but does this actually make a difference in reality? Is it a case of diminishing returns for added cost and complexity?

Thanks.

Where did you see the Tein SRC's are gassed? Almost all dampers run a little gas pressure. Monotubes especially.

Bilstein gave us a model shock body with a clear casing and a fitting so that you could pressurize it with a bike pump. Add gas, no bubbles in the oil when you move the piston. Depressurize, tons of bubbles (cavitation). It's actually really cool.

JRZ for example really goes after it and runs high gas pressure to provide "lifting force" or "platform." It's one of their main points of emphasis.

It works...it's not marketing fluff. I'd be very surprised if Tein SRC don't run a decent amount of gas pressure.

- Andy

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by Turkish

I'll be receiving my suspension tomorrow / Friday depending on how late my apartment office decides to stay open or if brown Santa leaves my presents at my door. My question is if I swap my shocks by myself (the most likely scenario), what is the safest way to remove the old and mount the new? I will try to get some help, but it is unlikely any would be available when I plan to swap. Thanks in advance!

We include some instructions in the box, and I think there's a decent write-up on the board too.

Getting some help will...uh...help.

- Andy

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by normancw

@Racecomp Engineering and @CSG Mike

Thanks for your recommendation of part and setup! I got an alignment and corner balance - car feels amazing! I can't wait to try it on the track.

Here's my setup:

• RCE Tarmac 2 coilovers
• Raceseng CasCam plates
• SPL rear lower control arms
• Whiteline 16mm adjustable rear sway bar (BSR54)
• Whiteline rear adjustable end links (KLC182)
• Whiteline front adjustable end links (KLC179)
  
• Whiteline steering rack bushings (KSR210)
• Whiteline positive shift kit bushing (KDT926)
• Whiteline rear crossmember bushing inserts (KDT922)
• Perrin rear shift rod bushing
  
• Cusco front strut brace with master brake cylinder support (965 540 AM LHD)
• Cusco rear strut brace (965 541 A)
• Cusco front power brace (965 492 FM)
• Cusco rear power brace side (965 492 RS)
• Cusco rear crossmember brace (692 492 RM)
• Perrin front control arm brace (PSP-SUS-312SL)

Camber (left - right)
Front: 3.31 - 3.25
Rear: 2.10 - 2.04

Toe
Front: -0.08
Rear: 0.1

Caster (left - right)
7.29 - 7.36

Drop
20mm

Corner balance (with 150 lb driver and 5/8 tank of gas)
LF 835 RF 780
LR 690 RR 636
Left: 1526 (51.9%)
Rear: 1327.45 (45.1%)
RF/LR: 1471 50.0%
Right: 1416 (48.1%)

RCE T2 Track Settings
Front Rebound from Full Stiff: 10
Front Bump from Full Stiff: 11
Rear Rebound from Full Stiff: 13
Rear Bump from Full Stiff: 8

That set up sounds pretty damn awesome!

- Andy

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Captain Snooze

Mike@CSG and Andy@RaceComp
This is just for curiosities' sake.
From all the trawling I have done about Tein SRCs it would seem they are not pressurised. Does this mean that gassed dampers are a bit of marketing fluff? I like the theory that pressurised dampers are less prone to cavitation but does this actually make a difference in reality? Is it a case of diminishing returns for added cost and complexity?

Thanks.

SRCs are gas pressurized. The amount of pressurization is something that we've changed as we're developing the CSG-spec SRC for the FRS/BRZ. It's something we changed in our S2000 SRCs as well.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by normancw

@Racecomp Engineering and @CSG Mike

Thanks for your recommendation of part and setup! I got an alignment and corner balance - car feels amazing! I can't wait to try it on the track.

Here's my setup:

• RCE Tarmac 2 coilovers
• Raceseng CasCam plates
• SPL rear lower control arms
• Whiteline 16mm adjustable rear sway bar (BSR54)
• Whiteline rear adjustable end links (KLC182)
• Whiteline front adjustable end links (KLC179)
• Whiteline steering rack bushings (KSR210)
• Whiteline positive shift kit bushing (KDT926)
• Whiteline rear crossmember bushing inserts (KDT922)
• Perrin rear shift rod bushing
• Cusco front strut brace with master brake cylinder support (965 540 AM LHD)
• Cusco rear strut brace (965 541 A)
• Cusco front power brace (965 492 FM)
• Cusco rear power brace side (965 492 RS)
• Cusco rear crossmember brace (692 492 RM)
• Perrin front control arm brace (PSP-SUS-312SL)

Camber (left - right)
Front: 3.31 - 3.25
Rear: 2.10 - 2.04

Toe
Front: -0.08
Rear: 0.1

Caster (left - right)
7.29 - 7.36

Drop
20mm

Corner balance (with 150 lb driver and 5/8 tank of gas)
LF 835 RF 780
LR 690 RR 636
Left: 1526 (51.9%)
Rear: 1327.45 (45.1%)
RF/LR: 1471 50.0%
Right: 1416 (48.1%)

RCE T2 Track Settings
Front Rebound from Full Stiff: 10
Front Bump from Full Stiff: 11
Rear Rebound from Full Stiff: 13
Rear Bump from Full Stiff: 8

Now this is a pretty serious setup

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

SRCs are gas pressurized. The amount of pressurization is something that we've changed as we're developing the CSG-spec SRC for the FRS/BRZ. It's something we changed in our S2000 SRCs as well.

That's what I thought!

- Andy

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

where can i find some literature on the effects of wheel and tire sizes on performance and the necessary considerations.

Ie, what IS the benefit of going to 18's with 35-40 aspect ratio tires and what modifications would be necessary to extract an improvement.

with such a stiff tire, does it become absolutelty necessary to control dynamic alignment, so more anti-roll, caster, etc.

i keep finding bits and peices of random forum discussion but no papers or articles (other than the crap you find in tuner mags)

I bought a 'real' tire dynamics book. It is beyond me.

There are only small sections that are more manageable in some race engineering and setup books. And a lot of the stuff they rely on (coefficient of friction curves for different conditions like load, heat, camber, slip angle, etc... ) are not regularly available.

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Where did you see the Tein SRC's are gassed? Almost all dampers run a little gas pressure. Monotubes especially.

Bilstein gave us a model shock body with a clear casing and a fitting so that you could pressurize it with a bike pump. Add gas, no bubbles in the oil when you move the piston. Depressurize, tons of bubbles (cavitation). It's actually really cool.

JRZ for example really goes after it and runs high gas pressure to provide "lifting force" or "platform." It's one of their main points of emphasis.

It works...it's not marketing fluff. I'd be very surprised if Tein SRC don't run a decent amount of gas pressure.

- Andy

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

SRCs are gas pressurized. The amount of pressurization is something that we've changed as we're developing the CSG-spec SRC for the FRS/BRZ. It's something we changed in our S2000 SRCs as well.

Stupid internet search. I couldn't find any mention of this so I assumed they weren't. Thanks for the reply.

[solidONE]

Originally Posted by normancw

Thanks for your recommendation of part and setup! I got an alignment and corner balance - car feels amazing! I can't wait to try it on the track.

Here's my setup: Camber (left - right)
Front: 3.31 - 3.25
Rear: 2.10 - 2.04

Toe
Front: -0.08
Rear: 0.1

Caster (left - right)
7.29 - 7.36

Drop
20mm

Wow! Considering stock is supposedly 6 degrees caster, that's a lot of caster gained. Are you running anti-dive bushings, or was that the result from just the drop and the front upper mounts?

[7thgear]

what do you guys think of spring spacers?

something like this i suppose?



or





i want to improve temporary comfort until i can afford a better solution. The roads here have been devastated by the winter and it's fucking rough, Especially at medium pace, the bumps really hit home.

but at the same time i'm wondering if the dampers could handle the extra height
yay/nay?

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

what do you guys think of spring spacers?

something like this i suppose?

i want to improve temporary comfort until i can afford a better solution. The roads here have been devastated by the winter and it's fucking rough, Especially at medium pace, the bumps really hit home.

but at the same time i'm wondering if the dampers could handle the extra height
yay/nay?

I need to take pics of the race cars spacers.. they are so uber ghetto they are awesome...

Picture a top hat that the spring mounts to.. now break off the studs.. now get another top hat and weld a bit of steel tube between them.. yep.. ghetto and about $5 with junk yard parts.

Too bad these probably haven't hit junkyards yet, just totalled, bought, and parted out..

[7thgear]

hmm, thanks for the idea.

[unsurety]

I didn't see it mentioned explicitly anywhere, but are rear control arms required when installing coilovers? It seems like there isn't much adjustment from the factory.

I'm not sure what figure is decent for tire wear, at least when it comes to camber.

ah, as soon as I ask, I find out there are rear camber bushings. This is new to me. Apparently people combine them with adjustable rear control arms too?

[FR-S Matt]

Originally Posted by unsurety

I didn't see it mentioned explicitly anywhere, but are rear control arms required when installing coilovers? It seems like there isn't much adjustment from the factory.

I'm not sure what figure is decent for tire wear, at least when it comes to camber.

Required? No, you'll just have ridiculous camber if you go low (Around 1.3 - 1.5 inches) and end up with -2.5 to -3 camber naturally. I would recommend them though if you want to bring it to that -1.5 camber range with a slight toe in though. SPC ones are cheap for a street driven car, but I upgraded to the Whitelines and like them much better... even on the street.