Actual Objective for what I want to do to my car, as oposed to I want this much power

[LBC Por Siempre]

OK how about this, I want to be able to keep up with the with the cars on track days like Porsche Cayman S and the like. And even if some of you have been paying attention, THE HOT-SHOE's can very easily keep up with the the 911 Carrera S's on Driving Event Track Days that are held. Usually if the person in the 911 knows how to drive a 911 there wouldn't be any competition.

We all know this car can do it but it's not that easy especially when the people who just slap a Turbo or S/C on their cars never pay attention to their Brakes or other Suspension bits. I have seen builds here on the forums where the owners take care of their suspension and go through what is needed to make the car a "COMPLETE" car.

The current Cayman S has 325 Horsepower at the Crank, no turbos - non of that crap. But Porsche did make it a helluva handling platform out of the box.

One thing for sure when I get the Scion or Subaru is I'm going Super Charged, everything else is open. Intake, Exhaust - keeping Catalytic converter and may upgrade to a larger Cat System if necessary. But I do know I will have to shelve all the suspension bits for something much more tunable.

Anybody know where to start or have any input into the matter.

Oh off the bat I'm searching for about 300whp tunable up to 325whp - I know the Porsche aren't doing that much. When they say their Cayman S is making 325, it's at the crank. But they are still able to peel off 0-60 times of 4.5 using their PDK, which I have on my 911 Turbo.

I don't know what it is, but Porsche is playing by different rules because their transmissions are just about the most efficient Transmissions out there.

While we can figure that most trannies are soaking up about 20% of the power, the Porsche are doing something closing in the low teens.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by LBC Por Siempre

OK how about this, I want to be able to keep up with the with the cars on track days like Porsche Cayman S and the like. And even if some of you have been paying attention, THE HOT-SHOE's can can very easily keep up with the the 911 Carrera S's on Driving Event Track Days that are held.

We all know this car can do it but it's not that easy especially when the people who just slap a Turbo or S/C on their cars never pay attention to their Brakes or other Suspension bits. I have seen builds here on the forums where the owners take care of their suspension and go through what is needed to make the car a "COMPLETE" car.

The current Cayman S has 315 Horsepower at the Crank, no turbos - non of that that crap. But Porsche did make it a helluva handling platform out of the box.

One thing for sure when I get the Scion or Subaru is I'm going Super Charged, everything else is open. Intake, Exhaust - keeping Catalytic converter and may upgrade to a larger Cat System if necessary. But I do known I will have to shelf all the suspension bits for something much more tunable.

Anybody know where to start or have any input into the matter.

Oh off the bat I'm searching for about 300whp tunable up to 325whp - I know the Porsche aren't doing that much. When they say their Cayman S is making 315, it's at the crank. But they are still able to peel off 0-60 times of 4.5 using their PDK, which I have on my 911 Turbo.

I don't know what it is, but Porsche is playing by different rules because their transmissions are just about the most efficient Transmissions out there.

While we can figure that most trannies are soaking up about 20% of the power, the Porsche are doing something closing in the low teens.

You forgot one thing. Your goal requires that the Porsche driver not be a good driver... If the Porsche driver is good, then what? Just saying

Also, the Cayman S is 325hp...~275whp

As far as drivetrain losses go, the FRS is at about 14% or so to the wheels. So is everyone else. Porsche doesn't have magically more efficient gears.

So we know what your goal is. How much are you willing to spend to get to that goal? Are you okay knowing that you'll still lack the refinement of the Cayman?

We can definitely help you get there.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCWz5ymLKrI"]Scion FRS vs Porsche GT3 86Fest II - YouTube[/ame]


Have you ever considered getting some driver coaching?

[swift996]

Keep tuned, I've heard there is a web blog testing a supercharged brz benchmarked against the Cayman S.

[CSG Mike]

For the record, if I were offered a BRZ with Supercharger, Suspension, Wheels, Tires, and Brakes, or a stock Cayman S, I'd take the Cayman S.

[Sonolin]

I definitely think our cars can be competitive with the Cayman S with a supercharger. After seeing what a little bit of power from a small turbo (@CSG Mike posted 1:30 at WSIR with <250whp which is a fast time) in our cars I definitely think with the right mods we should be able to compete with Cayman S, Corvettes, and other faster cars. On paper getting the right power to weight ratio isn't too hard - ~280whp should be enough to keep it competitive with a stock Corvette's power to weight for example.

And of course lots of drivers mod

That's my plan (sort of). Build my car to 250-300whp and try to take on the higher hp cars. Mostly want to compete in higher time attack classes, and with all the mods I want similar cars in the class are Corvette, Cayman S, gt500, and modded WRX and Mustangs. So lots of great cars. Still yet to build yet just waiting for the funds...

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Sonolin

I definitely think our cars can be competitive with the Cayman S with a supercharger. After seeing what a little bit of power from a small turbo (@CSG Mike) in our cars I definitely think with the right mods we should be able to compete with Cayman S, Corvettes, and other faster cars. On paper getting the right power to weight ratio isn't too hard - ~280whp should be enough to keep it competitive with a stock Corvette's power to weight for example.

And of course lots of drivers mod

That's my plan (sort of). Build my car to 250-300whp and try to take on the higher hp cars. Mostly want to compete in higher time attack classes, and with all the mods I want similar cars in the class are Corvette, Cayman S, gt500, and modded WRX and Mustangs. So lots of great cars. Still yet to build yet just waiting for the funds...

A C4 Corvette? Cuz 280whp isn't even CLOSE to being competitive with a C7 or C6. A C5 is about 300whp stock, but has a WAY fatter powerband (significantly larger AUC, i.e. faster). Lets not forget that just cams on a vette will unlock 100+ hp.

[Sonolin]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

A C4 Corvette? Cuz 280whp isn't even CLOSE to being competitive with a C7 or C6. A C5 is about 300whp stock, but has a WAY fatter powerband (significantly larger AUC, i.e. faster). Lets not forget that just cams on a vette will unlock 100+ hp.

I was talking about in terms of power to weight ratio not outright horsepower.

Based on numbers, C6 vette is rated at 400bhp and 3179lbs. curb weight from first source I found. So power to weight would be roughly 7.9 lbs. per horsepower.

If I take the number and divide it into our stock curb weight (2750) you get 348bhp which is still at the flywheel. So assuming the vette doesn't have mods its competitive power wise. Which is a decent task IMO (achieving the power/weight of stock c6). So yea more towards 300 whp but still achievable I think.

Not to mention we have the lighter weight advantage around the tight corners so I think it should be competitive on a grassroots level at least (not talking all out wheel to wheel racing or anything).

Of course this is just talking power we have to balance that out with all else. But based on the lap times I'm seeing it looks like our cars would fare decently. Or do you think the c6 would whipe the floor with us? Because if so there's no chance of me supercharging since it jumps the car up almost 2 classes in TT.

[Sonolin]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

A C4 Corvette? Cuz 280whp isn't even CLOSE to being competitive with a C7 or C6. A C5 is about 300whp stock, but has a WAY fatter powerband (significantly larger AUC, i.e. faster). Lets not forget that just cams on a vette will unlock 100+ hp.

Also yea the fatter power band and power potential is definitely a huge advantage for the corvette. But I also haven't seen or heard of any vettes getting a 1:30 a WSIR either.. (I'm sure pro drivers maybe )

[CSG Mike]

05-07 is 400hp. 08+ C6 is 430hp.

I can do a 1:30 at WSIR in a 100% stock vette. For the record, I think I can do a 1:28 at WSIR, in good conditions and no traffic. That 1:30 lap was on old tires!

I'd speculate the Evasive FRS should be capable of a 1:22-23 here?

[ultra]

Modified (suspension) vs stock Cayman S with equal drivers - contemporary Porsches lack a lot of negative camber adjustability from the factory so I'd speculate that a ZN6 with a well set up chassis could keep up with a stock Cayman S, depending on the track layout.

Modified (suspension) ZN6 vs modified (Suspension) Cayman S with equal drivers - yeah, you're gonna need more power.

IMHO

[CSG Mike]

I'd go as far as saying a Cayman S with just an alignment is a serious threat.

[LBC Por Siempre]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

I'd go as far as saying a Cayman S with just an alignment is a serious threat.

It is, think it was Car and Driver with their stupid little Lightning Lap put a Cayman and 911, forget which versions, up against about ten other cars. The Cayman was about within a second of the 911. Which goes on to prove that the 911 takes some learning and training to drive fast because of its rear mounted motor. The Cayman is a helluva lot easier to drive fast too. That and that is what happens when you get a bunch on Auto Writers together and not a bunch of Nigel Mansells and Walter Rohl's together to test the cars.

[LBC Por Siempre]

And yes, I do know what its like driving a very fast Porsche. At about 4/10 capability since I lack the balls.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by LBC Por Siempre

And yes, I do know what its like driving a very fast Porsche. At about 4/10 capability since I lack the balls.

Well... Turbo... GTR... EVO... STI... they all have some things in common that a 2/2S/FRS/BRZ/Cayman don't have...