Tuning

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by Lexicon101

Isn't the idea of this car a lightweight FR tuner?
I might be wrong on this, and I'm not suggesting that it's certain that they'll make it tunable.. but I wouldn't count out the possibility.

Toyota is nortoriously very protective of their ECU's... Subies tend to be a little more tuner friendly, but according to Tougerenner my idea of swapping out the Toyota for the Subie ECU may not work (wired in parallel perhaps???).

I just wanted to get a thread going to see who has experience with tuning on various platforms and to what extent. In the end, those folks are gonna be the ones everyone goes to for advice...

I'm just throwing my hat in and seeing who else lobs a sombrero :happy0180:

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Lexicon101

Isn't the idea of this car a lightweight FR tuner?
I might be wrong on this, and I'm not suggesting that it's certain that they'll make it tunable.. but I wouldn't count out the possibility.

You really haven't been dealing with Toyota cars for long have you?

Originally Posted by Jordo!

The fact we may or may not be able to get ready made re-flashes is EXACTLY why I started this thread -- who here (besides me) knows how to tune?

Soon we'll need a proper ECU tuning forum...

Have any aftermarket companies boldy stepped up to claim they want to make a harness for the FT-86? Haven't heard anything, but I'm sure they're out there.

Yo. Wolf, Haltech & Greddy/Trust

Also have experience with engine swaps, suspension work & brakes. I just ok at welding, but I plan to take some courses and get certified as well as learning composites. Going to take the course at ECU university to see if it helps me improve my tuning at some point next year.

I'm actually working on an aftermarket ECU solution of my own, but it's taking a lot longer than I had anticipated. Was going to present it as my Thesis, but ended up doing something else. Whenever it's ready, be sure there will be a harness and plug and play box for the 86.

My brother and I are working towards opening a Garage for performance and race cars, but that is a little further down the line (6 years or so) and we do plan to produce all manner of parts for Toyota/Nissan/BMWs.

Can't promise that I'd have anything ready for the 86 soon, because I have a lot going on right now in my main area of work/business, but in the future... who knows...

[Myka]

I've read that tuning direct injection engines is harder. Like the ecu is harder to crack or once you're in there it's hard to tune. That's another reason it probably won't have a subbie ecu, the ft will be DI.

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Myka

I've read that tuning direct injection engines is harder. Like the ecu is harder to crack or once you're in there it's hard to tune. That's another reason it probably won't have a subbie ecu, the ft will be DI.

Toyota ECUs are impossible to crack. Tuning DI engines is a lot harder, but not because of the ECU (well, maybe in some cases..like the 2GR and UR engines yes)...

Firstly, unlike port injection, it's not as easy to just swap out injectors for higher flow ones. The there is the fact that not many people really have a lot of experience with it. Then there is the fact that a lot of injection when into developing flow and dispersion patterns etc, and that f'ing with it might easily make things worse.

That withstanding, most diesel engines today are DI. I think a LOT can be had form DI gas engines... think of it it almost as moving from Carbs to multi-point electronic fuel injection. It really is that big a step. Cooler charges, precise fuel control, no obstruction in the intakes..... heck... once we get out heads wrapped around DI I think ICE tuning will make another step into the stratosphere.



**sniper edit**

here is a great article

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Yo. Wolf, Haltech & Greddy/Trust

Also have experience with engine swaps, suspension work & brakes. I just ok at welding, but I plan to take some courses and get certified as well as learning composites. Going to take the course at ECU university to see if it helps me improve my tuning at some point next year.

I'm actually working on an aftermarket ECU solution of my own, but it's taking a lot longer than I had anticipated. Was going to present it as my Thesis, but ended up doing something else. Whenever it's ready, be sure there will be a harness and plug and play box for the 86.

My brother and I are working towards opening a Garage for performance and race cars, but that is a little further down the line (6 years or so) and we do plan to produce all manner of parts for Toyota/Nissan/BMWs.

Can't promise that I'd have anything ready for the 86 soon, because I have a lot going on right now in my main area of work/business, but in the future... who knows...

Ah, very cool!

Yeah, a bit early, but another reason I wanted to start a thread like this was because I figured some of us may actually develop products of our own.

Until a bunch of us over at newcelica headed up a project for ourselves there were no decent header options -- nothing.

Everything available either lost power or gained nada. Several of us pooled our knowledge, found a shop with experience fabricating custom headers for the 2ZZ, and viola -- first true performance long tube race header ever, now a regular item on many folks cars.

Likewise, a few other industrious folks have recently developed a nice perfomance IM too.

It'd be cool if those of us with some knowledge and experience pool our resources for the FT-86 to see what we can do

Looking forward to learning more about the performance shop you are planning to open :happy0180:

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Firstly, unlike port injection, it's not as easy to just swap out injectors for higher flow ones. The there is the fact that not many people really have a lot of experience with it. Then there is the fact that a lot of injection when into developing flow and dispersion patterns etc, and that f'ing with it might easily make things worse.

Done some research on this and it seems all the VW guys swap in a larger fuel pump http://www.namotorsports.net/detail...._cd/APMS100016

Allegedly FT-86 will have both port and DI, so that may turn out easier to tune

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Done some research on this and it seems all the VW guys swap in a larger fuel pump http://www.namotorsports.net/detail...._cd/APMS100016

Allegedly FT-86 will have both port and DI, so that may turn out easier to tune

Tell that to the ISx50 guys.


Trust me, the key in this whole thing is going to be the brain box. I hope Toyota recognizes that, or at least gives us an amicable solution.

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Tell that to the ISx50 guys.


Trust me, the key in this whole thing is going to be the brain box. I hope Toyota recognizes that, or at least gives us an amicable solution.

Hmm. No fuel pump upgrade? No good swapping out the port injectors to help with fueling?

Actually, if you have a link or two to a forum thread on what has been attempted, I'd really like to check it out

[himbo]

Originally Posted by Tougerenner

As for engine tuning, if the production FT86 comes with an Subaru ecu similar to those found in the turbo models that will make things alot easier. Reflashing of the stock subaru turbo ecu's is quite easy, you can either use Cobb's accessport or go OpenSource, also tuners are very readily available. However Cobb does have an acessport for the NA subaru's so all hope is not lost, heck they even have an accessport for the "uncrackable" R35 GTR.

If the FT86 sees production with the same rear suspension as the concept(current impreza/forester) all the major work for the rear is already done. Aftermarket companies will probably just have to revise valving in the shocks and revise spring rates. As for the front who knows on that, but my guess is that something will be out shortly.

Hey! Cobb actually came out with an accessport for NA 2.5L imprezas '08+ I think Rallietek tested it...

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Hmm. No fuel pump upgrade? No good swapping out the port injectors to help with fueling?

Actually, if you have a link or two to a forum thread on what has been attempted, I'd really like to check it out

The port injector mostly work during startup. The trick is in the ECU, not the size of the injectors.

[RWD_only]

Tuning skills? Uh, being friends with Tim Bailey

I do really want to learn how to weld and i've done some limited headwork but yeah I really know next to squat. I'm here to drive the car not become it's therapist.

[Tougerenner]

Originally Posted by himbo

Hey! Cobb actually came out with an accessport for NA 2.5L imprezas '08+ I think Rallietek tested it...

Right, But if I recall its not really worth it unless you want to spend $600 to be able to clear codes and have a valet/anti theft map. From what I can see Cobb does not offer "staged" maps for the NA subys. But if you can Protune with AccessPort on the NA subys and were doing something like this..... I could see the need. but at that point one would go with what the chosen tuner works best in be it Accessport or OpenSource.




From my experience with the NA suby ECU, my friend had a 2000 2.5rs coupe. We put an intake, headers, CBE, reset the ecu and it ran like a champ. It never have him any trouble. However turbo subys are another story, exuding 02-03 WRX, if you put a downpipe on the car and do not reflash its not going to run right. For any cold air you should technically get a tune or the motor will have lots of hesitation.

[blur]

I don't know much about this, but do you guys think we'll be able to adjust boost on the turbo FT86? Assuming it sports the untouchable ecu.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by blur

I don't know much about this, but do you guys think we'll be able to adjust boost on the turbo FT86? Assuming it sports the untouchable ecu.

I say "No"

[Myka]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

I say "No"

I agree, but that would be awesome!

It would also be cool if it adjusted power based on fuel. Like it ups the boost when it senses E85.