4,000miles, 13x in for service, 2 computers and 1 motor replaced

[shiro]

We've had similar issues. Even though I had some mods I feel you on how Toyota [Scion for me] had been treating their customers about this issue. I've done a few posts too if you were interested.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...postcount=2676

Originally Posted by P5yk0t1c

Update: So since I have wrote this, Toyota/Scion Canada has got back to me and said they are not going to replace my car, they are going to fix it....for the 13 time. I told them that this was unacceptable, but they honestly don't care about how the customer feels.


I just thought I would tell you all my story....

I purchased a Scion FR-S from Toyota on March 2, 2013. The car had 1000 km on it at the time of purchase. I was informed that it was in perfect working condition from the salesman at the time. With 1000 km on it, one would assume there would be no issues as it was a brand new vehicle. The car almost immediately began experiencing problems. The first time we took it in for service in Calgary was March 12 –not even two weeks after purchasing it. They have not been able to get the car to run problem free for any extended amount of time. We have had a loaner vehicle for weeks at a time periodically since March. The car was bought from a Toyota dealership that failed to mention that it had already been in for service at 600kms and had the computer system replaced because of the same CEL light that has been an ongoing issue since I bought it. Below is a list of the service visits and corresponding issues (in each of the instances below I was only able to drive the car a couple hundred kilometers before the CEL would reappear):


1. (March12,2013)No engine light. Brought car in because it had idle issues / rpm dropping. Service told me that there was nothing they could do and that is the way they are made. Many other FR-S owners have complained of this issue.

2. Check Engine Light on. Service said they could not get the error to repeat itself and said it was probably a “one off” and removed the engine light.

3. Check Engine Light on. Service said it was a valve error. They swapped valve banks around to see if the issue would follow.

4. Check Engine Light on. Service ordered new valve. Turned Engine light off.

5. Check Engine Light on. Took in for valve replacement.

6. Drove car for approximately 15kms then total Engine failure. Dropped off at Toyota (Car in shop for approx30days). Replaced engine.

7. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light

8. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light.

9. Check Engine Light on. They wanted me to get the light to come on again and explain exactly what was happening when it comes on.

10. Check Engine Light on. Explained what happened. Service ordered a new part .(Air/Fuel Sensor I believe)

11. Check Engine Light on. Came to get part installed. Car in shop for 8 days. When I came back, they decided that replacing that part was not going to fix anything. Nothing was done. Engine light was turned off.

12. Check Engine Light on. Left car in shop. Received car back…nothing done. Drove car home (5kms) and it had lost about30% of its power. Called Toyota they came and picked up my car. Service said they ran a test on Cylinder #2 and it came back faulty…then they ran another test in which it came back “within parameters”. So basically saying, Cylinder #2 in a brand new motor is flawed…but “good enough”. Service Techs were able to recreate the CEL light this time. Replaced Computer system (for the second time).

13. Check Engine Light on. Service techs cannot find issue and tell me that my aftermarket exhaust (from the CAT back, which I cleared with Toyota before the purchase) needs to be taken off and the stock exhaust put back on. All of these issues were happening before the exhaust was put on, but they wanted a stock setup. Picked up my car 5 days later drove it for 30 seconds….engine light came on, drove back into service bay. The techs thought I had forgot something.....Currently, the car is still in for service.

It is obvious that no one knows what is wrong with the car. I have taken it in to service13times in six months with no resolution. The engine has been totally replaced and the computer system has been replaced twice. I have had a loaner vehicle for almost as much time as I have had the car. The latest attempt at resolution has the service manager in possession of my car, driving it for a number of days so they can document on a computer what is happening at all times. They have recorded the CEL light numerous times while this computer has been connected, but even that has failed to capture all the data. I understand the need for troubleshooting, but the amount of times this problem is happening is excessive.

I have recently lodged a complaint with Toyota / Scion Canada on September 30th letting them know at this point in time, the only option that is going to satisfy me is to have the vehicle replaced. I have been more than patient and cooperative under the circumstances to the point that current Toyota employees have advised me to contact Toyota and request a replacement. It is evident by the details listed above that the engineers and mechanics are at a loss for what the underlying problem is with this car. I cannot continue to have my car that has 7000 km on it that I paid full value for from a dealership in for constant repairs. The amount of time and energy being displaced by this issue is becoming very excessive. My fear is that the car will continue to be problematic long after the warranty has expired. To date, the CEL has illuminated atleast15-20 times since the replaced engine was installed in which I have no idea the probable damage this has caused. The potential resale value of the vehicle has also been severely jeopardized should any buyer request a record of the service history.

Toyota presents itself as a reputable, upstanding company that stands by their superior product which is why I purchased this vehicle and paid the "Toyota premium" for their quality.....

....what a mistake I made.

[Bad Habits]

Sounds like its time to let Toyota know you are tired of being fuked around and by that I mean if they don't take you seriously then they need to hear from your lawyer. Obviously they do not think they owe you anything but they expect you to make a payment on a car that has spent more time at the place it was purchased than at your home.

[Braces]

OP: Sorry for all your troubles. I know if I were in your shoes ... I would be livid.
Sounds like you're doing the right things. Lawyers don't work for free and the reality is Toyota has many attorneys on retainer compared to your one. Definately look to the media. In the US there are TV spots dedicated to dishonest business'. If you have that in Canada ... contact them. Definately do the small claims court. The picketing ... it can only help.

Sounds like the dealership that sold you the lemon in the 1st place needs to rectify this.

Good luck.

[Rampage]

Not to make light of this but they have replaced the engine and the computer system. It sounds like you need an Exorcist.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck in getting this resolved to your complete satisfaction.

[dannyboy8793]

I would drive the car to a bad part of town park it and hopes someone steels it then go to a different dealer and buy another car once you get money from your insurance. Just kidding.
I hope everything turns out good for you.

[stugray]

Replaced computer twice - problem remains

Replaced entire engine - problem remains

"They said they could not get all of the data and asked me to get the light to come on again."

Occam's razor = your system wiring harness is faulty. Short, intermittent, open, etc.

[Bad Habits]

Originally Posted by stugray

Replaced computer twice - problem remains

Replaced entire engine - problem remains

"They said they could not get all of the data and asked me to get the light to come on again."

Occam's razor = your system wiring harness is faulty. Short, intermittent, open, etc.

You know your use of 'razor' was a better used/proved version than anything example I got in econ 1/2 lol.

[snoopy0812]

edit; sorry didn't see stugray post above. Exactly that.

[SubaSteve]

Seems like your techs are the ones causing most of the problems. After replacing the engine the first time they shouldn't have kept resetting the cel. This cel comes on for a specific reason especially since you have no mods and a newish car.

Don't ever go back to this dealership.

[jflogerzi]

Originally Posted by P5yk0t1c

Update: So since I have wrote this, Toyota/Scion Canada has got back to me and said they are not going to replace my car, they are going to fix it....for the 13 time. I told them that this was unacceptable, but they honestly don't care about how the customer feels.


I just thought I would tell you all my story....

I purchased a Scion FR-S from Toyota on March 2, 2013. The car had 1000 km on it at the time of purchase. I was informed that it was in perfect working condition from the salesman at the time. With 1000 km on it, one would assume there would be no issues as it was a brand new vehicle. The car almost immediately began experiencing problems. The first time we took it in for service in Calgary was March 12 –not even two weeks after purchasing it. They have not been able to get the car to run problem free for any extended amount of time. We have had a loaner vehicle for weeks at a time periodically since March. The car was bought from a Toyota dealership that failed to mention that it had already been in for service at 600kms and had the computer system replaced because of the same CEL light that has been an ongoing issue since I bought it. Below is a list of the service visits and corresponding issues (in each of the instances below I was only able to drive the car a couple hundred kilometers before the CEL would reappear):


1. (March12,2013)No engine light. Brought car in because it had idle issues / rpm dropping. Service told me that there was nothing they could do and that is the way they are made. Many other FR-S owners have complained of this issue.

2. Check Engine Light on. Service said they could not get the error to repeat itself and said it was probably a “one off” and removed the engine light.

3. Check Engine Light on. Service said it was a valve error. They swapped valve banks around to see if the issue would follow.

4. Check Engine Light on. Service ordered new valve. Turned Engine light off.

5. Check Engine Light on. Took in for valve replacement.

6. Drove car for approximately 15kms then total Engine failure. Dropped off at Toyota (Car in shop for approx30days). Replaced engine.

7. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light

8. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light.

9. Check Engine Light on. They wanted me to get the light to come on again and explain exactly what was happening when it comes on.

10. Check Engine Light on. Explained what happened. Service ordered a new part .(Air/Fuel Sensor I believe)

11. Check Engine Light on. Came to get part installed. Car in shop for 8 days. When I came back, they decided that replacing that part was not going to fix anything. Nothing was done. Engine light was turned off.

12. Check Engine Light on. Left car in shop. Received car back…nothing done. Drove car home (5kms) and it had lost about30% of its power. Called Toyota they came and picked up my car. Service said they ran a test on Cylinder #2 and it came back faulty…then they ran another test in which it came back “within parameters”. So basically saying, Cylinder #2 in a brand new motor is flawed…but “good enough”. Service Techs were able to recreate the CEL light this time. Replaced Computer system (for the second time).

13. Check Engine Light on. Service techs cannot find issue and tell me that my aftermarket exhaust (from the CAT back, which I cleared with Toyota before the purchase) needs to be taken off and the stock exhaust put back on. All of these issues were happening before the exhaust was put on, but they wanted a stock setup. Picked up my car 5 days later drove it for 30 seconds….engine light came on, drove back into service bay. The techs thought I had forgot something.....Currently, the car is still in for service.

It is obvious that no one knows what is wrong with the car. I have taken it in to service13times in six months with no resolution. The engine has been totally replaced and the computer system has been replaced twice. I have had a loaner vehicle for almost as much time as I have had the car. The latest attempt at resolution has the service manager in possession of my car, driving it for a number of days so they can document on a computer what is happening at all times. They have recorded the CEL light numerous times while this computer has been connected, but even that has failed to capture all the data. I understand the need for troubleshooting, but the amount of times this problem is happening is excessive.

I have recently lodged a complaint with Toyota / Scion Canada on September 30th letting them know at this point in time, the only option that is going to satisfy me is to have the vehicle replaced. I have been more than patient and cooperative under the circumstances to the point that current Toyota employees have advised me to contact Toyota and request a replacement. It is evident by the details listed above that the engineers and mechanics are at a loss for what the underlying problem is with this car. I cannot continue to have my car that has 7000 km on it that I paid full value for from a dealership in for constant repairs. The amount of time and energy being displaced by this issue is becoming very excessive. My fear is that the car will continue to be problematic long after the warranty has expired. To date, the CEL has illuminated atleast15-20 times since the replaced engine was installed in which I have no idea the probable damage this has caused. The potential resale value of the vehicle has also been severely jeopardized should any buyer request a record of the service history.

Toyota presents itself as a reputable, upstanding company that stands by their superior product which is why I purchased this vehicle and paid the "Toyota premium" for their quality.....

....what a mistake I made.

Remember its made by Subaru

[hmong337]

Any jackass could've got in the car within that 1000km range and screwed it. It only takes a second to injure a car. One bad mis-shift from the top of third, into second! LOL. I've seen it happen.

Thankfully my odometer read 12km at the time of delivery.

I hope your troubles work themselves out. Sucks to not enjoy this amazing car!

[PMPB]

To ALMOST EVERYONE.

OP is in Canada. We have CAMVAP here.... he doesn't need a lawyer. He just needs to contact them to get this shit sorted out, takes about 60 days, way less time than lawyers and Lemons laws in the US. The CAMVAP doesn't cost us anything.

OP. Please please just contact them.

[P5yk0t1c]

Updated the first post (Oct 31)

[Evil Jesus]

Congrats! Glad it all worked out for you! What color did you get?