4,000miles, 13x in for service, 2 computers and 1 motor replaced - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

P5yk0t1c · 10-23-2013, 09:42 PM

(Oct 31) Update: Scion Canada has now replaced my car with a new 2014 FR-S. The dealership in my area is also switching out all of my aftermarket parts to the new vehicle. In the end Scion/Toyota has done the right thing. Thanks for all the help and support. The power of social media is greater than most realize. Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in...

(Oct 24) Update: So since I have wrote this, Toyota/Scion Canada has got back to me and said they are not going to replace my car, they are going to fix it....for the 13 time. I told them that this was unacceptable, but they honestly don't care about how the customer feels.

I just thought I would tell you all my story....

I purchased a Scion FR-S from Toyota on March 2, 2013. The car had 1000 km on it at the time of purchase. I was informed that it was in perfect working condition from the salesman at the time. With 1000 km on it, one would assume there would be no issues as it was a brand new vehicle. The car almost immediately began experiencing problems. The first time we took it in for service in Calgary was March 12 –not even two weeks after purchasing it. They have not been able to get the car to run problem free for any extended amount of time. We have had a loaner vehicle for weeks at a time periodically since March. The car was bought from a Toyota dealership that failed to mention that it had already been in for service at 600kms and had the computer system replaced because of the same CEL light that has been an ongoing issue since I bought it. Below is a list of the service visits and corresponding issues (in each of the instances below I was only able to drive the car a couple hundred kilometers before the CEL would reappear):

1. (March12,2013)No engine light. Brought car in because it had idle issues / rpm dropping. Service told me that there was nothing they could do and that is the way they are made. Many other FR-S owners have complained of this issue.

2. Check Engine Light on. Service said they could not get the error to repeat itself and said it was probably a “one off” and removed the engine light.

3. Check Engine Light on. Service said it was a valve error. They swapped valve banks around to see if the issue would follow.

4. Check Engine Light on. Service ordered new valve. Turned Engine light off.

5. Check Engine Light on. Took in for valve replacement.

6. Drove car for approximately 15kms then total Engine failure. Dropped off at Toyota (Car in shop for approx30days). Replaced engine.

7. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light

8. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light.

9. Check Engine Light on. They wanted me to get the light to come on again and explain exactly what was happening when it comes on.

10. Check Engine Light on. Explained what happened. Service ordered a new part .(Air/Fuel Sensor I believe)

11. Check Engine Light on. Came to get part installed. Car in shop for 8 days. When I came back, they decided that replacing that part was not going to fix anything. Nothing was done. Engine light was turned off.

12. Check Engine Light on. Left car in shop. Received car back…nothing done. Drove car home (5kms) and it had lost about30% of its power. Called Toyota they came and picked up my car. Service said they ran a test on Cylinder #2 and it came back faulty…then they ran another test in which it came back “within parameters”. So basically saying, Cylinder #2 in a brand new motor is flawed…but “good enough”. Service Techs were able to recreate the CEL light this time. Replaced Computer system (for the second time).

13. Check Engine Light on. Service techs cannot find issue and tell me that my aftermarket exhaust (from the CAT back, which I cleared with Toyota before the purchase) needs to be taken off and the stock exhaust put back on. All of these issues were happening before the exhaust was put on, but they wanted a stock setup. Picked up my car 5 days later drove it for 30 seconds….engine light came on, drove back into service bay. The techs thought I had forgot something.....Currently, the car is still in for service.

It is obvious that no one knows what is wrong with the car. I have taken it in to service13times in six months with no resolution. The engine has been totally replaced and the computer system has been replaced twice. I have had a loaner vehicle for almost as much time as I have had the car. The latest attempt at resolution has the service manager in possession of my car, driving it for a number of days so they can document on a computer what is happening at all times. They have recorded the CEL light numerous times while this computer has been connected, but even that has failed to capture all the data. I understand the need for troubleshooting, but the amount of times this problem is happening is excessive.

I have recently lodged a complaint with Toyota / Scion Canada on September 30th letting them know at this point in time, the only option that is going to satisfy me is to have the vehicle replaced. I have been more than patient and cooperative under the circumstances to the point that current Toyota employees have advised me to contact Toyota and request a replacement. It is evident by the details listed above that the engineers and mechanics are at a loss for what the underlying problem is with this car. I cannot continue to have my car that has 7000 km on it that I paid full value for from a dealership in for constant repairs. The amount of time and energy being displaced by this issue is becoming very excessive. My fear is that the car will continue to be problematic long after the warranty has expired. To date, the CEL has illuminated atleast15-20 times since the replaced engine was installed in which I have no idea the probable damage this has caused. The potential resale value of the vehicle has also been severely jeopardized should any buyer request a record of the service history.

Toyota presents itself as a reputable, upstanding company that stands by their superior product which is why I purchased this vehicle and paid the "Toyota premium" for their quality.....

P5yk0t1c · 10-23-2013, 09:46 PM

I copy and pasted that into the forum window...not sure what happened to the editing...my apologies.

n0m0h0s · 10-23-2013, 09:55 PM

In california sounds like the lemon law would apply and you would have all your money refunded here in cali. Sorry for your issues

Mad1723 · 10-23-2013, 10:04 PM

I'd go for a Lemon law too. Get a 2014 with the refund or simply swap to another car. All the best in your "adventure"

P5yk0t1c · 10-23-2013, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mad1723

I'd go for a Lemon law too. Get a 2014 with the refund or simply swap to another car. All the best in your "adventure"

Yeah, first we need to get a lemon law in Canada...

PMPB · 10-23-2013, 10:20 PM

You should STRONGLY consider taking this before Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan (CAMVAP)

It's our equivalent of the lemon law, a little less well defined in terms of how much BS you have to put up before a manufacturer will be bound to do something by the CAMVAP, but it sounds to me like you'll probably have a good shot at getting Toyota/Scion to buy this thing back.

P.S. Just because you are having issues, and this forum represents the vocal minority, doesn't mean that the BRZ/FR-S/GT-86 should be condemned and anyone considering buying it should strongly reconsider. Don't paint the model with the same brush man. That said, I'm really sorry to hear about your issues. I can only imagine how frustrated you must be.

ZionsWrath · 10-23-2013, 10:51 PM

I hope it was at least sold to you as a used vehicle with 1000km...

Do your best to get rid of that car, I'd be pissed as fuk

thill · 10-23-2013, 10:52 PM

Incredibly frustrating.. Something to consider in the future, if a car has 600miles on it, you should certainly question why the original buyer returned it, and never believe anything a salesman tells you. They just want to sell you the car.

All of this said, Toyota/Scion should take care of you, and if not, get a lawyer.

strat61caster · 10-24-2013, 12:25 AM

Agreed, you got a dud, get rid of it. If Toyota/Scion doesn't pony up get a lawyer, you got a lemon.

Out of curiosity, were you happy with it before the problems started? What were the conditions pertaining to #9/#10?

R.S-HawK · 10-24-2013, 12:49 AM

That sucks man. I really feel for your troubles.

I too would lawyer up if Toyota doesn't make it right. Also, for what it's worth, get your bank involved if you're paying a loan on the car.

ZZT86 · 10-24-2013, 01:21 AM

When was it built ?

Definitely get TMC to replace it & let them figure it out in their time what is wrong with the car OR seek palatable compensation for your suffering.

Tien · 10-24-2013, 01:36 AM

Man this is crazy. Where did Toyota and Subaru go wrong? Besides the chirping I love my car a lot. You know what I don't feel so bad anymore about my chirping after hearing your story. I pray you will get your resolution ASAP.

humfrz · 10-24-2013, 01:38 AM

Yep, I agree with those that say you should get a different car.

That one is "sick".

Life is too short to put up with a "sick" car.

humfrz

forzajuve · 10-24-2013, 02:32 AM

You definitely got a bad egg. I agree that you should have the vehicle replaced and you should not only request it but DEMAND it.

Once all the warranties runs out, who knows what other problems you will have an how much money it will cost you. Not only that, your car has had so many problems and so much work done to it, who would want it if you were to sell it? It has lost all respectable value as far as I am concerned.

Your patience should definitely be commended and good luck, I hope it works out for you.

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10-23-2013, 09:42 PM	#1
P5yk0t1c Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2014 FR-S Location: Canada Posts: 84 Thanks: 29 Thanked 34 Times in 18 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	4,000miles, 13x in for service, 2 computers and 1 motor replaced (Oct 31) Update: Scion Canada has now replaced my car with a new 2014 FR-S. The dealership in my area is also switching out all of my aftermarket parts to the new vehicle. In the end Scion/Toyota has done the right thing. Thanks for all the help and support. The power of social media is greater than most realize. Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in... (Oct 24) Update: So since I have wrote this, Toyota/Scion Canada has got back to me and said they are not going to replace my car, they are going to fix it....for the 13 time. I told them that this was unacceptable, but they honestly don't care about how the customer feels. I just thought I would tell you all my story.... I purchased a Scion FR-S from Toyota on March 2, 2013. The car had 1000 km on it at the time of purchase. I was informed that it was in perfect working condition from the salesman at the time. With 1000 km on it, one would assume there would be no issues as it was a brand new vehicle. The car almost immediately began experiencing problems. The first time we took it in for service in Calgary was March 12 –not even two weeks after purchasing it. They have not been able to get the car to run problem free for any extended amount of time. We have had a loaner vehicle for weeks at a time periodically since March. The car was bought from a Toyota dealership that failed to mention that it had already been in for service at 600kms and had the computer system replaced because of the same CEL light that has been an ongoing issue since I bought it. Below is a list of the service visits and corresponding issues (in each of the instances below I was only able to drive the car a couple hundred kilometers before the CEL would reappear): 1. (March12,2013)No engine light. Brought car in because it had idle issues / rpm dropping. Service told me that there was nothing they could do and that is the way they are made. Many other FR-S owners have complained of this issue. 2. Check Engine Light on. Service said they could not get the error to repeat itself and said it was probably a “one off” and removed the engine light. 3. Check Engine Light on. Service said it was a valve error. They swapped valve banks around to see if the issue would follow. 4. Check Engine Light on. Service ordered new valve. Turned Engine light off. 5. Check Engine Light on. Took in for valve replacement. 6. Drove car for approximately 15kms then total Engine failure. Dropped off at Toyota (Car in shop for approx30days). Replaced engine. 7. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light 8. Check Engine Light on. Service could not recreate error…turned off light. 9. Check Engine Light on. They wanted me to get the light to come on again and explain exactly what was happening when it comes on. 10. Check Engine Light on. Explained what happened. Service ordered a new part .(Air/Fuel Sensor I believe) 11. Check Engine Light on. Came to get part installed. Car in shop for 8 days. When I came back, they decided that replacing that part was not going to fix anything. Nothing was done. Engine light was turned off. 12. Check Engine Light on. Left car in shop. Received car back…nothing done. Drove car home (5kms) and it had lost about30% of its power. Called Toyota they came and picked up my car. Service said they ran a test on Cylinder #2 and it came back faulty…then they ran another test in which it came back “within parameters”. So basically saying, Cylinder #2 in a brand new motor is flawed…but “good enough”. Service Techs were able to recreate the CEL light this time. Replaced Computer system (for the second time). 13. Check Engine Light on. Service techs cannot find issue and tell me that my aftermarket exhaust (from the CAT back, which I cleared with Toyota before the purchase) needs to be taken off and the stock exhaust put back on. All of these issues were happening before the exhaust was put on, but they wanted a stock setup. Picked up my car 5 days later drove it for 30 seconds….engine light came on, drove back into service bay. The techs thought I had forgot something.....Currently, the car is still in for service. It is obvious that no one knows what is wrong with the car. I have taken it in to service13times in six months with no resolution. The engine has been totally replaced and the computer system has been replaced twice. I have had a loaner vehicle for almost as much time as I have had the car. The latest attempt at resolution has the service manager in possession of my car, driving it for a number of days so they can document on a computer what is happening at all times. They have recorded the CEL light numerous times while this computer has been connected, but even that has failed to capture all the data. I understand the need for troubleshooting, but the amount of times this problem is happening is excessive. I have recently lodged a complaint with Toyota / Scion Canada on September 30th letting them know at this point in time, the only option that is going to satisfy me is to have the vehicle replaced. I have been more than patient and cooperative under the circumstances to the point that current Toyota employees have advised me to contact Toyota and request a replacement. It is evident by the details listed above that the engineers and mechanics are at a loss for what the underlying problem is with this car. I cannot continue to have my car that has 7000 km on it that I paid full value for from a dealership in for constant repairs. The amount of time and energy being displaced by this issue is becoming very excessive. My fear is that the car will continue to be problematic long after the warranty has expired. To date, the CEL has illuminated atleast15-20 times since the replaced engine was installed in which I have no idea the probable damage this has caused. The potential resale value of the vehicle has also been severely jeopardized should any buyer request a record of the service history. Toyota presents itself as a reputable, upstanding company that stands by their superior product which is why I purchased this vehicle and paid the "Toyota premium" for their quality..... Last edited by P5yk0t1c; 11-04-2013 at 06:32 PM.

10-23-2013, 09:46 PM	#2
P5yk0t1c Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2014 FR-S Location: Canada Posts: 84 Thanks: 29 Thanked 34 Times in 18 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I copy and pasted that into the forum window...not sure what happened to the editing...my apologies.

10-23-2013, 09:55 PM	#3
n0m0h0s Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Drives: #2148 frs 10 series Location: Oakland. CA Posts: 57 Thanks: 30 Thanked 18 Times in 16 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	In california sounds like the lemon law would apply and you would have all your money refunded here in cali. Sorry for your issues

10-23-2013, 10:04 PM	#4
Mad1723 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Drives: Asphalt FR-S Location: Quebec, Canada Posts: 654 Thanks: 822 Thanked 418 Times in 222 Posts Mentioned: 6 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	I'd go for a Lemon law too. Get a 2014 with the refund or simply swap to another car. All the best in your "adventure"

10-23-2013, 10:20 PM	#6
PMPB Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Drives: BRZ Sport-tech Location: Canada Posts: 347 Thanks: 77 Thanked 182 Times in 111 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	You should STRONGLY consider taking this before Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan (CAMVAP) It's our equivalent of the lemon law, a little less well defined in terms of how much BS you have to put up before a manufacturer will be bound to do something by the CAMVAP, but it sounds to me like you'll probably have a good shot at getting Toyota/Scion to buy this thing back. P.S. Just because you are having issues, and this forum represents the vocal minority, doesn't mean that the BRZ/FR-S/GT-86 should be condemned and anyone considering buying it should strongly reconsider. Don't paint the model with the same brush man. That said, I'm really sorry to hear about your issues. I can only imagine how frustrated you must be.

10-23-2013, 10:51 PM	#7
ZionsWrath Thanks Join Date: Apr 2013 Drives: BRZ Location: NY Posts: 4,163 Thanks: 5,989 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,498 Posts Mentioned: 38 Post(s) Tagged: 3 Thread(s)	I hope it was at least sold to you as a used vehicle with 1000km... Do your best to get rid of that car, I'd be pissed as fuk

10-23-2013, 10:52 PM	#8
thill Senior Member Join Date: May 2012 Drives: 2020 SS1LE (previous 13 BRZ owner) Location: North Pole Posts: 2,753 Thanks: 328 Thanked 1,463 Times in 802 Posts Mentioned: 20 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Incredibly frustrating.. Something to consider in the future, if a car has 600miles on it, you should certainly question why the original buyer returned it, and never believe anything a salesman tells you. They just want to sell you the car. All of this said, Toyota/Scion should take care of you, and if not, get a lawyer.

10-24-2013, 12:49 AM	#10
R.S-HawK Banned Join Date: Oct 2013 Drives: '13 Gen Coupe 3.8 R Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 387 Thanks: 52 Thanked 151 Times in 73 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	That sucks man. I really feel for your troubles. I too would lawyer up if Toyota doesn't make it right. Also, for what it's worth, get your bank involved if you're paying a loan on the car.

10-24-2013, 01:21 AM	#11
ZZT86 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Drives: BR86 Location: Location Posts: 841 Thanks: 310 Thanked 146 Times in 114 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	When was it built ? Definitely get TMC to replace it & let them figure it out in their time what is wrong with the car OR seek palatable compensation for your suffering.

10-24-2013, 01:36 AM	#12
Tien JDM GT86 Join Date: Oct 2013 Drives: 2013 Toyota GT86 2012 Honda Inspire Location: Ohio Posts: 32 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Man this is crazy. Where did Toyota and Subaru go wrong? Besides the chirping I love my car a lot. You know what I don't feel so bad anymore about my chirping after hearing your story. I pray you will get your resolution ASAP.

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10-24-2013, 01:38 AM	#13
humfrz Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Drives: 2013 FR-S, white, MT Location: Puyallup, WA Posts: 30,432 Thanks: 29,826 Thanked 32,845 Times in 16,844 Posts Mentioned: 715 Post(s) Tagged: 2 Thread(s)	Yep, I agree with those that say you should get a different car. That one is "sick". Life is too short to put up with a "sick" car. humfrz

10-24-2013, 02:32 AM	#14
forzajuve Banned Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: Ultramarine 86 - 6MT Location: California Posts: 533 Thanks: 184 Thanked 139 Times in 82 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	You definitely got a bad egg. I agree that you should have the vehicle replaced and you should not only request it but DEMAND it. Once all the warranties runs out, who knows what other problems you will have an how much money it will cost you. Not only that, your car has had so many problems and so much work done to it, who would want it if you were to sell it? It has lost all respectable value as far as I am concerned. Your patience should definitely be commended and good luck, I hope it works out for you.