All season tires

[ZionsWrath]

This thread is funny. How can anyone defend any all season being even close to a snow tire in snow is beyond me. Sure if you crawl you will probably make it home but I don't like to have white knuckles when there is more than a inch or two on the ground.

As for the PA3 reference above, that is a "performance winter" tire as in compromised snow traction for better non snow traction.

I would love to see a set of half worn cheap snows, say General Altimax Arctic, vs any brand new all season.

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by ZionsWrath

This thread is funny. How can anyone defend any all season being even close to a snow tire in snow is beyond me. Sure if you crawl you will probably make it home but I don't like to have white knuckles when there is more than a inch or two on the ground.

As for the PA3 reference above, that is a "performance winter" tire as in compromised snow traction for better non snow traction.

I would love to see a set of half worn cheap snows, say General Altimax Arctic, vs any brand new all season.

Good enough isn't the same thing as equal to.

Summer tires are dangerously useless in winter regardless of driver skill. All season tires may be adequate, maybe not. Depends on local conditions and, above all, driver skill. Driving in even deep snow on all season tires isn't difficult, especially if you've driven for forty winters.

The only truly white knuckle winter driving I've done is on winter tires except just the once when the road was so slippery you could hardly stand up on it, no tire works then unless it is studded, which I don't recommend.

And half worn winter tires are actually nearly worn out. They start at around 11 mm and by 6 mm they will indeed be worse than a new all season, particularly the Continental DWS which is pretty impressive in snow or on ice.

[ZionsWrath]

Driving slow is not difficult. Being able to stop when you need to in snow is beyond the scope of "driver skill" someone has acquired over "forty winters"

A 15 year old will stop sooner, steer better, and maintain control at higher speeds with a snow tire than a 55 year old on all seasons.

There is a reason regions of Canada REQUIRE snow tires.

Overall the bottom line is, do your absolute best to avoid driving in snow. There are too many variables in those conditions. You could have a lifted 4x4 machine and someone on slicks is trying to get home and totals your car.

[switchlanez]

For areas with light snow, all-seasons are perfect (in my area it typically snows 2 weeks out of the year). And there seems to be a misconception that the stock Michelin Primacy HP tires are all-seasons. Tirerack labels them as Grand Touring Summer tires. Or are they wrong?

I run with Hankook Ventus S1 noble2 which were recently rated by Tirerack to be the best overall Ultra High Performance All-Season tire: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=173

Compared to Max Performance Summer tires, Ultra High Performance All-Seasons generally provide better comfort, quietness, fuel economy, longevity, and price. My Hankooks may get outperformed by summer tires but their performance, feedback, and handling feel are quite a sporty step up over stock. I took them out on twisty backroads and noticed they had great dry grip with a predictable, linear feel as I'd approach the limit. Plus there's the fun factor of being able to get the tail loose in low speed corners despite mine being 235 width. Might require more effort than stock but [I imagine] less effort than Michelin PSS. That's generally the trade-off.

[Scenic Driver]

Originally Posted by marine6680

Ok thanks. Hopefully the stock tires will be OK until spring time.

I bought my car in Feb, the stock tires will work fine in 30 degree weather as long as there is no snow or ice. Of course you're going to want to drive a bit slower at those temps because you still won't have as much grip.

[switchlanez]

Here's Tirerack's video review comparing Ultra High Performance All-Season tires.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxzqXRAuDV0"]Tire Rack - Testing Value Priced Ultra High Performance All-Season Tires - YouTube[/ame]


Continental DWS was not included but it seems to get a lot of praise on this forum. The only metrics I could find to compare it against the tires that won in Tirerack's review (Hankook Ventus S1 noble2) were weight and price. The Hankooks both cost and weigh less.

[rainmonkey]

@switchlanez how are your tires? I live in MA and am really trying to decide what two tire setups I should get.

I don't need to commute to work or anything like that - if I wanted to, I could just opt to leave my car in the garage when the snow's bad. I can go either of 3 routes:
1. Dedicated summer tires like Hankook RS3's or v12sand dedicated winter tires like Blizzaks
2. Dedicated summer tires like Hankook RS3's or v12's and UHP tires like your Hankook S1 or DWS
3. UHP tires like your Hankook S1 or DWS and dedicated winter tires like Blizzaks.

Logic behind each:
1 - prepare for both extremes - best performance during the summer, best performance during the snow. However when it isn't snowing but it's still cold (32f or the like) won't the winter tires be kinda of overkill?

2 - get the best of the handling world in that summer/warm months I can use the RS3 then when it gets cold I can swap out to the S1 (which I think probably are better than blizzaks in terms of non-snow performance) - I'll be fine in the freezing temps, and still manage to survive in light dusting of snow. Caveat being that I'll be shaky when it snows heavily - granted I can just opt to not use the car when it's terrible outside

3 - Hedging against the worst types of weather - I can use the UHP year round - summer and winter although performance will suffer a bit in the summer compared to RS3. Then when it gets to be heavy snow, I can swap out for the blizzaks. This way I can keep relatively good handling characteristics throughout the year.

Long post, but I appreciate any input.

Thank you!

[rainmonkey]

Sorry, I usually dislike bumping for a reply... but I'm looking to get tires and mount new wheels next week. Does anyone happen to have input? ^

Thanks

[cbf]

Rainmonkey --

I don't have any comment on your non-winter tires. I intend to keep the stock Michelins as my non-winter tire for now. However, as a fellow Massachusetts resident, I plan to put winter tires on my car sometime in November, and probably keep them on until around the first week in April.

I drove my WRX (which I just traded in for the BRZ on Tuesday!) on All Season tires for years, but I had a really scary experience last year when I had to drive to Worcester during the March 8 blizzard. The Sumitomo A/S P01s I had on my car were just awful. It took my 37 years of driving skill and considerable winter experience to keep the car from spinning out on the MA Pike. I decided then and there that I'm going with dedicated snow tires for this winter just like we used to do in the old days.

And that's even though I don't intend to ever drive my BRZ in a blizzard. But neither do I intend to garage the BRZ for the winter. If there's an unplowed inch or so on my street, I'll have better peace of mind with real winter rubber on my car.

I have not decided yet whether to go with a H-rated "Performance Winter/Snow", or just a T-rated "Studless Ice & Snow". Tire Rack recommends a Blizzak WS70 (T rated), and I think this is also what my Subaru dealer sells. But the Continental ExtremeWinterContact (T-rated) looks good to me, or perhaps the ContiWinterContact (H-rated). Right now I'm leaning toward H-rated.

But note that I plan to get these in 205/55R16 -- a size down from the stock tires, which also means a new set of wheels (and yes, I intend to pay the $200 for a second set of TPMS sensors as well). Tire Rack has a good article: http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/...jsp?techid=126 explaining why it's best to buy winter tires a size down.

[ZionsWrath]

I took option of summers and all seasons. I have driven a car on snows before and it really sucks the fun out trying to drive them hard when not snowing. I just don't drive my car in active snowfall.

Also consider this. Snow tires have more snow traction but are worse than all seasons in non snow/ice conditions which is likely a.majority of driving.

[rainmonkey]

@ZionsWrath
supposedly the Mich Pilot Sport A/S 3 is pretty good... granted a lot of the stuff I read and watched about it were from Mich...
Pity they only came out this year so they haven't really been exposed to a real winter yet.

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by rainmonkey

@switchlanez how are your tires? I live in MA and am really trying to decide what two tire setups I should get.

I don't need to commute to work or anything like that - if I wanted to, I could just opt to leave my car in the garage when the snow's bad. I can go either of 3 routes:
1. Dedicated summer tires like Hankook RS3's or v12sand dedicated winter tires like Blizzaks
2. Dedicated summer tires like Hankook RS3's or v12's and UHP tires like your Hankook S1 or DWS
3. UHP tires like your Hankook S1 or DWS and dedicated winter tires like Blizzaks.

Logic behind each:
1 - prepare for both extremes - best performance during the summer, best performance during the snow. However when it isn't snowing but it's still cold (32f or the like) won't the winter tires be kinda of overkill?

2 - get the best of the handling world in that summer/warm months I can use the RS3 then when it gets cold I can swap out to the S1 (which I think probably are better than blizzaks in terms of non-snow performance) - I'll be fine in the freezing temps, and still manage to survive in light dusting of snow. Caveat being that I'll be shaky when it snows heavily - granted I can just opt to not use the car when it's terrible outside

3 - Hedging against the worst types of weather - I can use the UHP year round - summer and winter although performance will suffer a bit in the summer compared to RS3. Then when it gets to be heavy snow, I can swap out for the blizzaks. This way I can keep relatively good handling characteristics throughout the year.

Long post, but I appreciate any input.

Thank you!

Sorry, I seem to have missed the notification when you tagged my name weeks back. I haven't had time in the snow on the S1 and recently moved out of a snow area to a non-snow area so I can't comment on snow driving. But for occasional dry weather spirited drives, they've been great. My suspension is somewhat stiffer than stock so I actually value the extra comfort of the S1. They perform well for the cost and will last a bit longer. I'm satisfied with them being my only set of tires. But if you're chasing grip above all else, you'll want the RS3, MPSS, or DW for the good value.

So what did you end up getting?

Hankook recently released this feature highlight video the S1. Kinda cheesy but it seems to be their flagship and a new marketing thing as I couldn't find feature vids of any of their other tire models.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-4U3OcbS_s"]Ventus S1 Noble2 Eng - YouTube[/ame]

[rainmonkey]

@switchlanez
I took a gamble and ended up getting UHP all-seasons: Mich Pilot Sport A/S 3
So far they're much better than stock (obviously) and we'll see how they hold up in light snow. I figured it's a good compromise, plus it's not like I'm a serious competitor.

What I was most concerned about was cold weather performance (non-snow). At the track I'm a little less satisfied, but most things are pointing to my alignment as the reason. I need to get that part fixed haha

[ZionsWrath]

You track on all all seasons? Won't they chunk off?