Are you faster with traction control on or off?

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by njccmd2002

back in da dayz there was none of this crap. Traction control? bah! that did not exist.

So now a days we drive with all this nannies, because they exist. next thing you know we'll have automatic wipers in the toilets, and people wont be able to go without.

what a shame...

My first car, which I drove for 10 years, didn't have ABS. It is a totally stupid system and a hindrance to your driving abilities. Pull that fuse, it is just a nanny for people that don't know proper threshold braking and you all are going to be too dependent on it... Go on, permanently disable your ABS, it is the exact same principle. Someone please explain to me how it is any different.

[Luis_GT]

Originally Posted by cfusionpm

You can't fix everything with electronics, but to imply that one of the most advanced computer controlled all wheel drive systems in the world is no more stable than a traditional rear wheel drive car is not only ridiculous, but a complete detachment from reality. Especially since cars like the GTR put down equal or faster lap times than cars with more power and less weight, not to mention significantly more stable in imperfect conditions.

Obvious troll is obvious.

Do you even have any evidence that the record was set with traction control.

Only troll here is you, since you're only defense for TC is using a car that is basically a computer dressed up as a car.

[cfusionpm]

Originally Posted by Luis_GT

Do you even have any evidence that the record was set with traction control.

Only troll here is you, since you're only defense for TC is using a car that is basically a computer dressed up as a car.

Well there's also the fact that traction control and stability control are banned from Formula 1 because it gives several seconds a lap worth of advantage to drivers with it while requiring much less precise input from the driver. The 1992 and 93 Williams cars come to mind.

[ftc~brz]

off

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by cfusionpm

Well there's also the fact that traction control and stability control are banned from Formula 1 because it gives several seconds a lap worth of advantage to drivers with it while requiring much less precise input from the driver. The 1992 and 93 Williams cars come to mind.

Don't forget the controversy that Schumacher probably won his first championship with illegal ABS.

You know what, I kind of miss Flavio...

[Luis_GT]

Originally Posted by cfusionpm

Well there's also the fact that traction control and stability control are banned from Formula 1 because it gives several seconds a lap worth of advantage to drivers with it while requiring much less precise input from the driver. The 1992 and 93 Williams cars come to mind.

From all that I've read about TC in Formula 1, it was outlawed cause it allowed the drivers to conserve the tires... and F1 wants a lot of tires to go to waste, even making Pirelli create tires that don't last as long...

[Lauren]

It doesn't matter, not really. I could put slicks on and go faster but would I have as much fun?

That's the point isn't it really?

IME (I have some racing experience and 13 years of trackdays), I recently competed in the TSS in the UK. I did all my runs with everything off. I think it's faster when you are four wheel drifting and you are maintaining speed at least. In that circumstance backing off would make you slower.

It's also a lot more fun and a lot more involving. There's a reason I drive a car with a manual gearbox after all.

[cfusionpm]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Don't forget the controversy that Schumacher probably won his first championship with illegal ABS.

You know what, I kind of miss Flavio...

Then there's this from June of this year: http://jalopnik.com/has-red-bull-fig...-con-514107361

[Luis_GT]

Originally Posted by cfusionpm

Then there's this from June of this year: http://jalopnik.com/has-red-bull-fig...-con-514107361

All I see is wheel hop...

[bestwheelbase]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

3-point seatbelts, airbags, and crumple zones weren't always standard features either. I wonder how much weight you could take out of the car by removing all of the airbags? Or is that not in the category of being nice to have "just in case".

Even the most expert drivers in the world make mistakes...

Seat belts, air bags, crumple zones don't try to drive the car for me.

[cfusionpm]

Originally Posted by Luis_GT

From all that I've read about TC in Formula 1, it was outlawed cause it allowed the drivers to conserve the tires... and F1 wants a lot of tires to go to waste, even making Pirelli create tires that don't last as long...

From wiki:

"The Williams FW15C was a Renault-powered Formula One car designed by Adrian Newey and built by Williams Grand Prix Engineering. It was raced by Alain Prost and Damon Hill during the 1993 Formula One season.

As the car that won both the drivers' and constructors' championships in the last season before the FIA banned electronic driver aids, the FW15C has a decent claim to be the most technologically sophisticated Formula One car of all time, incorporating anti-lock brakes, traction control and active suspension.[2]"

[DylanFRS]

Well the original question has been answered about the same by everyone. It is faster to not use VSC/TC.

The moral issue of leaving TSC on or off for regular commuting or on the street is just that, a moral issue and thus is never going to get resolved.

[cfusionpm]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

Well the original question has been answered about the same by everyone. It is faster to not use VSC/TC.

More accurately, it is faster not to use our system in our cars. It's definitely not true for all TC in all cars. Many electronic aid systems exist to make cars much faster (like the Williams or any number of road going supercars), but it's all a product of design, coding, and implementation.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Luis_GT

From all that I've read about TC in Formula 1, it was outlawed cause it allowed the drivers to conserve the tires... and F1 wants a lot of tires to go to waste, even making Pirelli create tires that don't last as long...

The tire conservation is a byproduct, there have been two bans on driver aids (off the top of my head), one in the early 90's, then they were allowed again after a couple of years and another ban beginning in 2007. I watched some of the 2005/2006 seasons and they did it because races were boring as fuck, a driver could stomp on the brakes and mash the gas (within reason) and not really worry about anything other than the engine blowing up or the brakes overheating, everything boiled down to pit strategy since you could run at 95% all day with few repercussions.

The fastest lap times ever set were done in the era of unrestricted drivers aids and more open engine regulations, 2002 is regarded as the fastest year in Formula 1 with many lap records still standing. Traction Control and ABS were definitely a factor in producing better lap times during those eras as teams with less sophisticated systems were unable to maximize their grip as well as the Ferrari, Mclaren and Williams of the time.

Edit:
The driver aids on F1 cars were very rigorously tuned for each track and each drivers style, I do not believe the aids in our car are beneficial for producing a better laptime (unless you're sooo off base with car control that any aid helps) but rather tuned for driver control in situations where the average person would lose control and cause an accident.