I think Toyota/Scion is making a BIG mistake with the FR-S' suspension tuning

[MiguelAE86]

Guys relax everyone who buys this car will automatically be a D1GP driver, its an 86.

[DMS Racing]

You can always get the car to how you like it by reset the Geometry setup, I am sure a lot of aftermarket company will release camber kit and toe control kit for this car. And the factory rear and front toe is adjustable anyway, if we are lucky the rear camber might be adjustable too.

We can setup it up with more rear grip if you like.

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by mhj555

Well yeah, that's why this car comes with vehicle stability control. It looks so out of place in such a bare bones interior car, but they probably predicted people would spin them out without it...especially here in the north east where roads are pretty slick much of the year.

No, it comes with it because it is federally mandated to come with it. Manufacturers would still be charging for seatbelts if they weren't mandated

[Zgrinch]

Originally Posted by Impey Barbicane

My problem is not with the car. I'm glad they are building it this way, because I enjoy cars like this. But I also live in the real world, where driver training is pretty much nonexistent and people grossly overestimate their driving skills. Add in the fact that this thing is aimed straight at the drifting crowd who- let's face it- are just asking to wreck, and you have a recipe for disaster. And don't forget, lawyers can smell blood in the water a mile away. The first time somebody gets killed practicing their tofu delivery technique, you can bet Toyota's chassis tuning will go under the microscope.

When that happens, you'll be wishing they'd dialed in a little understeer from the factory.

WOW! *warning rant on*
So the solution to inexperienced drivers is to have Toyota take responsibility and change the understeer ?
What ever happened to personal responsibility in this country?
I am fed up with the "babysit" the masses mentality of some in this generation and our Government.

If you are the slowest Gazelle in the herd, then either learn to run faster, or get eaten - that is the "real" world.
*rant off*

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by Zgrinch

WOW! *warning rant on*
So the solution to inexperienced drivers is to have Toyota take responsibility and change the understeer ?
What ever happened to personal responsibility in this country?
I am fed up with the "babysit" the masses mentality of some in this generation and our Government.

If you are the slowest Gazelle in the herd, then either learn to run faster, or get eaten - that is the "real" world.
*rant off*

"Pussification" of America. It's real.

[Zgrinch]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

"Pussification" of America. It's real.

Doesn't mean we have to accept it, agree with it, and mostly importantly, bow down to it, by suggesting that the car maker is the one making a BIG mistake for somehow not factoring in inexperienced drivers, when it is really the drivers issue. - wouldn't you agree ?

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by Zgrinch

Doesn't mean we have to accept it, agree with it, and mostly importantly, bow down to it, by suggesting that the car maker is the one making a BIG mistake for somehow not factoring in inexperienced drivers, when it is really the drivers issue. - wouldn't you agree ?

Relegating it to a driver's issue is a mistake. It makes you forget who the real villain is, who the one letting all of us down is: the Gov't. I don't like over-regulation and big Gov't...but we need some serious institutional change on the DMV/MVA/driver education side of things. Stepped and graded licenses like the rest of the world (see: Canada, England, any motorcycle license anywhere outside of US) would improve drivers for sure. Ever seen the kind of shit they have to do to get their licenses over there?

These are, in general, nearly 2 ton steel deathtraps we're talking about here. More education is needed. I know how to drive, but 90% of people don't. I'm not worried about me, I'm worried about the asshole who's going to hit me!

[Zgrinch]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

Relegating it to a driver's issue is a mistake. It makes you forget who the real villain is, who the one letting all of us down is: the Gov't. I don't like over-regulation and big Gov't...but we need some serious institutional change on the DMV/MVA/driver education side of things. Stepped and graded licenses like the rest of the world (see: Canada, England, any motorcycle license anywhere outside of US) would improve drivers for sure. Ever seen the kind of shit they have to do to get their licenses over there?

These are, in general, nearly 2 ton steel deathtraps we're talking about here. More education is needed. I know how to drive, but 90% of people don't. I'm not worried about me, I'm worried about the asshole who's going to hit me!

Ok, I would would agree with most of what you posted above. I was responding to your thread title. I would be all for more stringent driver education as a requirement for acquiring a drivers license, and I woulld want that driver certification education to be provided by the private sector, not the government.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by Zgrinch

Ok, I would would agree with most of what you posted above. I was responding to your thread title. I would be all for more stringent driver education as a requirement for acquiring a drivers license, and I woulld want that driver certification education to be provided by the private sector, not the government.

Mandated by the Gov't is what I meant.

As far as the pussification of America goes, it seems to be largely unstoppable given the IQ of the average American.

[delongedoug]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

Mandated by the Gov't is what I meant.

As far as the pussification of America goes, it seems to be largely unstoppable given the IQ of the average American.

I hate this idea because it means the dumber we are, the more reliant we are on the government to do everything for us. "Well, we can't trust you to make decisions at intersections so we added stoplights". I can tell when no one's fucking coming, asswipes!

<- Treats stoplights like stopsigns daily.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by delongedoug

I hate this idea because it means the dumber we are, the more reliant we are on the government to do everything for us. "Well, we can't trust you to make decisions at intersections so we added stoplights". I can tell when no one's fucking coming, asswipes!

<- Treats stoplights like stopsigns daily.

So the answer is to let people be dumb and keep getting dumber, bearing in mind that we're talking about driving which is the MOST dangerous activity you do EVERY day? Makes a LOT of sense.

[#87]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

So basically the OP is complaining that the rear of an FR-S will hit an innocent bystander/car with the current suspension tuning versas understeering straight into the innocent bystander with the suspension tuning he'd prefer they have?

Both result from an someone driving above his/her or the car's limits.

Nothing would make me want to avoid buying this car more than the setup he proposes.

And to clarify since no one has really pointed it out literally yet (that I saw), near the limits, lift throttle IS NEVER THE RIGHT MOVE.

lol, I thought of this when you said that

[u2b]zoICf55jED8[/u2b]

[delongedoug]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

So the answer is to let people be dumb and keep getting dumber, bearing in mind that we're talking about driving which is the MOST dangerous activity you do EVERY day? Makes a LOT of sense.

You're right, humans shouldn't be allowed to drive. Can't trust them.

[Dark]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

So the answer is to let people be dumb and keep getting dumber, bearing in mind that we're talking about driving which is the MOST dangerous activity you do EVERY day? Makes a LOT of sense.

Originally Posted by delongedoug

You're right, humans shouldn't be allowed to drive. Can't trust them.

What are we?
I don't trust most people on the road either, so stoplight should be there to serve its purpose.