AVO turbo kit for BRZ - initial build thread

[Tansey86]

Originally Posted by Ravenlokk

For stage 2? Couldn't find any confirmation from AVO in the thread. Toooo many pages!!

Because they didnt mention any changes to the downpipe, im assuming the downpipe is the same for both stage 1 and 2. Realistically downpipe size at 2.5 will be good for more than most people will get out of this car. I talked to Paul and he said you can pretty much change anything on this kit and I will probably be opting for the 3" variation.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

Flywheel torque?

This isn't wheel torque fellas.. let's see the wheel torque.

Peak torque really looks like about 219-220ftlbs, quite a bit different from 254..

[ngabdala]

I feel like there isn't enough transparency with this kit.

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Flywheel torque?

This isn't wheel torque fellas.. let's see the wheel torque.

Peak torque really looks like about 219-220ftlbs, quite a bit different from 254..

[JoeBoxer]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Flywheel torque?

This isn't wheel torque fellas.. let's see the wheel torque.

Peak torque really looks like about 219-220ftlbs, quite a bit different from 254..

The screen says flywheel but that is at the wheels, i'm pretty sure Crawford's dyno says the same thing i don't know why it is confusing.

[Tansey86]

It says flywheel but it is actually wheel horsepower. This misconception has been covered several times I believe. Stage 1 is 230rwhp, do you really think they lost 10rwhp by upping the boost and finishing the exhaust?

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Flywheel torque?

This isn't wheel torque fellas.. let's see the wheel torque.

Peak torque really looks like about 219-220ftlbs, quite a bit different from 254..

Originally Posted by ngabdala

I feel like there isn't enough transparency with this kit.

It is a Dynopack Dyno. Crawford has the same deal and Perrin too. These Dynos call "Flywheel HP" the wheel hubs.

Just as a quick example,



This is Perrin's chart. He already explained why it is as well as Crawford as well as AVO.

[deucethemoose]

Originally Posted by ngabdala

I feel like there isn't enough transparency with this kit.

Transparent enough?

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315BAOsePsk"]Drift-Office : AVO TurboWorld 6MT FRS Turbo Kit ~ Stage 1 - YouTube[/ame]

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by JoeBoxer

The screen says flywheel but that is at the wheels, i'm pretty sure Crawford's dyno says the same thing i don't know why it is confusing.

That's even worse. That means the graph is a lie.

It mathmatically does NOT work. If you know the RPM and either HP or TQ you can mathmatically determine the other, and the numbers DO NOT work in the posted graph.

Example, if we have torque and RPM, we determine horsepower by: HP=TQ*RPM/5252. If we have HP and RPM, we determine torque by: TQ=5252*HP/RPM

So, if we use the spot they have a cursor on around 3225rpm, they show basically 254lbft of torque and approx 137-138hp, but lets call it 140.

If we do the math...

HP=254*3225/5252
HP=156HP

TQ=5252*140/3225
TQ=228lbft

So if we use EITHER of their provided numbers at a set RPM, it simply DOES NOT work. You can pick any RPM, I did so with a few and the results were always the same - the graph doesn't make sense if both are wheel numbers.

So take you pick, both are wheel and the graph is a lie or one is calculated somehow. Both can't be wheel and accurate. Unless the Dynopack changes the fundamental definition of the relationship between HP and TQ of course.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

That's even worse. That means the graph is a lie.

It mathmatically does NOT work. If you know the RPM and either HP or TQ you can't mathmatically determine the other, and the numbers DO NOT work in the posted graph.

Example, if we have torque and RPM, we determine horsepower by: HP=TQ*RPM/5252. If we have HP and RPM, we determine torque by: TQ=5252*HP/RPM

So, if we use the spot they have a cursor on around 3225rpm, they show basically 254lbft of torque and approx 137-138hp, but lets call it 140.

If we do the math...

HP=254*3225/5252
HP=156HP

TQ=5252*140/3225
TQ=228lbft

So if we use EITHER of their provided numbers at a set RPM, it simply DOES NOT work. You can pick any RPM, I did so with a few and the results were always the same - the graph doesn't make sense if both are wheel numbers.

So take you pick, both are wheel and the graph is a lie or one is calculated somehow. Both can't be wheel and accurate. Unless the Dynopack changes the fundamental definition of the relationship between HP and TQ of course.

This has already been explained too. That Dyno graph shifts up the Torque side so that peak HP and peak TQ are in the same level line. Look at the torque scale on the left, you will see a different number then the HP scale on the right (this is the shifting). That is why they don't meet at 5252.

The numbers are not Lying. It doesn't say 279 TQ and 279 HP, it says 254 TQ and 279 HP, they look like that only because of the torque shift up. And again, it was not intended to mislead, as AVO had already explained it.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

This has already been explained too. That Dyno graph shifts up the Torque side so that peak HP and peak TQ are in the same level line. Look at the scale on the left, you will see a different number then the scale on the right. that is why they don't meet at 5252.

I'm not talking about where they cross, that's obvious.

Look up how to determine HP from TQ and RPM, the scale of a dyno chart doesn't mean ANYTHING. They could have provided just HP and RPM in a chart and you can calculate the torque.

The dyno itself doesn't even measure both, it calculates HP from TQ and RPM.

[ngabdala]

This kit just hasn't been through legit testing . Don't get me wrong I want this kit. There's more to a kit than dyno charts.

Where's the application on a track or even on the street? The videos are vague and I'd hardly call a drive to SEMA and a drifting clip a real test.

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

That's even worse. That means the graph is a lie.

It mathmatically does NOT work. If you know the RPM and either HP or TQ you can mathmatically determine the other, and the numbers DO NOT work in the posted graph.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

I'm not talking about where they cross, that's obvious.

Look up how to determine HP from TQ and RPM, the scale of a dyno chart doesn't mean ANYTHING. They could have provided just HP and RPM in a chart and you can calculate the torque.

The dyno itself doesn't even measure both, it calculates HP from TQ and RPM.

Oh yeah, I did not read the mathematical portion of your post and you are correct. It does not add up.

The only thing I can say is that it has been said since day one that Dyno chart is on Japan, and the Dyno chart to go by in the USA adds up and makes sense, the one that was done in Oregon for 230 HP and 198 TQ.

Here's the USA Dyno chart:

[Tansey86]

Yeah i guess data logging 1500mile road trips through every type of weather and below sealevel to 6000ft isnt enough. Read the first post, this kit has more r&d than any other kit in my opinion

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by deucethemoose

Transparent enough?

Hey, look at that, a quick check shows that math works.

Has nothing to do with the graph I was talking about from the JDM office though...