Installing Rods/Pistons, etc Is it Worth It?

[Strife26]

I've been considering getting my engine built, but I don't want to spend the money to build the engine from the shop and enjoy tearing the car apart and installing everything myself. I learn a lot and well hobby!

Opinions? Is it doable, is it a stupid idea? I keep watching videos and reading about it, and it doesn't seem impossible as long as I do my due diligence to learn the absolutely do not's, and the correct do's.

To me it looks like fun, but I have seen a couple people suggesting to never do it at home because it's too complex a task.

I know it'd save me a ton of money and also give me a new fun (I hope) project.

I'd be using the OEM tech book and google, etc.

P.S. I would love to add a higher boost spring assuming it could take a little more abuse (I know there are other aspects to consider too, but still, I could get a little more boost at least).

As always, I appreciate any and all responses!

[Hags86]

I don't see why you couldn't do the assembly if you want to learn and are willing to buy a few tools such as torque wrench, micrometers etc. Check out HP Academy. Their course are OK and they have a few on engine building.

But you will need machine work done so it's not a 100% DIY job.

[ermax]

If you haven’t done internal work in the past I wouldn’t make this your first project. It’s significantly more difficult to work on this engine than most and you will need a lot of tools. If you want it built and want to save money then pull it yourself, tear it down to the block and then let a pro rebuild the block. The bulk of the labor comes in the tear down, cleaning and reassembly. The block build is easy as far as labor is concerned. It just requires expertise, knowledge and tools.

I just rebuilt my engine and I probably have 15hours in cleaning alone. That isn’t an exaggeration.

Some tools I’m guessing you don’t already have that you would need just to pull the engine:
Floor jack
Jack stands
Engine lift
Engine stand

If you want you pull it apart and let a shop do the rest you will need some more tools:
6 point sockets
Hex sockets
Torx sockets
Crank pulley holder (unless you have an MT and you remove the crank bolt before pulling the engine)
Never mind, you need a pulley holder regardless because you need it to remove the cam gears)
..... on and on

If you get into rebuilding the block here are some more tools that come to mind:
Feeler gauges
Dial indicator
plastiguage
Ring compressor
Ridge reamer
Hone
6 point sockets
Torque wrench

Reassembling this engine requires lots of packing seal which has to be done correctly too.

My gut tells me you shouldn’t attempt this. If you have too google any of the tools I listed then this project isn’t for you. I understand you have to start somewhere but rebuilding the bottom end isn’t a good starting point.

[valtore101]

Originally Posted by Strife26

I've been considering getting my engine built, but I don't want to spend the money to build the engine from the shop and enjoy tearing the car apart and installing everything myself. I learn a lot and well hobby!

Opinions? Is it doable, is it a stupid idea? I keep watching videos and reading about it, and it doesn't seem impossible as long as I do my due diligence to learn the absolutely do not's, and the correct do's.

To me it looks like fun, but I have seen a couple people suggesting to never do it at home because it's too complex a task.

I know it'd save me a ton of money and also give me a new fun (I hope) project.

I'd be using the OEM tech book and google, etc.

P.S. I would love to add a higher boost spring assuming it could take a little more abuse (I know there are other aspects to consider too, but still, I could get a little more boost at least).

As always, I appreciate any and all responses!

You're only going to save $500-1000 doing it yourself. You still have to have all of the surfaces machined, cylinders honed (probably bored also), bearing mains polished, etc. If you just stick new pistons and rods straight on your existing block and crank as is, the motor won't be nearly as efficient and probably wont get below 5% leak down.

[D-rek07]

Originally Posted by ermax

My gut tells me you shouldn’t attempt this. If you have too google any of the tools I listed then this project isn’t for you. I understand you have to start somewhere but rebuilding the bottom end isn’t a good starting point.

What do you suggest is a good starting point? How is anyone supposed to learn how to do anything if they're not allowed to learn anything?

[ermax]

Originally Posted by D-rek07

What do you suggest is a good starting point? How is anyone supposed to learn how to do anything if they're not allowed to learn anything?

First off not start on a daily driver and not on an engine that is a pain in the ass to work on. For all I know he's never even done a clutch.

My progresion was something like this:
refill the gas tank
oil change/filter
fuel filter
valve adjustment
clutch
springs
coil overs
rod bearing from the pan
full engine rebuild (head surface, valve seats, hone)
MT rebuild

This all started on an older car and I also had a close family friend who was a mechanic with a full shop with boring bar, head surfacing machine, valve machine, ect ect. He was also a great teacher in that he let you do all the work and was only there to guide.

Plus as you get older you tend to be more conservative and less adventurous and less likely to tell strangers on the internet to attempt a bottom end rebuild. If I was 20 years old I'd probably say, "Hell yeah go for it". Hahaha. It's one thing if you destroy a bearing and are forced to do a rebuild either at a shop or on your own. But this guy is considering doing all this work on a perfectly running engine with a large risk of coming out with an engine that will not last.

[gtengr]

Originally Posted by ermax

Reassembling this engine requires lots of packing seal which has to be done correctly too.

Gluing the block back together is a major drawback to me. Isn't a special fixture required to do this by the book?

Originally Posted by valtore101

You're only going to save $500-1000 doing it yourself. You still have to have all of the surfaces machined, cylinders honed (probably bored also), bearing mains polished, etc.

That is why my build plans would start with a fresh short block. I don't have anyone that I would trust for machine work on the block.

Originally Posted by D-rek07

What do you suggest is a good starting point? How is anyone supposed to learn how to do anything if they're not allowed to learn anything?

The catch is there are a lot of things to overlook. Clearance/geometry checks galore and a simple oversight can ruin a lot of otherwise good decisions. If you can fund it and afford to make mistakes, then there's no reason not to learn. Just be prepared to do a lot of reading and have patience when you're not sure how to advance to the next step.

[Submarinesonce]

if you want to learn to build an engine, you start in a 2500 Honda, not a 25000 frs...bad plan IMO

[Leonardo]

OP, I started by doing interior and stereo work. Then went on to do basic bolt-ons like: Exhaust, intake, springs, coils, and brakes. I have only done a few more complicated projects like: head gasket, clutch, and valve adjustment.


If you do not have a garage that your car can be taken apart in for (possibly) weeks, you have no business taking your car apart. If your idea of organization is to : throw all bolts in one bin, chances are you will have extra parts when you are finished.


I use label ziplock bags for my bolts, nuts, parts. It really helps. Also having the correct tools is a must. I watch a bunch of videos, buy any necessary tools, and then start my projects.


Don't take your engine apart if:


This is your first project.


It is your only car.


You don't have a garage to work in.




Good luck!

[ermax]

Originally Posted by gtengr

Gluing the block back together is a major drawback to me. Isn't a special fixture required to do this by the book?

No special tools. Just LOTS of cleaning. I went through about 8 cans are carb cleaner taking off all the packing. Applying the packing isn't that bad. You just have to go slow and be damn sure you don't put your arm in it before putting crap back on the car. Also get someone to help guide parts back on because you can't just slap the part on and then shift its position to line up bolt holes. If you slide the part you will mess up the packing. The timing cover was the trickiest to place on there correctly due to its size. It's hard to get your eyes lined up on the bolt holes on both ends at the same time without help. There are longer bolts on both ends of the timing cover. If I did it again I would have put those bolts in the cover to help guide the cover into place. That or buy some long bolts for the four corners and then cut their heads off so they could be used as guide studs. Then just pull them back out once it's placed and secured with a few other bolts.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Strife26

..
As always, I appreciate any and all responses!

Welp, Strife26, I have taken several engines apart (and put back together) in my years of wrenching, but there is no way I would try to rebuild the bottom end on a FA20 engine.

Just look at it, I believe that this engine was designed to be built at the factory and never re-built (just thrown away if it goes bad .. ).

I agree with the responses above, this would be a project that if you started, you may regret.

Sort of reminds me of the time I dropped a SLR camera in a rice field flooded with muddy water. Hell, I can take it apart, clean it up, put it back together and it will be good as new. WRONG!

So, one evening I sat down at the kitchen table, with good lighting and all of my "micro tools". I got that sucker ALL apart and cleaned up. But, when I went to put it back together, "all the holes were gone" as Johnny Cash said in a song. Shit, I think I've told this story before - oh well -

So, I packed all the pieces up in a cardboard box and took it into a camera repair shop and asked him how much he would charge to put it back together. He said that if I hadn't taken it all apart, the cleaning charge would be reasonable - but since I took it apart and messed with it, the charge would be more than if I would buy a new camera ..

Your call.




humfrz

[Ultramaroon]

@ermax is on point. Clean. Clean. Clean. Personally, I never approach a deep project with an end date in mind. Each step is its own mini project which must be done properly.


Don't even consider it unless you are mentally capable of breaking down the project into individual steps and approaching each of them with great patience.

[Strife26]

Originally Posted by Submarinesonce

if you want to learn to build an engine, you start in a 2500 Honda, not a 25000 frs...bad plan IMO

32k brz, lol. Silly series.blue.

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[Strife26]

Thanks all for the responses. Kind of what I feared; this engine is special, don't do it, won't have much, will require pro assistance somewhere.

Dang just tell me it's easy and I can do it! Kidding.

I have a friend who could/would help.

So far I've installed my exhaust (full), clutch + flywheel, short throw, shift bushing, turbo kit, oil catch can, pulleys (put stock back on post clutch), master brake cylinder, rear bushings (can't remember exact name) and some other small items. As frustrating as it's been, it's been a lot of fun and ive learned a ton.

All the videos make this task seem doable, but they aren't fa20 vids. I just want more boost or the option to add more boost without being scared of blowing my engine (even at 8lbs I'd like better rods just in case). I know I can still blow the engine and that many other items have a hard time with forced induction and the extra torque.

I'm capable, but that doesn't mean I could get passed all the small very important steps, which was kind of what I was looking for in asking about this. Another reason was so I can get the tools for the project and possibly do it now or on another car.

Also, I do have a second car and I am constantly under the hood tinkering with things or installating new toys.

I'll postpone it indefinitely or until I just don't care about the fear or hurting the car.

Lastly, I'd rather me do it, prepared to repair stuff I broke or got wrong than to depend on a shop to take my 10k or more where I learn absolutely nothing. So perhaps it will be a future project.

Thanks again for all the great responses.

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