Grey sealant chunks in oil filter..engine failure imminent?

[FrickingReallySlow]

So today I took out my oil filter and cut up the insides to get an idea of the condition of my engine. This is a 2015 FRS with 58K so the timing cover shouldn't have been opened before but I found a ridiculous amount of grey sealant chunks in the filter media. I've already sent the sample to blackstone for analysis but judging by the issues of J02 recall, engine failure might be imminent? I'm the 3rd owner so I don't have the complete history of the vehicle. I've been changing the oil/filter every 3months (usually 1.5k miles driven only) and this is the first time I've opened up the filter to see what's in there. Engine is running fine without any noise but this looks scary I'm on borrowed time most likely

What other sources of grey sealant are there that could do this? Oil pan? Head gasket 3bond 1217G? Valve cover sealant?

Should I drop the oil pan to try to clean up the sump/pickup?

[Ashikabi]

Well if they are in the filter then at least they aren't in your bearings or galleys. Dropping the pan to reduce the chance of the oil pickup becoming clogged certainly seems prudent. Saving for a new motor would probably also be prudent

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

[TommyW]

I’d pull the pan and inspect everything. Potentially a previous owner had a need to pull the cover and an inexperienced tech did the work.

[FrickingReallySlow]

Originally Posted by TommyW

I’d pull the pan and inspect everything. Potentially a previous owner had a need to pull the cover and an inexperienced tech did the work.

I'll most likely get the killerB oil pickup like most of you when I drop this pan. Would resealing the oil pan introduce new sealant material in the oil as well? Curious if you guys waited 24hrs before it cured to start driving around.

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

Well if they are in the filter then at least they aren't in your bearings or galleys. Dropping the pan to reduce the chance of the oil pickup becoming clogged certainly seems prudent. Saving for a new motor would probably also be prudent

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

Being FI, I've been saving but now debating if I should get rid of it. I double checked the engine VIN to make sure someone didn't swap in a 2013 engine so I'm good there. I have a 2015 engine in a 2015 car woohoo. If the Blackstone UOA comes back with just silicon levels high that's the best case scenario right now

[Ashikabi]

Just be careful to properly reseal the oil pan and you won't have any issues with that. The silicone problem isn't cause by silicone, but by improper install/application. It's possible there was a cam cover resealed or some such that's causing the current issue. I would expect those chunks to be pretty big to come loose though. I'm not really understanding why you have little tiny bits unless a big piece got pulled into a rotating part and was subsequently torn apart.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

[FrickingReallySlow]

Thanks that's a good observation! The pieces are all super thin and look like flakes which I was raking my mind thinking where sealant could be that thin and break off, guess my rotating parts made them that way.

Do you know what these tubes are for in the oil pan? are these gallery drains from the heads or somewhere else?

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

Just be careful to properly reseal the oil pan and you won't have any issues with that. The silicone problem isn't cause by silicone, but by improper install/application. It's possible there was a cam cover resealed or some such that's causing the current issue. I would expect those chunks to be pretty big to come loose though. I'm not really understanding why you have little tiny bits unless a big piece got pulled into a rotating part and was subsequently torn apart.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by FrickingReallySlow

Thanks that's a good observation! The pieces are all super thin and look like flakes which I was raking my mind thinking where sealant could be that thin and break off, guess my rotating parts made them that way.



Do you know what these tubes are for in the oil pan? are these gallery drains from the heads or somewhere else?

I do not know where those come from.

If it's flakes, I guess it could have been wiped on a surface and has now detached itself. They would have been pretty irresponsible of the engine builder though

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by FrickingReallySlow

Thanks that's a good observation! The pieces are all super thin and look like flakes which I was raking my mind thinking where sealant could be that thin and break off, guess my rotating parts made them that way.

Do you know what these tubes are for in the oil pan? are these gallery drains from the heads or somewhere else?

I can tell you a bit later. I am pretty sure those correspond to some galleys in the upper pan assembly. I think those spots have orings, there should not be sealant on them. The only drain back I had seen for the heads is in the timing cover, then down through an opening at the bottom center into the upper pan assembly.

[FrickingReallySlow]

you are right in that they need O-rings. Are these black tubes also pickups with no screens? wondering why 2 drains with dedicated tubes to the bottom of the pan be needed?

The oil system picture doesn't seem to mention them

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

I can tell you a bit later. I am pretty sure those correspond to some galleys in the upper pan assembly. I think those spots have orings, there should not be sealant on them. The only drain back I had seen for the heads is in the timing cover, then down through an opening at the bottom center into the upper pan assembly.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by FrickingReallySlow

you are right in that they need O-rings. Are these black tubes also pickups with no screens? wondering why 2 drains with dedicated tubes to the bottom of the pan be needed?

The oil system picture doesn't seem to mention them

I believe they are drains for the rear of the block into the pan. I will pull out my junk block and upper pan assembly and trace them back in about 4 hours or so. Too busy at work to break away and look at it right now.

[NoHaveMSG]

It was easier to make a quick video then to upload a bunch of pictures and explain what is going on. I am actually surprised, it does connect to more head drains. One goes to the PCV. The other goes into the intake elbow in front of the TB.

[FrickingReallySlow]

Awesome video man! I need to check out the rest of your channel! hit subscribe comment and hit the bell icon

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

It was easier to make a quick video then to upload a bunch of pictures and explain what is going on. I am actually surprised, it does connect to more head drains. One goes to the PCV. The other goes into the intake elbow in front of the TB.

[FrickingReallySlow]

Spoke to the previous owner and found out that timing cover got resealed in 2019 with a leak above the water pump Can't believe subaru didn't get the timing cover seal right by 2015

At least I know the cause, I know quite a few threads on timing cover leaks by people in this forum around 2019. Sealant gets dropped into the pan then gets sucked into the oil pump which grinds it up into those pieces you see in my pictures then gets caught in the oil filter. This works until oil filter gets bypassed due to pressure difference in the filter, then the bypass opens up and sends debris into your bearings. Using a higher bypass pressure filter can help with this I think. I read somewhere that the Wix and Original Subaru filters had the highest pressure rating until bypass is allowed. KN High performance has one of the lowest ones. I'd advise those to check out their oil filter media as well! I guess if sealant from 2019 still haven't caused anything bad maybe everything is just in the pan/filter. Will know next week when pan comes down and killer B goes in.

all that glitters is not bearing material (gold)

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

Just be careful to properly reseal the oil pan and you won't have any issues with that. The silicone problem isn't cause by silicone, but by improper install/application. It's possible there was a cam cover resealed or some such that's causing the current issue. I would expect those chunks to be pretty big to come loose though. I'm not really understanding why you have little tiny bits unless a big piece got pulled into a rotating part and was subsequently torn apart.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

[FrickingReallySlow]

Just an update on UOA Blackstone analysis. It looks okay not great since the tin/copper/lead are at or just below the level of a 4600mile avg and I ran this oil for only 1500. In order to fully trust UOA to give you the full story may have to run the full ~4600miles to compare against averages.

No mention of excess silicon / sealant even with my findings in the oil filter media. Still waiting on KillerB delivery