Racelogic? anyone tried this yet?

[carbonBLUE]

Has anyone tried using racelogic for the twins?

http://www.racelogic.co.uk/index.php...action-control

I'm just wondering because our cars have 8 injectors for 4 cylinders and I'm not sure a standard unit has the hardware to support fuel cut traction control for 8 injectors on a 4 cylinder engine...

Like I said, I'm curious if anyone has successfully installed this yet and what are your thoughts. This would also be a great addition to anyone who is running high boost and can't seem to find traction on wider tire setups.

I know a lot of the Supra and Corvette guys have had amazing success stories with this.

So... thoughts?

[jamesm]

Probably can't do anything that can't be done with racerom. Ecutek gives you access to all 4 wheel speed sensors, and all the normal output params. You can come up with some very effective setups just with that. I'm sure it has a place, but I doubt the value is there for the vast majority.

[arghx7]

You would want to talk to the manufacturer and ask if it will work with direct injection, considering they run at higher voltage than a PFI injector.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by jamesm

Probably can't do anything that can't be done with racerom. Ecutek gives you access to all 4 wheel speed sensors, and all the normal output params. You can come up with some very effective setups just with that. I'm sure it has a place, but I doubt the value is there for the vast majority.

So ive done about an hour of searching and can't seem to find proper information on the racerom traction control

How does it work? does it use fuel cut? spark cut? ect?

How does it modulate the fuel cut between the cylinders? Does it cycle through each cylinder 1 by 1 like racelogic does to preserve engine longevity? or does it cut fuel to the whole system for a split second?

How often (times per second) does racrom collect data from the front wheel speed and the rear wheel speed and how often does the system make adjustments?

Also how adjustable is the system? can you change what % of slip you want on the fly like you can with racelogic, so actual power output doesnt matter on any type of surface conditions?

The reason I bring this up is because on CARB legal tunes for supercharges, you can't use racerom to adjust these parameters because if you mess with any of the tuning, you no longer have a CARB approved tune on the car. With Raceogic you could retain the CARB tune and possibly have a far superior launch and traction control system than racerom can provide.

Thoughts?

Originally Posted by arghx7

You would want to talk to the manufacturer and ask if it will work with direct injection, considering they run at higher voltage than a PFI injector.

The system does work with direct injection, I was just curious if anyone has tried this solution. If not then I can find someone who can install it and give the forum a proper review of the product.

[choi0706]

The only reason why I'd think RL TC system maybe better is adjust-ability on the fly.. Where as in ecutek you would need to do a map switch or flash.. You would also save money and install time with the ecutek..

[jamesm]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

So ive done about an hour of searching and can't seem to find proper information on the racerom traction control

How does it work? does it use fuel cut? spark cut? ect?

How does it modulate the fuel cut between the cylinders? Does it cycle through each cylinder 1 by 1 like racelogic does to preserve engine longevity? or does it cut fuel to the whole system for a split second?

How often (times per second) does racrom collect data from the front wheel speed and the rear wheel speed and how often does the system make adjustments?

Also how adjustable is the system? can you change what % of slip you want on the fly like you can with racelogic, so actual power output doesnt matter on any type of surface conditions?

The reason I bring this up is because on CARB legal tunes for supercharges, you can't use racerom to adjust these parameters because if you mess with any of the tuning, you no longer have a CARB approved tune on the car. With Raceogic you could retain the CARB tune and possibly have a far superior launch and traction control system than racerom can provide.

Thoughts?



The system does work with direct injection, I was just curious if anyone has tried this solution. If not then I can find someone who can install it and give the forum a proper review of the product.

it works any way you want. they give you the tool, you solve the problem. you could have it reduce boost based on wheel speed differential, cut spark, or fuel, whatever you want basically.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by choi0706

The only reason why I'd think RL TC system maybe better is adjust-ability on the fly.. Where as in ecutek you would need to do a map switch or flash.. You would also save money and install time with the ecutek..

ecutek is a definite for me regardless of application of the RLTC

Originally Posted by jamesm

it works any way you want. they give you the tool, you solve the problem. you could have it reduce boost based on wheel speed differential, cut spark, or fuel, whatever you want basically.

That still leaves many questions.

1 what about supercharged users, boost control is very limited as an option

2 how accurate is ecutek? how many times per second does it analyze data and respond to it? if it isnt more than a few hundred times per second than it isnt a viable option for me where as the RLTC can calculate and adjust every 1/1000th of a second and has its own computer manage the input/output of data and not relying on the ecu to handle everything, over stressing the system.

3 still doesnt have on the fly adaptability. from my understanding of the racerom traction control. It is a preset map that decreases boost/power and can't account for all road conditions. This is where RLTC would excel and you wouldnt need a new tune for traction control every time the climate changes from summer to snowy winters.

4 Consistency, Supra owners are all to fond of this struggle between power and traction. Boost by gear and ecu controlled traction control only goes so far. Some launches would be flawless where as other launches on the same day would either bog the engine or furiously spin the tires. Those who have utilized RLTC praise on how much better it is at keeping the tires from spinning when it is wet/dry/cold and the system maximized the traction regardless of type of tires, wear on the tires, or how the suspension was set up . Our cars also suffer from its light weight and even with larger tires and better suspension the car struggles to put the power down.

[jamesm]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

ecutek is a definite for me regardless of application of the RLTC



That still leaves many questions.

1 what about supercharged users, boost control is very limited as an option

2 how accurate is ecutek? how many times per second does it analyze data and respond to it? if it isnt more than a few hundred times per second than it isnt a viable option for me where as the RLTC can calculate and adjust every 1/1000th of a second and has its own computer manage the input/output of data and not relying on the ecu to handle everything, over stressing the system.

3 still doesnt have on the fly adaptability. from my understanding of the racerom traction control. It is a preset map that decreases boost/power and can't account for all road conditions. This is where RLTC would excel and you wouldnt need a new tune for traction control every time the climate changes from summer to snowy winters.

4 Consistency, Supra owners are all to fond of this struggle between power and traction. Boost by gear and ecu controlled traction control only goes so far. Some launches would be flawless where as other launches on the same day would either bog the engine or furiously spin the tires. Those who have utilized RLTC praise on how much better it is at keeping the tires from spinning when it is wet/dry/cold and the system maximized the traction regardless of type of tires, wear on the tires, or how the suspension was set up . Our cars also suffer from its light weight and even with larger tires and better suspension the car struggles to put the power down.

boost control is limited on superchargers because it's a mechanically driven supercharger. people have been trying to hack around the problem for years, some with more success than others. ecutek can control anything that'll accept a pwm signal, so once a good hardware solution is in place the software is already there to control it.

it calculates fast enough. as fast as the ecu in the car i suppose. this is another theoretical argument. i doubt you'd see much functional improvement in real life from increasing the sampling rate even 10 fold. it's not a 1:1 kinda thing. 10 times faster != 10 times better. there's a point of diminishing returns, which pretty much everything with a modern processor has surpassed as this point.

as for adaptability, that's completely up to the person setting up the system. you could absolutely set up comps based on ambient temp or whatever else, or even wire in a tire temperature sensor and use that if you felt the need.

how good the system works has everything to do with the person setting it up and calibrating it, and very little to do with the hardware it's implemented on, imho.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by jamesm

boost control is limited on superchargers because it's a mechanically driven supercharger. people have been trying to hack around the problem for years, some with more success than others. ecutek can control anything that'll accept a pwm signal, so once a good hardware solution is in place the software is already there to control it.

it calculates fast enough. as fast as the ecu in the car i suppose. this is another theoretical argument. i doubt you'd see much functional improvement in real life from increasing the sampling rate even 10 fold. it's not a 1:1 kinda thing. 10 times faster != 10 times better. there's a point of diminishing returns, which pretty much everything with a modern processor has surpassed as this point.

as for adaptability, that's completely up to the person setting up the system. you could absolutely set up comps based on ambient temp or whatever else, or even wire in a tire temperature sensor and use that if you felt the need.

how good the system works has everything to do with the person setting it up and calibrating it, and very little to do with the hardware it's implemented on, imho.

I'll look into it then

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

...

The reason I bring this up is because on CARB legal tunes for supercharges, you can't use racerom to adjust these parameters because if you mess with any of the tuning, you no longer have a CARB approved tune on the car. ...

You don't really think the guy at the smog station is going to pull your rom (which you cant do anyway with ecutek if the tune is locked) and compair ot to the one issued by the kit maker? Not gonna happen. Of course i just moved to california but i just don't see how they can enforce what tune is on the ecu unless they have access to a checksum bit and the kit maker constantly updates the records.. Far more likely the manufacturer controls who gets a carb cert at the time of purchase and then washes their hands of it.

It blows you have to pay extra to get the carb cert and then go buy a better tune from someone like @DeliciousTuning, but this what you have to do if you want a carb cert and a better tune.


Back on topic, I think the folks that have worked with race rom TC probably used throttle angle rather than fuel cut but i could be totaly wrong.

[DeliciousTuning]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

It blows you have to pay extra to get the carb cert and then go buy a better tune from someone like @DeliciousTuning, but this what you have to do if you want a carb cert and a better tune..

Yeah it does suck, but these companies that offer the CARB cert are pretty hard pressed by CARB and need to keep strict records on everything. If they mess up one thing they are booted.

Cheers,
William Knose