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Old 11-21-2013, 02:51 PM   #1
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What's Going on Between Toyota & Subaru on the Convertible Version of the 86/FR-S/BRZ

What's Going on Between Toyota and Subaru on the Convertible Version of the GT-86/FR-S/BRZ?

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Doesn't it strike you as odd that Toyota would go gone into all that trouble creating multiple editions of the FT-86 Open concept in both left and right drive, if it has no plans to build a convertible edition out of its Scion FR-S and Toyota GT 86 models?

Yet, that's precisely what Subaru brand chief Yasuyuki Yoshinaga is claiming. Speaking to Autonews on the sidelines of the ongoing 2013 Tokyo Motor Show, Yoshinaga said that there won't be a convertible version of any of the cars as they would require a complete re-make to meet safety standards.

"We make the car, so if we don't make it, it can't happen," Yoshinaga said in Tokyo. "Our engineering department told me that losing the entire roof requires a complete redesign of the structure. It would need a big change."

While not mentioned in the report from Autonews, we do remember that when Toyota first showed the white FT-86 Open concept in Geneva earlier this year, it said the exact opposite of what Yoshinaga claimed, and we quote Toyota Europe President Didier Leroy:

"I know you are all wondering about facts and figures, and body rigidity. Well, we have the same worries and Tada [chief engineer of the GT 86] and his team are deep into analysis. But GT86 was designed from the start as a cabriolet… That probably tells you all you needed to know." Apparently not…

Yoshinaga added that while he feels for Toyota, an open-top model just won't happen.

"I understand well that Toyota is receiving strong requests from the American market for the car," he said. "But the biggest challenge is meeting our internal safety standards. There are big technical difficulties."
http://www.carscoops.com/2013/11/wha...nd-subaru.html
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Old 11-21-2013, 03:10 PM   #2
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"I understand well that Toyota is receiving strong requests from the American market for the car," he said.
Huh, guess they're not reading this forum.

Anybody who would consider a convertible 86 would likely consider a Miata or Mustang (or Camaro) and would have already purchased one, there's no void in convertibles as far as I'm concerned. The only argument is "I like the mustang but it's too heavy, I'd sacrifice some power for agility" or "I like the Miata but want more utility, I'd sacrifice the weight for some back seats". Or they don't care about performance at all and end up with a Fiat, Mini, Solara or whatever convertibles exist that I don't care to remember.



Edit: obligatory comment about high school 'he said she said' drama about whether or not the design is feasible. It will perform worse than the coupe version, Subaru's statement only confirms it.
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Old 11-21-2013, 03:14 PM   #3
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I enjoy how Subaru is chocking themselves...

O'well, only time will tell
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Old 11-21-2013, 03:43 PM   #4
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The salesmen at my dealership want a convertible version because Toyota has no roadsters available. I prefer coupes myself but the roadster demand is always there.
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Old 11-22-2013, 07:57 AM   #5
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If they made a convertible, the world would only laugh at our back seats... Plus i heard they scrapped the idea :P. Lots of ideas for the 86. A trd version (only kit), sti version (only kit) convertible (only a concept) Sedan (a new concept) Toyota/Subaru is having too much fun with this car.
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Old 11-22-2013, 08:44 AM   #6
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If they made a convertible, the world would only laugh at our back seats... Plus i heard they scrapped the idea :P. Lots of ideas for the 86. A trd version (only kit), sti version (only kit) convertible (only a concept) Sedan (a new concept) Toyota/Subaru is having too much fun with this car.
Anyway to make money that's all it is... You can leave it up to Toyota to take something great and mess it up.

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Old 11-22-2013, 10:50 AM   #7
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Seems like there is no love for the drop top. Anywho I don't mind a sedan, t-top (like MK4 Supra) and wagon 86/FR-S.
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:05 PM   #8
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Subaru boss downplays the possibility of a BRZ / GT 86 convertible, says it would require a redesign


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Model looks increasingly unlikely

Fuji Heavy Industries President Yasuyuki Yoshinaga has dismissed the possibility of a Subaru BRZ Convertible.

Speaking to Automotive News, Yoshinaga said "Our engineering department told me that losing the entire roof requires a complete redesign of the structure." The executive went on to say if they don't make a BRZ Convertible, there won't be a Scion FR-S or Toyota 86 convertible either. As he explained, "We make the car, so if we don't make it, it can't happen."

Interestingly, Yoshinaga's statement contradicts Toyota's claim that the Toyotaru triples were always envisioned to be offered as convertibles. When Toyota introduced the GT 86 Open concept they said the model was "package protected with a cabriolet in mind."
http://www.worldcarfans.com/11311226...f-a-brz--gt-86
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:06 PM   #9
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Subaru boss spurns convertible 86, BRZ, FR-S


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TOKYO -- Subaru brand chief Yasuyuki Yoshinaga dismissed the idea of a convertible Subaru BRZ sporty coupe, saying the vehicle would require a complete remake to meet safety standards.

His slap-down came as Toyota Motor Corp., which sells a rebadged version of the car as the Scion FR-S, showed its own drop-top concept down the aisle at the Tokyo Motor Show.

Yoshinaga is president of Subaru-brand parent Fuji Heavy Industries, which makes the BRZ and FR-S at its Gumma factory in Japan. He said his company wouldn't build a convertible variant for either company.

"We make the car, so if we don't make it, it can't happen," Yoshinaga said at the show today."Our engineering department told me that losing the entire roof requires a complete redesign of the structure. It would need a big change."

Subaru's vocal skepticism and Toyota's persistent teasing of a convertible concept suggest an underlying clash for creative control of the zippy little car.

The two companies joined forces on the project, with Toyota contributing the design and styling and Subaru doing the drivetrain, layout and manufacturing. The production model debuted at the 2011 Tokyo Motor Show.

Toyota has dangled a convertible concept of its FR-S, also called the Toyota 86 or Toyota GT86 in different markets, at several motor shows. But it has always remained noncommittal.

A convertible concept called the FT-86 Open debuted this year at the Geneva motor show. And a version appeared at this week's Tokyo show with an electrically operated soft top.

Yoshinaga seemed unmoved.

"I understand well that Toyota is receiving strong requests from the American market for the car," he said. "But the biggest challenge is meeting our internal safety standards. There are big technical difficulties."
http://www.autonews.com/article/2013...#axzz2lOY2NoLt
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:15 PM   #10
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Toyota and Subaru seem to be heading down the road to a divorce. Subaru has stated that they won't be building the Camry in Indiana come 2017 even though Toyota won't confirm it.

Toyota owns 16% of Fuji Heavy. They may well be unloading that soon if they are breaking ties with Subaru.
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:20 PM   #11
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If anything Ill believe it's Toyota pushing for the convertible a d the seadan. I don't see Subaru wanting to make anything four door to compete to much with wrx or any other of their models

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Old 11-22-2013, 12:28 PM   #12
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OMG JUST ADD A TURBO ALREADY
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:53 PM   #13
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"I understand well that Toyota is receiving strong requests from the American market for the car," he said. "But the biggest challenge is meeting our internal safety standards. There are big technical difficulties."
I never thought of this before. The convertible concept essentially does away with Subaru's ring-shaped reinforcement by eliminating the B-pillar from the Twins. So I can see where Yoshinaga is coming from in citing safety concerns and/or rigidity concerns.



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Old 11-22-2013, 01:23 PM   #14
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Does anyone think Toyota will just increase its share in Subaru and have full control?
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