TRD clutch

[ChristosG]

Anybody know anything about this part? What's the difference between sports facing and metal facing? All I can find about it seems to be in Japanese or poorly translated English. Being 40% lighter seems like a good thing and I'd like to get it but need to know more.

[Turdinator]

What more would you like to know? Sport facing is just your regular organic material with a higher clamping force. The metal is exactly that, sintered brass fricton material. The metal has a higher power rating and is a lot more aggressive in its take up making it harder to drive on the street. 40% lighter is just a lightened fly wheel. The stock flywheel is somewhere around 21lbs.

[ChristosG]

So I guess I'll go with the sport facing then since my car is a DD.

But the again, will it really make any noticeable difference? Will it help with acceleration from a stop? I was under the impression it would. I'm just not clear about what the advantage is. I know nothing about clutches.

[Turdinator]

Originally Posted by ChristosG

So I guess I'll go with the sport facing then since my car is a DD.

But the again, will it really make any noticeable difference? Will it help with acceleration from a stop? I was under the impression it would. I'm just not clear about what the advantage is. I know nothing about clutches.

You will notice an improvement in acceleration with a lighter flywheel but it will also be easier to stall. But its not as bad as many people would have you believe. Upgrading the clutch isn't really neccessary unless you plan on going with a turbo or supercharger. The clutch does not effect the performance really. It just allows you to have more power (or torque really) before it starts to slip.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by ChristosG

So I guess I'll go with the sport facing then since my car is a DD.

But the again, will it really make any noticeable difference? Will it help with acceleration from a stop? I was under the impression it would. I'm just not clear about what the advantage is. I know nothing about clutches.

What do you plan to do with your car, what are your end goals? (HP/TQ numbers)

[industrial]

Originally Posted by ChristosG

So I guess I'll go with the sport facing then since my car is a DD.

But the again, will it really make any noticeable difference? Will it help with acceleration from a stop? I was under the impression it would. I'm just not clear about what the advantage is. I know nothing about clutches.

I have the ACT lightweight flywheel/clutch. It makes a pretty noticeable difference in how fast the car accelerates from a stop (1st and 2nd gear) but long sustained pulls like highway passing you still feel the lack of power/gearing more than the weight of the flywheel. It makes the car feel more like a sports car though. The rev hang on the stock setup was really annoying, it's all gone now. It revs up quite a bit faster as well for rev matching.

There is some added noise and it is a little harder to drive but now that I'm used to it, I don't notice anymore.

[ChristosG]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

What do you plan to do with your car, what are your end goals? (HP/TQ numbers)

Turbo once I've paid the car off and warranty period is over. So still two years to go. In the meantime no big engine mods. I guess clutch won't be worth it until I go the turbo route.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by ChristosG

Turbo once I've paid the car off and warranty period is over. So still two years to go. In the meantime no big engine mods. I guess clutch won't be worth it until I go the turbo route.

And you won't want the TRD clutch for that either.

[Sportsguy83]

^^ This +100000

[Jeff86]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

And you won't want the TRD clutch for that either.

Yep, and he also won't want a lightweight fly either.

[Supermassive]

Originally Posted by Jeff86

Yep, and he also won't want a lightweight fly either.

Abuh?!?

I am running a lightweight flywheel/clutch combo from Clutchmasters and I couldn't disagree more with this statement. A lightweight clutch allows the engine to rev faster creating boost faster, which helps reduce lag...which is bad.

Dropping revs faster is also a side effect but turbo systems have a number of things in place to reduce the effect of those dropped revs most notably the Blow Off Valve which makes it so you don't build pressure on the compressor turbine, effectively allowing the turbine to freewheel.

Trust me, my car is a riot, revs quick as hell to redline and beyond

You don't want to go too light, because you will run into issues keeping the engine running because the weight of the flywheel helps keep the engine rotating. I'd say that a 10lb decrease between the stock clutch/flywheel and an aftermarket flywheel like my FX400 feels just about perfect...I also have a lightweight crank pulley too...

[Jeff86]

Originally Posted by Supermassive

Abuh?!?

I am running a lightweight flywheel/clutch combo from Clutchmasters and I couldn't disagree more with this statement. A lightweight clutch allows the engine to rev faster creating boost faster, which helps reduce lag...which is bad.

Dropping revs faster is also a side effect but turbo systems have a number of things in place to reduce the effect of those dropped revs most notably the Blow Off Valve which makes it so you don't build pressure on the compressor turbine, effectively allowing the turbine to freewheel.

Trust me, my car is a riot, revs quick as hell to redline and beyond

You don't want to go too light, because you will run into issues keeping the engine running because the weight of the flywheel helps keep the engine rotating. I'd say that a 10lb decrease between the stock clutch/flywheel and an aftermarket flywheel like my FX400 feels just about perfect...I also have a lightweight crank pulley too...

Ok... I'm not trying to be a know-it-all, but I'm sure your car would be just as much a riot if you put the stock flywheel back on. I know a number of guys who came from NA to boost and thus started with a lightened fly. They were happier after they swapped the stock one back. In my case I've never removed it when I knew I'd eventually boost the car.

Boost is created through engine load. Flywheels maintain inertia. That inertia helps hold load and maintain boost between shifts. That's known, and your bov can't do that. I've also seen dyno results from a guy who swapped them and actually made more torque earlier with his stock flywheel over the lightened one. Your car might rev quicker NA on the lighter one, but there's a dance between boost and load that changes all that in an FI application. Brake boost and you'll see this more dramatically, same principle though. I think you'd be surprised that your car didn't take any longer to reach redline with the stock fly and boost would come on a bit earlier.

[industrial]

Originally Posted by Jeff86

Ok... I'm not trying to be a know-it-all, but I'm sure your car would be just as much a riot if you put the stock flywheel back on. I know a number of guys who came from NA to boost and thus started with a lightened fly. They were happier after they swapped the stock one back. In my case I've never removed it when I knew I'd eventually boost the car.

Boost is created through engine load. Flywheels maintain inertia. That inertia helps hold load and maintain boost between shifts. That's known, and your bov can't do that. I've also seen dyno results from a guy who swapped them and actually made more torque earlier with his stock flywheel over the lightened one. Your car might rev quicker NA on the lighter one, but there's a dance between boost and load that changes all that in an FI application. Brake boost and you'll see this more dramatically, same principle though. I think you'd be surprised that your car didn't take any longer to reach redline with the stock fly and boost would come on a bit earlier.

I think you are really overexaggerating the effect a heavy flywheel has on building boost and load. 10 pound flywheel...vs 2700 pound car.... Flywheel maintains inertia with the clutch out (your car isn't accelerating with the clutch out btw). With the clutch in the entire car maintains inertia and puts a load on the engine. A heavy flywheel ≠ anti-lag.

Ask the evo guys about lightweight flywheels. They do all kinds of clutch work over there...

Lightweight flywheel will make rev matching faster, no rev hang (so you have to shift faster) and be a little more annoying to launch around town. It's not going to make a huge difference either way but it does make the car feel much sportier in that it can actually go VroomVroomVroom instead of Vrooooooooom...Vroooooooom...Vrooooooom...

[Jeff86]

Originally Posted by industrial

I think you are really overexaggerating the effect a heavy flywheel has on building boost and load. 10 pound flywheel...vs 2700 pound car.... Flywheel maintains inertia with the clutch out (your car isn't accelerating with the clutch out btw). With the clutch in the entire car maintains inertia and puts a load on the engine. A heavy flywheel ≠ anti-lag.

Ask the evo guys about lightweight flywheels. They do all kinds of clutch work over there...

Lightweight flywheel will make rev matching faster, no rev hang (so you have to shift faster) and be a little more annoying to launch around town. It's not going to make a huge difference either way but it does make the car feel much sportier in that it can actually go VroomVroomVroom instead of Vrooooooooom...Vroooooooom...Vrooooooom...

Your clutch is in between shifts and your boost is dropping. The flywheel has everything to do with how much you lose. Enough inertia at the flywheel combined with a quick enough shift and you're boost and power is still right there to kick you in your immediate ass. Further, evidence does support that the load from the fkywheel, perhaps due to the direct connection to the crank shaft, does influence the buliding of torque, This has nothing to do with turbo lag and nothing to do with "vrooms". I've been making good power building forced induction cars for years and just trying to convey experience. Take it or leave it.