MT etiquette... don't hate me!

[NOMNOM]

It's been some years since I've owned any MT vehicles, but when I decided on an FR-S I figured it would be heresy to buy anything else. None of my previous MT cars had any sporty aspects to them, so now that I've driven this one for a few weeks I thought I'd come admit my inexperience and ask a few driving questions:

When shifting up, if I try to revmatch the next gear it usually ends up being a pretty bumpy ride, especially 2nd gear. On the other hand, if I try a slower, more exaggerated transition with the clutch/gas it's a smoother feel, but I bet I'm burning more clutch as I tend to overcompensate the gas as the clutch slowly pulls the revs back down to the gear.

Which method is better for the car? Or maybe not better, but less worse? I have limited know-how with these things, but it seems like the jerkyness would be strain on the transmission, vs gradual shifts being a wear on the clutch. Right? Wrong? Whats the right way to learn this correctly?

Next question, since I've never owned a car you could have this much fun in: When I'm blitzing up through the gears at high revs, is the idea to shift as fast as possible and just let the shifts hit hard? Or do I need to wait a bit longer for revs to come down?

[ftc~brz]

being smooth and timely at any rpm is best. my advice would be get used to doing it smoothly at your "normal" pace to develop muscle memory. Basically get used to the clutch and shift points of daily farting around first then start playing with rev matching and driving like it's stolen. Especially if you came from an econo MT. It's all the same on the basic level. You don't want to tear up clutch and syncros in your nice new car.
Once you have the smoothness and know where you like to shift then GETERDONE!

If you have driven something more sports car in the past it's like riding a bicycle.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by NOMNOM

Next question, since I've never owned a car you could have this much fun in: When I'm blitzing up through the gears at high revs, is the idea to shift as fast as possible and just let the shifts hit hard? Or do I need to wait a bit longer for revs to come down?

Make sure to lift completely off the gas between shifts. If you're doing it right, you should be able to shift fast and have the revs fall in place.

[Bach415]

^this. When you are upshifting, just take your time. Throttle a tiny bit while releasing your clutch slowly should make your transition smoother. Burning the clutch is cheaper than replacing the transmission. At high revs, you don't need to shift as fast as possible. Of course you're not going to get a smooth shift when you are blitzing it compared to driving normally.

[Want.FR-S]

So think of the manual gear box for a second: each gear has different gear ratio compared to the adjacent gears with respected to the engine revolution. Therefore, 3000 RPM in first gear gets you at 14 MPH while in second gear it can reach 24 MPH. What does this mean? It means that when you shift up from 1st to 2nd gear @ 3000 RPM, the engine rev should *drop* to 1800 RPM for smooth shifting. That means, for smooth shifting @ 3000 rpm, you need to press the clutch, change gear to 2nd while the rev drop to 1800, release the clutch so that the engine speed and transmission speed are about the same so less wear on clutch, and less jerky ride. That is the theory behind it.

Unfortunately, given the same car, if you shift at different rev the rev drop will be different. When you shift in higher gear, you really need to shift a bit faster because the rev drop for perfect match is smaller.

Now, suppose if you shift too slow, what happen? the rev drop below 1800 while the transmission expect that number, when you engage the clutch, the transmission is pulled slower due to the engine rev so the car slow down. If you shift too fast, the engine rev does not drop to 1800 rpm, the engine is pulled down to match the transmission. It may be more smooth this way but there will be undesired wear on clutch.

So as @ftc~brz said, you should practice your shifting technique into muscle memory and choose your timing on when you release the clutch. IMHO it is ok if you shift fast enough while holding the clutch for the perfect timing to release. However, if you are not shifting fast enough, you would have to press the gas a bit to *rev-match* the shifting, but that would cause undesired wear most of the time.

[bcj]

Each vehicle will have different characteristics.
Even going from one MT to another. After almost two months, I'm still learning this one.
I've blown a few shifts (wrong gear) because I still don't have the muscle memory quite there yet.

Take your time and be nice to it for the time being.

[strat61caster]

I don't think he needs an explanation of what's going on.

This car is one of the trickier cars I've driven to get smooth shifts, it just takes practice and it's the most rewarding car I've driven. I know I'm using a bit more clutch than I should to get a smooth ride but I'm not making it a science so I can learn the "feel".

The clutch is a wear part, it's supposed to be replaced, don't feel too bad about it and the fact that you care enough about this means you're better on your car than most people.

[kevman_101]

I`m having slight issues when going from 1st to 2nd too in lower speeds. Sometimes I get it right, others it jerks hehehe. But I like the quick RPM drop. I find when shifting quick in higher rpms from 2nd on up, the gears are very well spaced and the shift feel seamless. And the shifter is incredible compared to my Spec V Sentra lol. I`m guessing it uses shifter links and not cables as most FWD`s do?

[NOMNOM]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

I don't think he needs an explanation of what's going on.

This car is one of the trickier cars I've driven to get smooth shifts, it just takes practice and it's the most rewarding car I've driven. I know I'm using a bit more clutch than I should to get a smooth ride but I'm not making it a science so I can learn the "feel".

The clutch is a wear part, it's supposed to be replaced, don't feel too bad about it and the fact that you care enough about this means you're better on your car than most people.

You're right, I get the basics of what's going on, just didn't know which was the 'kindest' method on the car, so you were both helpful.

I'll keep honing in and practicing, but I feel better about using a little more clutch in the meantime.

[Dezoris]

Why rev-matching up shifts? You mean rev matching downshifts?

[mashal]

Da fuq? How does one rev match up shifts ?

[NOMNOM]

I'm probably using the term incorrectly, I just dont know any better. TOLD YOU NOT TO GET MAD AT ME.

I just mean when I try to let my rmps drop to the perfect amount, I seem to miss and feel like an idiot when it jolts a bit. Just wanted to know if I should keep trying till I "get it right" or if I should be giving it a slower gas/clutch transition.

[Bach415]

Originally Posted by NOMNOM

I'm probably using the term incorrectly, I just dont know any better. TOLD YOU NOT TO GET MAD AT ME.

I just mean when I try to let my rmps drop to the perfect amount, I seem to miss and feel like an idiot when it jolts a bit. Just wanted to know if I should keep trying till I "get it right" or if I should be giving it a slower gas/clutch transition.

Just fyi, the more you look @ your cluster/gauge, the more you will mess up. It's better if you just let it flow (as in just go about your own pace) rather than constantly trying to find the perfect rpm drop. Like I said, when shifting, slowly engage the clutch, add a tiny bit of throttle at the same time.

[Anthonytpt]

I don't waste any time between shifts, so I don't understand letting the RPM drop. The only thing I needed to calibrate was my muscle memory for clutch engagement - the rest seems to follow and improve the more the car's driven. Perhaps you're putting too much thought into shifting, so the resulting delay is causing a jerky ride?