Kit cars

[BRZZZZZZZZZZ]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

I think the right question for a kitcar is not how much it cost but how many hours it took. This is why I don't have a kitcar. This is why I may never get a proper race car. I don't have the time to fix it all the time. Guy in a radical? He's fixing it. Guy in a 7? He's fixing it. Guy in an Exige? Well, come on, it's like a kitcar. It's a Lotus. He's fixing it.

My dad bought a 2012 Caterham and every year it needs time to get everything just right and maintained. To be fair he drives it a lot in the summer months.

[mike the snake]

I've ridden motorcycles my entire life.

Until a couple years ago, I had a couple Ducatis (a 2002 Troy Bayliss Replica-super rare, with 1000 miles on it, and a 2012 Hypermotard 1100sp-funnest bike EVER, and a cool Harley Shovelhead bobber I built).

I stopped driving/riding fast on the street when I started racing, realized just how dangerous it is to drive fast on the street.

Still, one day, I was cruising a backroad on my Hyper, not speeding, then in the middle of the turn I remember hearing the engine rev, and before I could blink I was flying through the air (I hit sand in the road, bike got sideways and then caught, highsided me like a mo fo. After my Superman impression, I hit the ground and rolled, and rolled, and rolled, and got really busted up.

I was wearing riding gear, (helmet, gloves, padded fabric riding jacket, sturdy shoes).

Now if I were wearing my racing leathers, I would have jumped up and walked away, but fabric grabs the road (leather slips and skips) so both sleeves of my jacket instantly bunched up to my neck, exposing my arms. My gloves gauntlets weren't long enough so they flew off, as did my shoes.

Ended up alive, but with broken hand, foot, ribs, shoulder, messed up elbows, and road rash from hell.

This was all from just cruising along, no showing off, no speeding, so after healing, I just kind of lost the urge to ride as much (before then, if it wasn't raining, I was on my bike), so I sold my bikes and bought cool sh!t for my cars.

Someday I may still get another bike, but presently I'm involved in a relationship with my car, so no bikes anytime soon.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by mike the snake

I stand corrected then.

I figured a bulletproof chassis with 5 point belts in just about any car would be safer than what we have today.

Now I see that a burly cage would make for such an unmoving structure in an imoact, that the driver would then take the brunt of the impact (snapped neck) unless the rest of the safety equipment were utilized.

So I'll amend my statement. If all cars today had burly roll cages, and 5 point belts, and proper air bags, and drivers were to wear helmets and HANS devices, then cars would be a lot safer. But we all know that won't ever happen on street cars.

So again, I stand corrected.

Looking at the chassis of those kit cars does make you think you'd be pretty safe in a crash though.

Some of those tests aren't as accurate as they would have you believe.

For instance, the sprint car test where they had the car going top first towards the wall just isn't accurate. Cars don't run into things sliding forward at 30 or 60 miles an hour. The cars may be TRAVELING at those speeds but they are spinning as they strike an object. The impact has angular momentum that is not present during those tests that take away from the impact.

It's kind of like doing curls and expecting that to drastically affect your pull ups. It doesn't work like that. Isolating variables is all good for on paper numbers, but doesn't accurately simulate real world scenarios.

Jaden

[EAGLE5]

There are two types of riders: those who have fallen and those who will. I consider riding a selfish act if one is the parent of a young child. If you're old and stupid, go for it. If you're young and stupid, have fun.

And it is a lot of fun! But I don't ride.

[Irace86.2.0]

I emailed Jannarelly. I said that I didn't know if they were going to move on past the Concept-1 onto more modern designs for the future of their company to equal a car company like Lotus or something more grand like Pagani, or if they were going to take a step back and either produce kit cars or license their design to other kit car companies, but regardless, that I hoped the car would not end with the first allocation, and that I would love to see the car as a kit car.

Assuming it was under $50k for a full build, I would love to build one of these myself one day.

[Sapphireho]

Nice job digging up this old thread.

You will never ever in your life build and finish a quality kit car for 50k. Try triple that, minimum, if you know what you are doing.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Sapphireho

Nice job digging up this old thread.

You will never ever in your life build and finish a quality kit car for 50k. Try triple that, minimum, if you know what you are doing.

These days we have a lot of options to make it easier. I thought of building a Factory Five 818 Coupe or a Type 65 Coupe. In fact, I could probably make the FA20 and supercharger kit in my car work in that one versus the WRX engine. I could do a wrap job myself versus paint. Kits and donor cars for the 818 should be sub $25k, so that leaves $25k for extras and miscellaneous. 400hp with 2000lbs seems good.




https://www.factoryfive.com/818/818c/

There are several Miata kit cars that are cheap.

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/a5eb79z/

[Sapphireho]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

These days we have a lot of options to make it easier. I thought of building a Factory Five 818 Coupe or a Type 65 Coupe. In fact, I could probably make the FA20 and supercharger kit in my car work in that one versus the WRX engine. I could do a wrap job myself versus paint. Kits and donor cars for the 818 should be sub $25k, so that leaves $25k for extras and miscellaneous. 400hp with 2000lbs seems good.




https://www.factoryfive.com/818/818c/

There are several Miata kit cars that are cheap.

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/a5eb79z/

You are so naive. Go for it.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Sapphireho

You are so naive. Go for it.

You are naive if you think these cost $150k. You can buy them fully built for far less. These guys do far more than just assemble the basic kits too, and they sell them in the sixties. Building a basic car myself would be far cheaper.

https://www.formacars.com/formacars-ffr-818

I’m not really a fan of the 818 though. It is close. The Type 65 Coupe is closer to the proportions I like. I’d much rather get something like a Jannarelly of course. Kinda sad the Jannarelly jumped so much in price from $55k to $112k, but they probably increased the quality and didn’t expect the demand. I can only hope for a kit car replica or something. These Factory Five kits are pretty simple stuff. Basically the donor cars are replaced by a cage and new body panels, suspension, fuel cell, bla bla bla. Plug n play stuff. Basic wiring. I would barely have to pull out my welder. Nothing fancy. I’ve done full engine rebuilds, custom exhausts, one-off pieces, so these don’t even scare me. It just takes time. If only the Jannarelly was a kit.

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by Sapphireho

You are so naive. Go for it.

are you including tools/materials in your estimate? makes a big difference. for a well-equipped home shop, the cost of the kit is the cost of the kit. but for a new guy, i can see how you'd say the jigs, tools, and materials can be well over the cost of the kit.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by soundman98

are you including tools/materials in your estimate? makes a big difference. for a well-equipped home shop, the cost of the kit is the cost of the kit. but for a new guy, i can see how you'd say the jigs, tools, and materials can be well over the cost of the kit.

I think he is just talking about run away costs and extras. Most people who build these kit Cobras and what not also do $10-15k custom paint jobs, and they go to a custom upholstery shop and spend another $15k on a custom interior, and they buy a crate motor for $20k with a blower, and they do $5k in chrome work, etc, etc, so the out-the-door price is far more money. Many old kit cars also aren't very complete, so there is a lot of extras to buy beyond the price of the kit, and people don't buy stock wheels and tires, so there is a lot of custom add-ons that are also extras. The person didn't need to buy the $6k wheels and tires, but they did on their kit car.

For Factory Five's 818 roadster, someone could legit have a running car for under $15k with a sub $5k donor WRX and their $10k kit. It would be more to customize the car and to make it dialed, no different than any car. They would only need basic tools IMO. As far as I am aware, there is no welding that is needed outside of a custom exhaust, but I have a welder, and there is no fabrication that is needed, but I could do that, and there is no body work that is needed because this is a paint and completed shell, but some body work or fiberglass work wouldn't be a problem for me, and the wiring is mostly plug-n-play with some basic wiring, so yeah, this is something that most people could do if they have installed something like a turbo kit or supercharger or have basic knowledge. It isn't like this is one of those kits where someone has to design and fabricate their own brake fluid lines and their own fuel system, etc.

[Irace86.2.0]

I was looking at the Z3GT from Tribute Automotive. It is a shell for a Z3 donor car, so less Factory Five and more of just reskinning a modern car, which has some appeal. Similar to the Aston Martin Zagato or Ferrari 250 GT SWB below.

http://www.tributeautomotive.co.uk/z3gt.html

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I was looking at the Z3GT from Tribute Automotive. It is a shell for a Z3 donor car, so less Factory Five and more of just reskinning a modern car, which has some appeal. Similar to the Aston Martin Zagato or Ferrari 250 GT SWB below

I like the concept of it, particularly that it's just swapping body panels and not some overall change to the vehicle, seems more "livable".

They have a couple of other models as well. The Cobra is OK but I like this one

[Irace86.2.0]

Not a kit car, but the 60's was a great area for these proportions. I love it.