Am I the only one who thinks a swapped 86 is no longer an 86?

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

You do NOT have a GTO you have something you slapped together that is equipped similar to a GTO but that does not in any way make it one.

What if that's all it takes? I didn't dig into classic cars too much but I did get the impression that a few of the top trim cars were literally just bolt-ons for the base model.

I mean, don't get me wrong, if there's some serious work going on under the skin like what a BMW M car used to be and what some modern Pony cars do, where the chassis are reworked, suspension parts no longer bolt on, etc. I can understand.

But if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, has the same bones as a duck, tastes like a duck, and does burnouts like a duck...

False advertising is despicable, and yes the real deal should be worth more than the copy, but I don't see why a perfect clone is a lesser car than the real deal if hypothetically the only thing that's different is the go-fast parts were bolted on in 2007 instead 1967. At least, it wouldn't diminish my enjoyment of the vehicle.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

What if that's all it takes? I didn't dig into classic cars too much but I did get the impression that a few of the top trim cars were literally just bolt-ons for the base model.

I mean, don't get me wrong, if there's some serious work going on under the skin like what a BMW M car used to be and what some modern Pony cars do, where the chassis are reworked, suspension parts no longer bolt on, etc. I can understand.

But if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, has the same bones as a duck, tastes like a duck, and does burnouts like a duck...

False advertising is despicable, and yes the real deal should be worth more than the copy, but I don't see why a perfect clone is a lesser car than the real deal if hypothetically the only thing that's different is the go-fast parts were bolted on in 2007 instead 1967. At least, it wouldn't diminish my enjoyment of the vehicle.

That many of the parts just bolt on is very true but the special version is still special in it's own right. Sure it may function the same but it remains a fake. Not to mention that there are also many parts that people do not swap and they just go for the cosmetics so that it looks like the real thing. If I take the wing and badges from a STi and slap them on an Impreza does that make it real? Please send me a copy of you University Degree so I can scratch your name out and write mine in and claim it is real. I promise I will use the right font so that it is indeed just as good as the real thing. (not sarcastic it is just the best example I could come up with off the top of my head)

[Overdrive]

Originally Posted by bcj

That's where Rouch and Seleen fall into the picture. Don't think anyone would say they are the same as OEM cars.
Engine swaps happen in all sorts of individual carports that are one off.

They never try to be, though. Like RUF and Gemballa with Porsches, they buy the chassis and then basically make it their own, changed enough that they can call it an entirely different car (why they don't call it a Saleen Mustang, but a Saleen S### or some such internal model code). It's an agreement they have with the original manufacturer. To sell them in the market, that was necessary. That requirement is not placed on Joe Somebody who wants to put an RB26 in his Chevy Chevette if he has no intention of trying to sell it as his own thing.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Please send me a copy of you University Degree so I can scratch your name out and write mine in and claim it is real. I promise I will use the right font so that it is indeed just as good as the real thing. (not sarcastic it is just the best example I could come up with off the top of my head)

You didn't produce a single argument counter to what I said, just rambled off a buncha philosophical bullshit about how it's "not the real thing" with silly examples that had nothing to do with what I postulated.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

You didn't produce a single argument counter to what I said, just rambled off a buncha philosophical bullshit about how it's "not the real thing" with silly examples that had nothing to do with what I postulated.

The whole debate is a philosophical one! To use your duck metaphor I can dress a chicken up to look like a duck and even if it walks like one it is still a chicken not a duck.
My example was exactly what you postulated. I took a fake, added real looking parts and claimed it was the real thing. I could then use that fake to get the same results you did without any of that troublesome work or money. How is that different from a clone?

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

The whole debate is a philosophical one! To use your duck metaphor I can dress a chicken up to look like a duck and even if it walks like one it is still a chicken not a duck.
My example was exactly what you postulated. I took a fake, added real looking parts and claimed it was the real thing. I could then use that fake to get the same results you did without any of that troublesome work or money. How is that different from a clone?

Eh fuck it, I don't care enough to explain why you're wrong.

Sorry you got burned so many times.

[Overdrive]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

My hat's off to everyone in this thread. Approaching 100 posts with maturity and respect.

Welp....so much for that

[FR-Sky]

Because our car looks good, and our chassis is good.

[EAGLE5]

Just to be clear, THERE IS NO GOD!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Eh fuck it, I don't care enough to explain why you're wrong.

Sorry you got burned so many times.

There is no "right" or "wrong" here. There are no facts or data that can be applied. It is an opinion based subject and that is that. We were talking about the very specific topic of should it be named the same not is it more fun or better with the swap. If you wish to expand the scope of the conversation then that needs to be clear. Even then there could be no right or wrong answer since not everybody uses it the same way.

I will try one more time with a subject you may understand.

I run out and buy a $75 Squire guitar.
I then buy the best pickups for it and slap a Strat sticker on it.
Is it now a top level Strat guitar?

[Overdrive]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I run out and buy a $75 Squire guitar.
I then buy the best pickups for it and slap a Strat sticker on it.
Is it now a top level Strat guitar?

Guess that depends on whether or not that's all they do to make a Fender Strat better than a Squire. If so, then yes, you do.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Overdrive

Guess that depends on whether or not that's all they do to make a Fender Strat better than a Squire. If so, then yes, you do.

Well if the difference between a $75 guitar and a $2500 guitar is just a $200 pickup then I doubt they would sell many $2500 guitars.

[EAGLE5]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Well if the difference between a $75 guitar and a $2500 guitar is just a $200 pickup then I doubt they would sell many $2500 guitars.

I thought we were talking about cars, not pickups. Who gives a fuck if somebody swaps a truck engine?

[EAGLE5]

Oh, the humanity! Oh, the inanity!