FR-S v.s. BRZ - Page 7 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

switchlanez · 01-01-2012, 10:38 PM

Stigmaru · 01-02-2012, 05:43 AM

I thought Yamaha worked on the cylinder head and helped with the fuel injection? Subaru did most if not all the engine work and it's not a bad motor Every article and test drive says it's a damn good engine for 200hp. :happy0180:

Ryephile · 01-02-2012, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AeroWRX

I thought Yamaha worked on the cylinder head and helped with the fuel injection? Subaru did most if not all the engine work and it's not a bad motor Every article and test drive says it's a damn good engine for 200hp. :happy0180:

There's no proof that Yamaha worked on the heads; it was an assumption based on past high HP/L Toyota engines. With the FA20, Toyota transplanted their D4S fuel injection at a minimum, and Subaru appeared to do the rest. I don't think the source of the ECU is known yet though.

bambbrose · 01-02-2012, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryephile

There's no proof that Yamaha worked on the heads; it was an assumption based on past high HP/L Toyota engines. With the FA20, Toyota transplanted their D4S fuel injection at a minimum, and Subaru appeared to do the rest. I don't think the source of the ECU is known yet though.

Keep in mind however, you can't just "transplant" D4-S, it requires complete rework of the entire head. The head needs to facilitate the extra injector, etc.

If Toyota provided D4-S, it is likely they provided the entire head design, or it was a very Toyota driven head collaboration. It's not like D4-S is just the intake manifold.

Ryephile · 01-02-2012, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bambbrose

Keep in mind however, you can't just "transplant" D4-S, it requires complete rework of the entire head. The head needs to facilitate the extra injector, etc.

If Toyota provided D4-S, it is likely they provided the entire head design, or it was a very Toyota driven head collaboration. It's not like D4-S is just the intake manifold.

Yes of course. Extra fuel lines, HPFP, camshaft w/extra lobe to drive the HPFP, and then the D4-S ECU fuel mapping that Subaru has zero experience with. It obviously needed design integration from the beginning of the engine design.

Stigmaru · 01-11-2012, 08:36 PM

Can we actually make a poll and see visual results on this?

AX_FRS · 01-18-2012, 12:37 PM

It's really hard to know without having anything confirmed which car is better. Really, I am leaning toward the FR-S because I think the BRZ looks a little boring, but final price would definitely dictate which direction I went. I don't have any loyalty toward either one of the companies and I'm pretty sure they both know how to make a decent car. Since no one has added this to the list of who contributed what, I'm pretty sure I saw that the differential came out of an IS300. I don't care who made what as long as it all works together like a good car should. The fact that they pulled from the "parts bin" only means that there is a better base for aftermarket already. And I don't care what people think of my car as long as I like it (for those of you worried about looking like a ricer). I've been driving a Focus for the last 5 years and I think it's a great car. I'm probably going to try to keep it and buy an FR-S when I can afford it because it's worlds more practical and winters suck up in MI.

ryude · 01-18-2012, 01:59 PM

Boring = Sophisticated

Everyone has their own interpretation of what they see.

cassidy0998 · 01-19-2012, 04:42 PM

ryude · 01-19-2012, 06:32 PM

It's actually a Daihatsu.

Argent6978 · 01-22-2012, 11:01 PM

I'm going with Scion. I just like it better. I looked at them both. I think the Subaru will be more expensive. I'm playing around with the idea of rebadging the FR-S as an Toyota 86, but I'm not sure if I'll go to the trouble.

Someone said something about Subaru designing the car and giving Toyota copies of the plans to build their own? I believe that's incorrect. All of the cars will be built at the same plant in Gunma. It's just a matter of which assembly line they go down as to what car they end up being.

Dave-ROR · 01-23-2012, 10:23 AM

Sorry for the large pic, it's from my NAIAS gallery.. but here's one thing I do NOT like about the FR-S over the BRZ (and I never noticed it until seeing the car in person). THe headlight on the FRS extends past the front bumper, where as the Subaru headlight sits behind the edge of the bumper. To me, it makes the FR-S headlight look unfinished/aftermarket/poor fitting/etc. My web host has been flaky the last 24 hours so hopefully it'll be stable soon

Example of the FR-S:

BRZ by comparison (not the same angle but it's obvious that it doesn't stick out like the FR-S:

GT3076rBRZ · 01-28-2012, 02:45 PM

It's all gonna come down to final pricing for me. I want to say the BRZ, but as someone said earlier I'm not really looking to spend/waste money on things I won't use.. I'm getting rid of the back seats, and gutting the trunk as well as deleting the entire audio system. I do however want oem hids, and I like the BRZ dash better. Idk I'll just have to go to a Toyota dealer pick up a FR-S drive it across the street to the Subie dealer park them side by side and chose. It's not like we can't swap parts between them shortly after release.

OrbitalEllipses · 01-28-2012, 05:10 PM

As with the above poster, it's about price for me. At a rumored $24K MSRP for the BRZ Premium including HIDs and navigation, that's a bit more than I'd like to pay. I don't like in-dash nav units, especially in this era of smartphones and Tom-Toms/Garmins. The deal killer for me is HIDs. If the FR-S doesn't come with them then I'm not buying it. In this day and age every car should have HIDs. The optics on my 11 year old WRX suck and if I'm buying a new car it needs to have HIDs.

Personally, the looks between the two are a wash for me, other than the headlights. I can with confidence say the headlights of the BRZ look much cleaner than the lights of the FR-S. The difference in the nose between the two is negligible, though I somewhat prefer the FR-S due the BRZ's black plastic mustache. That said, WRB is one of my favorite colors... I wouldn't mind a WRB BRZ Premium.

01-01-2012, 10:38 PM	#85
switchlanez Glorious BRZ Master Race Join Date: Apr 2011 Drives: Subaru Libird Location: Race Wars Posts: 3,645 Thanks: 1,050 Thanked 2,719 Times in 1,079 Posts Mentioned: 110 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	__________________ << BUILD THREAD >>

01-23-2012, 10:23 AM	#96
Dave-ROR Site Moderator Join Date: Dec 2010 Drives: Stuff Location: Florida Posts: 10,317 Thanks: 955 Thanked 5,965 Times in 2,689 Posts Mentioned: 262 Post(s) Tagged: 8 Thread(s)	Sorry for the large pic, it's from my NAIAS gallery.. but here's one thing I do NOT like about the FR-S over the BRZ (and I never noticed it until seeing the car in person). THe headlight on the FRS extends past the front bumper, where as the Subaru headlight sits behind the edge of the bumper. To me, it makes the FR-S headlight look unfinished/aftermarket/poor fitting/etc. My web host has been flaky the last 24 hours so hopefully it'll be stable soon Example of the FR-S: BRZ by comparison (not the same angle but it's obvious that it doesn't stick out like the FR-S: __________________ -Dave Track cars: 2013 Scion FRS, 1998 Acura Integra Type-R, 1993 Honda Civic Hatchback DD: 2005 Acura TSX Tow: 2022 F-450 Toys: 2001 Chevrolet Corvette Z06, 1993 Toyota MR2 Turbo, 1994 Toyota MR2 Turbo, 1991 Mitsubishi Galant VR-4 Parts: 2015 Subaru BRZ Limited, 2005 Acura TSX Projects: 2013 Subaru BRZ Limited track car build FS: 2004 GMC Sierra 2500 LT CCSB 8.1/Allison with 99k miles

01-02-2012, 05:43 AM	#86
Stigmaru Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Drives: 2022 Halo White GR86 Location: United States Posts: 213 Thanks: 21 Thanked 53 Times in 23 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I thought Yamaha worked on the cylinder head and helped with the fuel injection? Subaru did most if not all the engine work and it's not a bad motor Every article and test drive says it's a damn good engine for 200hp. :happy0180:

01-11-2012, 08:36 PM	#90
Stigmaru Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Drives: 2022 Halo White GR86 Location: United States Posts: 213 Thanks: 21 Thanked 53 Times in 23 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Can we actually make a poll and see visual results on this?

01-18-2012, 12:37 PM	#91
AX_FRS Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: 05 Ford Focus ZX4 Location: United States Posts: 139 Thanks: 41 Thanked 21 Times in 17 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	It's really hard to know without having anything confirmed which car is better. Really, I am leaning toward the FR-S because I think the BRZ looks a little boring, but final price would definitely dictate which direction I went. I don't have any loyalty toward either one of the companies and I'm pretty sure they both know how to make a decent car. Since no one has added this to the list of who contributed what, I'm pretty sure I saw that the differential came out of an IS300. I don't care who made what as long as it all works together like a good car should. The fact that they pulled from the "parts bin" only means that there is a better base for aftermarket already. And I don't care what people think of my car as long as I like it (for those of you worried about looking like a ricer). I've been driving a Focus for the last 5 years and I think it's a great car. I'm probably going to try to keep it and buy an FR-S when I can afford it because it's worlds more practical and winters suck up in MI.

01-18-2012, 01:59 PM	#92
ryude Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Drives: Volkswagen GTI Location: Louisiana Posts: 466 Thanks: 6 Thanked 32 Times in 13 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Boring = Sophisticated Everyone has their own interpretation of what they see.

01-19-2012, 04:42 PM	#93
cassidy0998 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Drives: '99 Ranger / '94 APU Supra / Ninja! Location: Missississississippi Posts: 462 Thanks: 3 Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)

01-19-2012, 06:32 PM	#94
ryude Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Drives: Volkswagen GTI Location: Louisiana Posts: 466 Thanks: 6 Thanked 32 Times in 13 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	It's actually a Daihatsu.

01-22-2012, 11:01 PM	#95
Argent6978 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: '05 Focus ZX3, soon '13 Scion FR-S Location: Missouri Posts: 179 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'm going with Scion. I just like it better. I looked at them both. I think the Subaru will be more expensive. I'm playing around with the idea of rebadging the FR-S as an Toyota 86, but I'm not sure if I'll go to the trouble. Someone said something about Subaru designing the car and giving Toyota copies of the plans to build their own? I believe that's incorrect. All of the cars will be built at the same plant in Gunma. It's just a matter of which assembly line they go down as to what car they end up being.

01-28-2012, 02:45 PM	#97
GT3076rBRZ Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: VW Mkv track car Location: Cleveland Ohio Posts: 20 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	It's all gonna come down to final pricing for me. I want to say the BRZ, but as someone said earlier I'm not really looking to spend/waste money on things I won't use.. I'm getting rid of the back seats, and gutting the trunk as well as deleting the entire audio system. I do however want oem hids, and I like the BRZ dash better. Idk I'll just have to go to a Toyota dealer pick up a FR-S drive it across the street to the Subie dealer park them side by side and chose. It's not like we can't swap parts between them shortly after release.

01-28-2012, 05:10 PM	#98
OrbitalEllipses Banned Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: Attitude Location: MD Posts: 10,046 Thanks: 884 Thanked 4,890 Times in 2,903 Posts Mentioned: 123 Post(s) Tagged: 4 Thread(s)	As with the above poster, it's about price for me. At a rumored $24K MSRP for the BRZ Premium including HIDs and navigation, that's a bit more than I'd like to pay. I don't like in-dash nav units, especially in this era of smartphones and Tom-Toms/Garmins. The deal killer for me is HIDs. If the FR-S doesn't come with them then I'm not buying it. In this day and age every car should have HIDs. The optics on my 11 year old WRX suck and if I'm buying a new car it needs to have HIDs. Personally, the looks between the two are a wash for me, other than the headlights. I can with confidence say the headlights of the BRZ look much cleaner than the lights of the FR-S. The difference in the nose between the two is negligible, though I somewhat prefer the FR-S due the BRZ's black plastic mustache. That said, WRB is one of my favorite colors... I wouldn't mind a WRB BRZ Premium.

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