Agency Power Exhaust Thread PT II

[empower-auto]

It's crazy how cheap it is to get 40whp more out of this car.

Thanks AP and Mike for the info. This is rad.

[vividracing]

Originally Posted by drifter

I noticed it said all runs were done on 91 oct. fuel. Please continue to verify which set-ups are CA friendly, inlcuding CA admissions, smog etc. It will be much appreciated.

I am working on details for a catted system. I am from California. I am fully aware of the CHP and locals doing hood pops. Been there done that.

Originally Posted by xjohnx

Can you dyno the exhaust on a stock car? (Read: no flywheel/crank pulley)

Unless someone wants to buy and have us install. I do not think that is going to happen to be honest. Way to much work to swap flywheels and clutches.

Originally Posted by os86

So am I right in assuming this that you gained 14whp with the addition of exhaust ,headers and midpipe ?

There seems to be so much conflicting information about your exhaust and I just need some clarification from you .

Thanks and Yes I might be keen

You did see what was just posted correct?

[Entropy]

I'd be interested to see how much HP the pulley is worth alone... wonder if it's enough to justify removing the OEM dampener.

[vividracing]

Originally Posted by empower-auto

It's crazy how cheap it is to get 40whp more out of this car.

Thanks AP and Mike for the info. This is rad.

Welcome.... This is such a great car and works so well adding bolt on's.
We have not even posted the intake details yet. And all this being untuned..

I think great things are coming and well keep coming from this car.

[_hollywood]

Keep pushing forward and ignoring the haters who all seem to have their doctorates in exhaust flow characteristics,

AP ftw

[mattles]

Originally Posted by vividracing

I am working on details for a catted system. I am from California. I am fully aware of the CHP and locals doing hood pops. Been there done that.



Unless someone wants to buy and have us install. I do not think that is going to happen to be honest. Way to much work to swap flywheels and clutches.



You did see what was just posted correct?

There are 9+ of us in the east valley now, surely someone will step up soon and buy an AP and you guys can dyno that car :3

[Superhatch]

Pulley makes 27hp.
Full header back exhaust makes 14 hp.
Can't explain that.

[Tainen]

1) Does it throw a check engine light?
2) Is it made in china?
3) Post back to back, day of dyno graphs, for each individual part, please.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by mike2100

So would Subaru intentionally leave the stuttering issue as is? Perhaps they thought it would motivate people to fix the issue by installing a lightweight pulley and flywheel. And since that mod nets 27 whp it would help spread excitement about the upgradability of this engine. (/conjecture)

You my man are watching way to many X-Files type pf TV programs...

[20valvewynn83]

Originally Posted by sportsguy83

You my man are watching way to many X-Files type pf TV programs...

This post is going to get everyone to burn out their clutch so that we can get a light weight flywheel and clutch lol

[Mr. Sociable]

Originally Posted by TwinscrollGT35R

Stop being a tool and read the threads.

All the info has been posted. You clearly have a bone to pick.

No, he's asking valid questions of a company. Lets look:



Run 1 (labeled 2800 Cal FRS Baseline Run 4) was done on 5/09 at 3:20pm.
Run 2 (labeled Stock everything 1) was done 7/20 at 7:18pm.
Run 3 (labeled AP Header back exhaust stock intake) was done 7/19 at 8:05pm.

This means header back exhaust run (which also apparently includes the pulley/flywheel despite it not being mentioned in the last thread) was done before the "stock everything" run, which would be just the crank pulley/flywheel. To do this, they would have had to dyno a baseline, then install all the parts, including flywheel and crank pulley, dyno it, then remove the headerback and put the stock exhaust back on and dyno again to get just the gains from the flywheel/crank pulley, then reinstall the AP exhaust. Doesn't make any sense to do it that way.

Disregarding that , we run into a few issues.

First, Vivid claims:

Originally Posted by vividracing

Run#2 Was with the Flywheel and Crank Pulley.

This would mean that either they're lying, or they've incorrectly labeled the runs in the dyno. I see no reason why someone would take the time to label all the runs and still manage to get them incorrect, but hey...not my shop. They make zero mention on the dyno graph that the car had a pulley/flywheel installed.

Second, let's look at this picture (since I can't quote from the other thread now that it's closed):


Here, you can clearly see the same dyno run name (AP Header back exhaust stock intake run 2) but they make NO claim or note of there being a pulley or flywheel installed. They're claiming the entire power gain from the exhaust alone. Now they're going to change their story and claim there were parts that weren't mentioned the first time? Misleading and unethical. They were asked multiple times in the first few pages of the other thread and they never mentioned the crank pully or flywheel.

Third, even if it was an honest mistake on their part (I have my doubts that it was), the times of the dyno runs are equally important. An all stock baseline run done at 3:00pm (aka the hottest part of the day) will have wildly different ambient temperatures than the other runs done during the evening. I don't care if the car sat for a month or a day, ambient temperature matters when dyno testing. Additionally, that's the 4th baseline run, meaning heatsoak begins to be a consideration. How was the car allowed to cool off? Compare this to the 1st or 2nd runs that the other ones are listed as and we have a discrepancy.


I don't even care about how much peak HP was made. Claim 150whp or claim 200whp, that will vary by dyno. What matters to me is the claims of +XXhp over the baseline runs, numbers which aren't believable and have too many discrepancies to have any valid sense of proof. Throw in the mismarketing of the steel type and every other problem that has been brought up and I see little reason to believe anything that's been claimed so far.


Someone feel free to prove me wrong. Do an independent dyno test and show similar gains. Until then, I await Vivid's response. I've tried to be tactful and would like explanations that make sense. Hell, send me the parts, I'll dyno them, post results, and ship them back.

Mods - I could care less about their previous history or anything else related to Vivid. Only trying to validate what I find to be difficult to believe numbers. They were given a clean slate, let them prove that it's still clean.

[slrml617]

Originally Posted by Mr. Sociable

They make zero mention on the dyno graph that the car had a pulley/flywheel installed.

Here, you can clearly see the same dyno run name (AP Header back exhaust stock intake run 2) but they make NO claim or note of there being a pulley or flywheel installed. They're claiming the entire power gain from the exhaust alone. Now they're going to change their story and claim there were parts that weren't mentioned the first time? Misleading and unethical. They were asked multiple times in the first few pages of the other thread and they never mentioned the crank pully or flywheel.

The BOLD part is the main problem.
mods remember what you said.

[86design]

we must have a group buy for those headers

[ttknf]

What kind of quality control and R&D are you guys doing on this exhaust? I ask because I'm weary after all the issues with some of the other AP parts, specifically the intake for GT-R.