Winter tires handling issue

[~el~jefe~]

This is why I bought the OEM spec 215/45/17 Pirelli SottoZero 3's, mounted to my perf package rims. I am the anti-forum forum poster by doing this. So far, there is no snow or ice, only lower 40's F temperature daily average and some 52 F degree days. I wrote a first week review of it in this tire forum. I will update for Ice, and then Snow.

I have a thought that is cold air. It is very dense. Or sort of dense. Cold air has more mass force to push stuff around. I do not know what temperatures you experience.

Another thing that can induce that squirly feeling are actual squirrels living in your tires or fender arches. Think of how they move and how fluid they are, it only makes sense that you experience strange shifts while you drive.

[Ultramaroon]

so much to absorb

[nico_rsx]

I have the exact same tires: hakka 7 which has now been renamed nordman 7. Brand new and installed 2 days ago.
I have the same feeling you have. It's normal. Winter tires are like big blocks of jello. You have a lot less feeling in the stering, and there is a lag when you turn the steering, because the tread deform before the car change direction. Like you my car is moving left/right a lot.
There is not much you can do.
I haven't met a lot of snow/ice yet with them, but I expect they will be phenomenal winter tire (got the studded version).
I had a bit of snow/ice last week-end with the primacies, and they are a death trap, that was just ridiculous.
Good winter tire su*k on dry pavement, but in snow they really shine.

[Stang70Fastback]

Originally Posted by nico_rsx

Good winter tire su*k on dry pavement, but in snow they really shine.

I just want to clarify this statement. Good winter tires suck at giving the same level of steering wheel feedback, and have that awful lag / lack of crisp turn-in due to their soft nature, but they don't suck on dry pavement in terms of grip. They will out-grip a summer tire all day long on dry pavement.

[why?]

I upped the pressure in my general altimax artics to 40 psi and it helped. Of course my other car is a Yaris and it is on general altimax rs43 in 185/65/14, so I am use to the less immediate turn in and the like.

[Tcoat]

Let's be very clear on this subject!
Winter tires even those called "performance" are NOT performance tires. You will not be able to throw the car around like you do on other tires. That is the fact of the matter.

They are intended to get you from point A to point B in cold, snowy, icy weather in one piece. If you get even half decent ones they do that very, very well. Yes, they drive different and yes, you lose much of your ability to play. That is the compromise you have to make in order to not spend all your time either stuck, in the ditch or shopping for a new car to replace your totaled one. If you are driving your car on snows in the winter (or when warm for that matter) but still expect the car to have all the same feel and abilities it does on real performance tires in the summer you are going to be in for a load of disappointment.

Just try to forget the cuz' racecar mentality for a few months and the snows no longer become an issue.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Let's be very clear on this subject!
Winter tires even those called "performance" are NOT performance tires. You will not be able to throw the car around like you do on other tires. That is the fact of the matter.

...

Just try to forget the cuz' racecar mentality for a few months and the snows no longer become an issue.

Q...

F...

E

[nico_rsx]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

I just want to clarify this statement. Good winter tires suck at giving the same level of steering wheel feedback, and have that awful lag / lack of crisp turn-in due to their soft nature, but they don't suck on dry pavement in terms of grip. They will out-grip a summer tire all day long on dry pavement.

Yes you're right, as long as the dry pavement we're talking about is cold. Summer tire below 45F loose their grip, and the winter tire have better grip in low temp. But driving winter tire in the summer is not recommended, because they don't have the same stopping power as a summer tire (in hot temperature).

[churchx]

But due human psychology winter tires being slightly worse in summer in grip/stopping is not what prevents most often their use in summer .. it's their quicker wear that is reason for most to switch to summer ones. Humans are cheapskates.

[Stang70Fastback]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Just try to forget the cuz' racecar mentality for a few months and the snows no longer become an issue.

This! Winter tires give a nice, cushy ride due to their soft tread, which also makes them MUCH quieter than summer tires. Just enjoy the ride and make the best of the GOOD characteristics. It'll just make the switch back to summers all the more fun come spring.

Every year when I switch back to summer tires, I almost spear off the road the first time I go to change lanes on the highway, lol.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

This! Winter tires give a nice, cushy ride due to their soft tread, which also makes them MUCH quieter than summer tires. Just enjoy the ride and make the best of the GOOD characteristics. It'll just make the switch back to summers all the more fun come spring.

Every year when I switch back to summer tires, I almost spear off the road the first time I go to change lanes on the highway, lol.

This is why I went to AS tires so I can extend my fun time by a few weeks and get them back on in March instead of the end of April.


Not sure about them being quieter though. My snows are far louder. I get used to the woo,woo,woo,woo,woo,woo,woo, though and when I change back in the spring it makes the switch that much more enjoyable.

[Stang70Fastback]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

This is why I went to AS tires so I can extend my fun time by a few weeks and get them back on in March instead of the end of April.


Not sure about them being quieter though. My snows are far louder. I get used to the woo,woo,woo,woo,woo,woo,woo, though and when I change back in the spring it makes the switch that much more enjoyable.

Heh, well I'm also going from 255 section Michelin PSS on 18" wheels, to 215 section Altimax Arctics on 17" wheels, so for me the difference is night and day in terms of road noise and comfort.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

Heh, well I'm also going from 255 section Michelin PSS on 18" wheels, to 215 section Altimax Arctics on 17" wheels, so for me the difference is night and day in terms of road noise and comfort.

That is a pretty dramatic change. I am running cheapass Champiro GT radial snows that give me that monster truck look and sound. Noisy, squishy, bulbous tires but I can walk through snow that has others afraid to leave their driveway.

[Stang70Fastback]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I can walk through snow that has others afraid to leave their driveway.

Always fun to pass SUVs and other larger vehicles and see the funny looks you get in your tiny little sports car.