Innovate (Sprintex) Supercharger Owners Topic

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

It's what we're using... (it's included in the kit that we have on our car)

Effectively you have negated the what a PCV system is for.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Robftss

Effectively you have negated the what a PCV system is for.

How so?

The PCV system is there to take combustion gasses in the crank case, and return it to the intake manifold.

The intake manifold on a NA car will always be a vaccuum of some degree, so the PCV is always flowing INTO the intake manifold.

Once you boost the car, the intake manifold can be pressurized, causing air to flow from the intake manifold to the crankcase.

The one way check valve allows air from the crankcase to flow to the intake manifold (which is the purpose of the PCV), but not the other way (never supposed to flow that way to begin with).

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

My solution would be to use a check valve to prevent the air/oil mixture from reaching the supercharger via the PCV/breather.

Because you wrote this.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Robftss

Because you wrote this.

Why is there oil there to begin with?

We haven't observed any oil level drops both NA and with our setup...

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

How so?

The PCV system is there to take combustion gasses in the crank case, and return it to the intake manifold.

The intake manifold on a NA car will always be a vaccuum of some degree, so the PCV is always flowing INTO the intake manifold.

Once you boost the car, the intake manifold can be pressurized, causing air to flow from the intake manifold to the crankcase.

The one way check valve allows air from the crankcase to flow to the intake manifold (which is the purpose of the PCV), but not the other way (never supposed to flow that way to begin with).

This is correct, but still "allows air from the crankcase (aka oil/fumes) to flow to the intake manifold"

The stock PCV (for this car) actually checks positive pressure, not a complete seal, but enough not to pressurize the crankcase.

[CSG Mike]

Still doesn't explain why there's oil in there to begin with...

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Still doesn't explain why there's oil in there to begin with...

To be clear: Where do you have check valves and which way do they close.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Robftss

To be clear: Where do you have check valves and which way do they close.

one check valve, manifold to crankcase, and it allows flow crankcase to manifold, and disallows flow from manifold to crankcase.

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

one check valve, manifold to crankcase, and it allows flow crankcase to manifold, and disallows flow from manifold to crankcase.

Ok, but this will still allow crankcase fumes to enter the manifold (downstream of the SC) just like stock. The discussion was to put a catch in this area to prevent this from happening.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Robftss

Ok, but this will still allow crankcase fumes to enter the manifold (downstream of the SC) just like stock. The discussion was to put a catch in this area to prevent this from happening.

You guys are addressing the symptom. I'm asking what the cause is...

[calispec]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You guys are addressing the symptom. I'm asking what the cause is...

Oil gets suspended in the air that flows through that tube. It's caused by oil colliding with the crank and other moving parts in the engine while it is running. This is why having catch cans with baffles is very important. The baffles create a surface for this oil to collide with and separate from the air.

First let's be clear that the manifold where this tube enters should ALWAYS be in some sort of vacuum. Sometimes small during WOT and sometimes large while the throttle is closed. This fitting is between the throttle body and the screws. Compression only happens after the screws. If the bypass is open it does allow recirculating to occur but the pressure post throttle body must me less than pre or we would start blowing air out of our air filter and have a negative mas air flow reading.

That being said. A check valve is not necessary with this supercharger. There could be some flow that travels from the manifold to the crank case because the amount of vacuum decreases during WOT but there will still be vacuum on the system. I would be afraid of the check valve getting soaked in oil restricting flow and causing problems. It could clog up all together stopping flow and causing the crank case to build pressure.

I just found a pretty sweet inexpensive catch can. I'll post pictures and a source soon.

[xjohnx]

installed the stock injectors with @DeliciousTuning's base tune and it feels a ton smoother than the dw700's. I wanted to get the stock injectors installed before i did the intercooler (rather than doing them at the same time) so that if there were any issues during the intercooler install i wouldn't be chasing two possible sources.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You guys are addressing the symptom. I'm asking what the cause is...

Aeration of the oil happens in any engine, it's a result of the oil sloshing around, being turned up by the crankshaft, and just as the oil drains back to the pan.

The PCV system is there to remove blowby gasses from the crank case to prevent contamination of the oil, but it will also pick up the aerated oil and deposit that into intake manifold. The check valve prevents the crank case from being pressurized and is certainly a good idea to install (I woke up on the other side of an engine room with a 50 lb enclosure door on top of me the last time I saw a crank case get pressurized, but that was a slightly larger engine) but it doesn't solve all the issues. The problem is, a metric fuck ton of places sell vent to atmosphere catch cans. These will stop all the aerated oil from making it into the intake manifold, but they also completely disable the PCV system, allowing the blowby gasses to contaminate the oil. The best solution is to run the check valve, as you described, and two air/oil separators, one in each line for an FI system.

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You guys are addressing the symptom. I'm asking what the cause is...

This is where the confusion is. There is no disease (cause). It is the nature of combustion engines. Every engine has oil vapor in the crank case.

The whole reason for the PCV system and Breather system is to vent atomized oil/vapor back to the intake manifold instead of dumping it to the environment (emissions reasons).