2013 Honda Civic Si Sedan vs 2013 Subaru BRZ

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by iJDMTOY

I feel as though the 9th generation Civic Si's are more oriented towards fuel economy and emissions standards rather than the performance side of it. The larger K24 engine has more torque which is what the American market wants, easier to drive around the city and makes the butt dyno feel happy. As far as performance wise, it's still a new engine and all, but the integrated exhaust manifold seems like a big limiting factor among other things. All in all, it's built with emissions and economy as priority, not performance.

It seems like Honda has a trend of making a good car, bad car, good car, then bad car again, etc. The 99-01 EM1 was a great car.. the 2002-2005 EP3 not so much.. the 2006-2012 FA5/FG2 was a great car again.. now it's crap again

A more fair comparison would be the FRS/BRZ vs the 2006-2012 Civic Si's instead. Let's take a look at the pros and cons:

FRS/BRZ -

PROS:

Huge ass aftermarket support
Plenty of potential
Definitely a more sporty looking
Interior seems to be more refined and elegant
Handles very well on the track with the right driver

CONS:

Engine issues? (seems like there is a reliability issue from reading about the issues on the forums)
Engine is lacking quite a bit IMO. Struggling to make 200whp is a big negative to me

2006-2012 Civic Si -

PROS:

Engine responds really well to simple mods, easily making 200whp with I/H/E + tune. Up to 240-250 with cams and other supporting mods.
Handles great when setup properly and with the right driver
A lot of space (esp in a four door)
Reliable and fuel efficient even with mods

CONS:

Aftermarket support sucks in comparison with you guys
FWD does have it's limits, it'd be better if they had the K20 in a RWD platform (cough cough Ariel Atom)
Rear suspension design is focused for comfort (I forget the actual name for it, but the shock and spring are not together and are separated)
Looks like any other Civic on the road for the most part

This is definitely a biased opinion as I have never driven a FRS/BRZ (although I want to) on the track or street, but I do one day. I own a 2008 Civic Si and track it often. I want to own both cars and have the best of both worlds to be honest.

Of course Honda has to be obsessed with efficiency they have done it to compete up until last year there engines weren't even Direct injection, then they came along with the earth dreams V6 which surprised everyone that they could actually make some horsepower. IMHO after the FRS/BRZ and what not Honda will have an itching to bring back the S2000 because they will realize the market is still here for a fun RWD car.

[iJDMTOY]

Originally Posted by FRSBRZGT86FAN

Of course Honda has to be obsessed with efficiency they have done it to compete up until last year there engines weren't even Direct injection, then they came along with the earth dreams V6 which surprised everyone that they could actually make some horsepower. IMHO after the FRS/BRZ and what not Honda will have an itching to bring back the S2000 because they will realize the market is still here for a fun RWD car.

I hope that Honda decides to come out with a real sports car again.. who knows, they may! Honda is planning to re-enter Formula 1 again in a partnership with Mclaren as their engine supplier in 2015 so there is still some hope.

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by iJDMTOY

I hope that Honda decides to come out with a real sports car again.. who knows, they may! Honda is planning to re-enter Formula 1 again in a partnership with Mclaren as their engine supplier in 2015 so there is still some hope.

Honda+Mclaren= Senna

If formula one ever moves to 4 cylinder turbo or four cylinders in general Honda Will kick ass thats for sure VTEC at 15000 RPM

[charged86]

Originally Posted by iJDMTOY

I hope that Honda decides to come out with a real sports car again.. who knows, they may! Honda is planning to re-enter Formula 1 again in a partnership with Mclaren as their engine supplier in 2015 so there is still some hope.

put the rdx turbo motor in an all new rwd honda car non convertible

[iJDMTOY]

Originally Posted by FRSBRZGT86FAN

Honda+Mclaren= Senna

If formula one ever moves to 4 cylinder turbo or four cylinders in general Honda Will kick ass thats for sure VTEC at 15000 RPM

2015 is set to have a engines that are turbo 1.6l V6's. So badass

Originally Posted by charged86

put the rdx turbo motor in an all new rwd honda car non convertible

Torque monster. That'd be quite interesting to see happen

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by iJDMTOY

2015 is set to have a engines that are turbo 1.6l V6's. So badass



Torque monster. That'd be quite interesting to see happen

I know right but eventually they will downsize even more, which I hate because F1 should be about pushing the limits of motors and speed, but when they do Honda will be there lol

[Celica00]

love Honda/acura and Toyota/lexus equally. both have such beautiful history and line ups. I hope they both strive to beat each other because that just means we win as the consumer. now for the FRS vs SI... as far as what's important to me, FRS wins. RWD, small, lightweight, curb appeal, and driver feel.

[thill]

The Civic SI also weighs several hundred more pounds than an FR-S and does not sit as low to the ground or have the drivers cockpit the FRZ has. The 2013 Civic model does nothing for me (my other car is a Honda and I like the company). Would love to see Honda get back in the RWD sports coupe game, but I am not convinced they will anytime soon.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by FRSBRZGT86FAN

Of course Honda has to be obsessed with efficiency they have done it to compete up until last year there engines weren't even Direct injection, then they came along with the earth dreams V6 which surprised everyone that they could actually make some horsepower. IMHO after the FRS/BRZ and what not Honda will have an itching to bring back the S2000 because they will realize the market is still here for a fun RWD car.

The V6 currently found in any Honda is not an Earth Dreams motor. It's just a lightly revised version of the V6 that's been around for a while, and only has an extra 10-15 hp. Dunno where you got the idea that all of a sudden it had some serious hp?

Honda is teaming up with McLaren again starting in 2015. They will be supplying the team's engines, which in adherence with the rules will be a 1.6 liter turbocharged V6.

[R3d]

Originally Posted by FRSfan111

My mom has one, it pulls decent but the rpm range is even shorter then my FRS :/ I mis the days of 10k red lines.

its not a bad car, they offered me 5k off the retail to switch my 8th gen so i went to try it and its not the same.

[Dwood11]

FWD. Fail!

[dskater411]

Everyone bashing the civic is just trying to feel better about themselves with their own car. The SI is a great little car. I had a 2008 SI two cars ago, now I have a 2014 BRZ. Each have their selling points. I do like the BRZ more, but it is also newer. FWD really isnt much of a limitation for the civic, just watch this video
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBPq7D28xGg"]2013 Subaru BRZ vs. 2012 Honda Civic Si HFP - YouTube[/ame]


In my opinion the civic has the better engine, and the engine note is beautiful when vtec kicks in. The brz just sounds ugly. The civic also had a better ride, the best transmission/clutch I have ever touched, literally butter when shifting. MUCH better stock audio system, could fold the seats down and throw in my mountain bike, take it camping, take 4 coworkers to lunch, and still have fun throwing it around corners.
I gave up all of that for a cheap sporty, but immensly fun car to drive in the brz. Not everyone has the same priorities. Just love what you drive but don't put yourself on a high horse.
Personal opinion about the new civic though - I think they have stepped backwards, my 2008 2.0 was a blast, the new 2.4 with lower redline takes away some of that fun, and it doesn't look as nice anymore either.

[JS + BRZ]

The Si has been slowly uglified for the past 6 years.

It was a great little car back in the days.

Nowadays, there are so many pocket rockets that offer much better value for $.

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by Kaster

Not a car I would ever buy... But all that matters is you are happy with your purchase!

Same. I wasn't happy in an STI, so I'd be absolutely miserable in a Civic SI wagon.

They'll have to take my BRZ from my cold, dead hands.