FA20 oiling problems, study and solution

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

Quality control issues bleeding over into web content. Could only afford the One Sigma model.

Non linear or classical?



yes I had to look that up

[FrickingReallySlow]

You're on your 3rd engine now correct after suffering through 2 spun bearings? Did you get a chance to look at the internals and if its always the same #2 or #3 bearing and what the wear patterns were? did you do any UAO?

I put in the killer B, it fits all 2013-2020 86s

Originally Posted by demasrv

The Killer B Motorsport website lists that the oil pickup fitment is for a 2015+ BRZ/FRS. Does anyone know why? I'm in the middle of rebuilding my 2013, purchased this pickup but I'm not sure what the differences would be. I don't remember seeing any major differences around the oil pan when I was looking at buying a newer engine for the 2013 instead of attempting a rebuild. I did reach out to them via their form on the site so I'll report back if/when they respond.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

Non linear or classical?



yes I had to look that up

I was too cryptic. Lame Six Sigma reference. Sorry.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

I was too cryptic. Lame Six Sigma reference. Sorry.

Well now I am confused

[demasrv]

I received a response from Killer B:

You are correct about the oil pan. They changed them in 2015 and that is the model pan that our pickup fits. I’m not sure why they changed the pan but the new pan is a little deeper where the pickup tube sits.


Let me know if there is anything else I can help you with,
Nick Ruston
Killer B Motorsports

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by demasrv

I received a response for Killer B:

That is interesting.

[demasrv]

Originally Posted by FrickingReallySlow

You're on your 3rd engine now correct after suffering through 2 spun bearings? Did you get a chance to look at the internals and if its always the same #2 or #3 bearing and what the wear patterns were? did you do any UAO?

I put in the killer B, it fits all 2013-2020 86s

Yeah 3rd engine. First one went around 54k and was replaced under warranty. The shop just said one of the bearings went but everything else was fine. This engine I'm rebuilding now went at 78k, with the valve spring recall done at 65k. I think it was #3 that spun this time but I'm not sure which cylinder it was on the first engine. I haven't cracked the block yet but will once I get the wiring harness and everything moved over to the new block.


I know the first time around, the service tech told me my heads and almost everything else in the engine looked flawless. This is what I'm seeing in my current rebuild--heads and everything look really clean. I found one small metal shaving but even the oil pan was really clean.



I don't know what you mean by UAO.

[demasrv]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

That is interesting.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯




Maybe the supersessions represent the change? I don't have a newer one to compare against but in all the pictures they look the same



https://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru__B...1109AA222.html

Part Number: 11109AA222
Supersession(s): 11109AA220; 11109AA221

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by demasrv

¯\_(ツ)_/¯




Maybe the supersessions represent the change? I don't have a newer one to compare against but in all the pictures they look the same



https://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru__B...1109AA222.html

Part Number: 11109AA222
Supersession(s): 11109AA220; 11109AA221

I saw the pan number changed but the pickup is the same.

[FrickingReallySlow]

Used oil analysis. Need to do it 3-4 times to establish trends and see the wear metals start to rise. its not definitive (plenty of BMW owners will attest to this) but can give you early warning signs.

interestingly enough UOA actually won't pickup metals shavings you can see with your eye. That's because they are too big and don't atomize and make it into spectrometer. They can only find the microscopic particles that are small enough to get vaporized by plasma

Let us know what you find in your shortblock!

Originally Posted by demasrv

Yeah 3rd engine. First one went around 54k and was replaced under warranty. The shop just said one of the bearings went but everything else was fine. This engine I'm rebuilding now went at 78k, with the valve spring recall done at 65k. I think it was #3 that spun this time but I'm not sure which cylinder it was on the first engine. I haven't cracked the block yet but will once I get the wiring harness and everything moved over to the new block.


I know the first time around, the service tech told me my heads and almost everything else in the engine looked flawless. This is what I'm seeing in my current rebuild--heads and everything look really clean. I found one small metal shaving but even the oil pan was really clean.



I don't know what you mean by UAO.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by demasrv

I received a response from Killer B:

I retract my snarky comment with respect to their website content.

[demasrv]

Originally Posted by FrickingReallySlow

Used oil analysis. Need to do it 3-4 times to establish trends and see the wear metals start to rise. its not definitive (plenty of BMW owners will attest to this) but can give you early warning signs.

interestingly enough UOA actually won't pickup metals shavings you can see with your eye. That's because they are too big and don't atomize and make it into spectrometer. They can only find the microscopic particles that are small enough to get vaporized by plasma

Let us know what you find in your shortblock!

Ah yeah I've requested one of their containers before but forgot to send it in. I'll probably do that with this rebuild. Mostly nervous about gasket material ending up in the oil...

[chipmunk]

This is regarding the pickup tube...
I cross checked the part number for OEM pickup tube, it only fits BRZs 2013-2020. So it's hard to argue that the tube was taken from parts bin. It seems to be specifically designed for this application. Then why would Subaru engineers select that diameter for the tube? And why that bend? I want to install Killer B tube, but there has to be calculated reason why Subaru went with the OEM design. So is it worth switching to Killer B? Instead of any benefits, are there any unforeseen drawbacks to using larger tube,?

[Irace86.2.0]

Necroed this to show cavitation in this video.

https://youtube.com/shorts/xM6zdim0yk4?feature=share