iOS in the car

[Zippy]

Originally Posted by johnnie

Sorry, but you're wrong. If you use iOS with Jailbreak, which voids the warranty and is even illegal in some places, you basically can't install anything that is not approved by apple and digitally signed by them. Unless you use one of the hacks that surfaced recently, but which are not here by design. They are simply hacks, that can be broken at any time.

So yeah you can't really say the system is open just because you can hack it, void warranties, and have to jump through hoops in every step of the process just to install an "hello world" app.

Ok, I thought that you could generate an app package and import that into iTunes with the developer kit. A co-worker had me testing one of their apps before release by sending me the app file. That was several years ago though. The Siri app I have was from the app store, so that makes sense it imported just fine to a friends iTunes.

I never said their system was open. I said they open sourced some of their code and provided links to it and their open source site. I love it when words get put in to my mouth.

[2forme]

So, @Zippy, if they don't open source their GUI or Apps.... then what exactly is open sourced about iOS... because it's pretty much just a GUI OS with apps.

[qoncept]

Originally Posted by HooverFish

There's open technologies and standards which work JUST FINE for what people need but nope, everybody rushes to Apple's closed environment and just craps on the rest of us... sorta like this little thing called Bespoke that's in my car but completely and utterly useless to me (thank god it was a free upgrade).

Couldn't disagree more. The car stereo market is completely abysmal and someone that has a clue making something is way past due. And unfortunately Apple seems to be just about the only company in the world that has a clue how to make a decent user interface.

The fact that I can't get in my car and listen to Pandora 100% hassle free and as easily as just hearing the radio when I start it up is ridiculous. Using the OE Subaru Nav HU's mp3 browsing is absolute garbage compared to an ipod. The maps interface is stupid and unintuitive and they expect me to PAY for updates?

I tried a Ca-fi knockoff for exactly 5 minutes and sent it back. I use an Android phone but it's not the answer for a car.

[console_cowboy]

Apple is a "proponent" of open source software because they basically borrowed a huge portion of their operating systems from the opensource community. By law they HAVE to give back a good portion of their code. If they code take the code and not give back at all, trust me, they would. The open source part of OSX was already open sourced to start with...

[wparsons]

^^ They didn't borrow it, the OSX kernel is flat out built off of BSD. No borrowing at all, they simply modified and extended it. As for the licensing, that's mostly correct. BSD is licensed in such a way that anything that uses or derives from it has to have the same license as the original release. They can close off the UI because it's their own product and not based on anything open source.

Originally Posted by johnnie

Sorry, but you're wrong. If you use iOS with Jailbreak, which voids the warranty and is even illegal in some places, you basically can't install anything that is not approved by apple and digitally signed by them. Unless you use one of the hacks that surfaced recently, but which are not here by design. They are simply hacks, that can be broken at any time.

So yeah you can't really say the system is open just because you can hack it, void warranties, and have to jump through hoops in every step of the process just to install an "hello world" app.

If you have a developer account or are jailbroken you can install anything you want on the phone (or ipod/ipad/etc). You can even create a provisioning profile for other devices based on their UUID and publish the app for that device only, even if the owner of the device doesn't have a developer account.

Originally Posted by 2forme

I would choose the store that has more available users. Play store. Considering Apple only holds 1/3 or so marketshare out of smartphones...

And no, not every app is able to be sold through iTunes. Apple monitors what apps are released and removes them if they conflict with something Apple offers or just doesn't like.

Again, I'd like to see a customized version of iOS (since you claim it's open source) that is able to be installed on an iDevice. Android is open source and has a ton of different customized flavors able to be loaded. That's open source....

You should really look up what open source really means, it has NOTHING to do with what the OS lets you do/install at all.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/wenjiazh...urce-software/

Android still requires devices to be rooted to get full access to some things, it's just more lenient in what it'll allow you to customize out of the box. There's also a TON more compatibility issues with android than iOS, all because there are a ton of different distros/versions/packages/etc.

Originally Posted by 2forme

So, @Zippy, if they don't open source their GUI or Apps.... then what exactly is open sourced about iOS... because it's pretty much just a GUI OS with apps.

If you think iOS is just a GUI you need to give your head a shake. Just because you don't interact with the OS through a terminal or command prompt doesn't mean there isn't a ton of processes and services running that aren't GUI based. Just look at what launching an app really does, it passes a command prompt to the OS via the shortcut.

If you're running a windows computer open up the task manager and look at how many MS processes/services are running, only one of them is the GUI (explorer.exe), the rest (minus third party programs running) are all command based services/processes that work by making calls or passing messages to/from the OS.

[2forme]

@wparsons, I'm well aware of what open source means. Senior Zippy is the one who needs a brushup. Thanks for your concern, though.

The very nature of open source is exactly why there's so many flavors and customized builds of Android. How many flavors and customized builds are there of iOS?

And no, it's not just a GUI and apps. It's an OS. I was being sarcastically exaggerated at the expense of an Apple fan. LOL

[2forme]

http://jalopnik.com/bmw-tells-apple-...ium=socialflow

Even BMW knows. LOL. If iOS was truly open source, why would BMW need to change all THEIR systems for Apple? They should be able to just take an open source build of iOS and add the protocol handlers/services/apps for their existing systems.

[xjohnx]

FWIW, I'm running iOS 7 on my iPhone 5, it worked right away with my AppRadio 2. Surprised me, figured there'd be at least a few compatibility issues, but not one.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by 2forme

http://jalopnik.com/bmw-tells-apple-...ium=socialflow

Even BMW knows. LOL. If iOS was truly open source, why would BMW need to change all THEIR systems for Apple? They should be able to just take an open source build of iOS and add the protocol handlers/services/apps for their existing systems.

As much as you think you get it, you really don't get what open source means.

iOS is open source, the iDevices don't support open source firmware. BMW could easily develop their own version of iOS, but don't expect any unhacked devices to be able to run it.

Software is open source, it doesn't mean anything about the hardware it runs on. Just look at windows vs linux. Linux is open source and runs on the same hardware as windows, which is the furthest thing from open source. Now look at a windows phone, same basic OS as the desktop, but you can't install linux on it. That doesn't make linux less open source, it makes the hardware more restrictive.

[s2d4]

Originally Posted by wparsons

As much as you think you get it, you really don't get what open source means.

iOS is open source, the iDevices don't support open source firmware. BMW could easily develop their own version of iOS, but don't expect any unhacked devices to be able to run it.

Software is open source, it doesn't mean anything about the hardware it runs on. Just look at windows vs linux. Linux is open source and runs on the same hardware as windows, which is the furthest thing from open source. Now look at a windows phone, same basic OS as the desktop, but you can't install linux on it. That doesn't make linux less open source, it makes the hardware more restrictive.

You have no idea what is open source.

Hint:
Open source - source code- publicly avaliable- alter/collaborate and compile whatever flavour.

[2forme]

Originally Posted by wparsons

As much as you think you get it, you really don't get what open source means.

iOS is open source, the iDevices don't support open source firmware. BMW could easily develop their own version of iOS, but don't expect any unhacked devices to be able to run it.

Software is open source, it doesn't mean anything about the hardware it runs on. Just look at windows vs linux. Linux is open source and runs on the same hardware as windows, which is the furthest thing from open source. Now look at a windows phone, same basic OS as the desktop, but you can't install linux on it. That doesn't make linux less open source, it makes the hardware more restrictive.

If iOS was truly open source, BMW would have run in their vehicle. Think about it. They said no, because they'd have to change all their protocols and interfaces to fit within the confines of iOS. Had iOS been open source, it would quite literally be a job of extending the iOS platform with apps and services that could read/interact with their currently developed protocols and interfaces. It has absolutely nothing to do with running iOS on hacked Apple devices. They aren't sticking an iPad in the car and running the car off it. It would be it's own customized, integrated platform that just happened to be running a customized iOS operating system.

Don't confuse a platform that has an SDK with being open source.

[Z86]

Originally Posted by Z86

http://www.apple.com/ios/ios7/features/#carintegration

And please don't troll with what mobile OS is better - the reality is that there are lots of people that use different ones

Thanks guys, thought we could have a civil discussion about a cool technology for those of us that choose to run iOS. I guess civil and the internet never works.

[2forme]

Originally Posted by Z86

Thanks guys, thought we could have a civil discussion about a cool technology for those of us that choose to run iOS. I guess civil and the internet never works.

We aren't arguing which OS is better. We are arguing whether or not iOS is open source. As far as iOS arguments go, it's been relatively civil LOL.

[qoncept]

I don't know where the open source talk is coming from but iOS is certainly not. Apple bought NeXTSTEP in 1997, at some point renamed it to Cocoa, and started building Mac OSX on top of it, and eventually iOS. None are open source. If you want open source, check out GNUstep. Or check out my sig.