Richmond VA Dyno Day Results 5/4/13

[mad_sb]

[quote=vtmike;911550]

Originally Posted by wdninja

Here's mine:


Your a/f looks good compared to mine. I'm going to have to do some data logging tomorrow and see what's screwing it up. Something is up, my torque in the dip is lower than what you're car is showing.

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You guys should both get a log of your long term fuel trims during a pull.

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by vtmike

That explains it then. Only problem is I have no way of knowing if I fixed the problem now without adding a wideband with greater range.

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e85 or pump? 12:1 is too rich for pump if you want to make good power.. e85 will probably target high 11's to very low 12's.

[vtmike]

[quote=mad_sb;913053]

Originally Posted by vtmike

You guys should both get a log of your long term fuel trims during a pull.

Here is one I did today. The pulls weren't all the way through red line but covered the problem area.

http://db.tt/F4U3KETY

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[xjohnx]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

e85 or pump? 12:1 is too rich for pump if you want to make good power.. e85 will probably target high 11's to very low 12's.

He's on pump.

[vtmike]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

e85 or pump? 12:1 is too rich for pump if you want to make good power.. e85 will probably target high 11's to very low 12's.

Pump on stock tune. Judging by the other dynos it would appear I'm not going to get above 12.1 on the stock tune to know if I fixed the problem.

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[Lonewolf]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

13:1 post catalytics is not super rich. Even if it were 12:1 pre cat that is still not super rich. NA best power is going to be between 12.8 and 13.2 but it should not be black smoke rich at 12:1.. more like 10:1.

I never said that it was...civicdrvr mentioned he had excess black soot accumulating on his exhaust tip, that coupled with him looking to be down on power can be an indication of a rich fuel mixture....

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by vtmike

Pump on stock tune. Judging by the other dynos it would appear I'm not going to get above 12.1 on the stock tune to know if I fixed the problem.

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Ahh, yeah, that makes more sense now. I'm waiting on openoffice to dl so i can peak at the log... just reloaded my laptop.

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

I never said that it was...civicdrvr mentioned he had excess black soot accumulating on his exhaust tip, that coupled with him looking to be down on power can be an indication of a rich fuel mixture....

Ohh, For sure man. Sorry i was more addressing then smoke issue in general after looking at his plot and seeing the afr rather than your feedback to him.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

It is a wide range sesnor. It reads from 12.1 up to around 18 or 19. Not as much swing on the rich side as a typical wideband, but wide enough range for NA tuning.

More familiar with the turbo world where an aftermarket wideband is necessary for tuning. Still probably not a bad idea. Thanks for the knowledge.

[uspspro]

O2 sensor datalogs still read pump gas AFRs on E85, unless configured by the user somehow. Since the actual measurement is lambda, unless told otherwise, the software will multiply that by the stoich AFR for pump gas.

[swift996]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

More familiar with the turbo world where an aftermarket wideband is necessary for tuning. Still probably not a bad idea. Thanks for the knowledge.

It seems like the OEM unit doesn't read below 12.16, I looked through a few of my logs and didn't see anything below but the wideband sensor used on the dyno shows me plunging below.

For example here is my logs from a pull:


vs:

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by uspspro

O2 sensor datalogs still read pump gas AFRs on E85, unless configured by the user somehow. Since the actual measurement is lambda, unless told otherwise, the software will multiply that by the stoich AFR for pump gas.

That is true, but since stoich is still 1.0 lambda E85 will still show 14.7:1 for stoich (on gasoline calibration scale) and a rich best torque of 11.5 (gasoline scale) and lean best torque (gasoline scale) around 12:1.

If you know the fuels lambda values and what scale you are calibrated for you can figure out what to target since all wide band sensors read in lambda.

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by swift996

It seems like the OEM unit doesn't read below 12.16, I looked through a few of my logs and didn't see anything below but the wideband sensor used on the dyno shows me plunging below.

For example here is my logs from a pull:


vs:

Correct, see that attached from the engine controls manual. 12.16 is as low as it reads. It's not a true wideband but it is a wide range sensor. No need to be richer than 12.5 NA though.

[mad_sb]

[quote=vtmike;913109]

Originally Posted by mad_sb

Here is one I did today. The pulls weren't all the way through red line but covered the problem area.

http://db.tt/F4U3KETY

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So, i assume Accelerator PedalPosition D(%) reads about 54 when at WOT?

Your long term trims through the dip area are showing +10% so your wot AFR there is 10% richer than the fuel map calls for. They tapper off some as the rev's climb and you move into higher maf output areas.

I hate long term trims on these cars, they are applied in open loop and will crush your tuned afr, or in this case the desired factory afr.