The OTHER Stranoparts STX FR-S - build thread

[Sam Strano]

I've been trying to keep the bushing inserts in stock, so give me a yell. Note we didn't adjust Andrew's his car ended up square. Mine is not, but I haven't gotten under it to mess with it. Loosen the 4 bolts and see if you can shift it. Really that's it.

[apexaddict]

As Sam had teased above, yesterday was the first event for the car in STX form. I had decided to go to a "pre-season" event with Ohio Valley Region yesterday, which was actually intended to be a test-and-tune for the now-defunct Wilmington Match Tour. Considering it's Ohio, we really lucked out with the weather (50+ and sunny most of the day) and got a really good idea of how the car is handling.

To put it bluntly: it's really, really good.



The day was split into two sessions: morning (4 runs) and afternoon (3 runs). Seeing as the temps were still pretty cold for our morning runs (maybe high 40s), we were mostly using this time to just get a feel for the car. And let me tell you, it was pretty much spot-on from run 1. So spot-on, in fact, that we didn't even bother changing the shocks from their street settings. The only changes we made all day were to the tire pressures, which we will still be experimenting with at the next events.

Anyway, at the conclusion of the morning runs, I was leading Sam by about two tenths... he was sitting on a 44.2xx, and I had a 44.0xx. It wasn't too bad of a raw time going by our competition, which at this event was mainly a well-prepped STU STI on BFG Rivals driven by long-time veteran Mike Eckert. His car is also new to him, but it has all the right stuff on it and the course was certainly in favor of an STU car (pretty gravelly surface in colder temps). Still, my goal was to try to out-raw him. We didn't quite get there in the morning, and he put down a 43.8xx. I still had a PAX margin of a little under a second despite the raw-time difference, though - so far, so good.

Once we were done with the morning session, we took a break for lunch, then went back to running again. We made a 1lb difference in the front tire pressures, which made for a reasonably noticeable increase in front grip. It paid off, as after the next three runs, I was sitting on a 43.7xx and Sam a 43.8xx. Our STU competition had put down a 43.4xx. It was a good day.

My thoughts on the car: I think the setup is there, and it's really not very complex. I'm very happy with the balance, I can get the car to "slither" as much as I want it to (especially by throttle), and that's certainly how I want it to handle. Sam described it as driving a lot like his Grand Sport, just with less power. Considering how successful Sam has shown to be in Corvettes in the past, I think that's as good of a compliment as any. HUGE and MASSIVE thanks and props to Sam for his hard work on the setup - I simply don't think it can be better from a handling perspective, aside from making changes for surface.

Below are our individual videos from our fastest runs. When Sam and I were going over the video after the event, he pointed out the uncanny resemblance in our driving styles. There's SO many similarities, it's downright creepy - how we hold the wheel, where we turn in, even where on the course we adjust our seating position. This is particularly interesting because Sam has never taught me "how to drive" in it's literal sense - I just happened to develop my style on my own, and what worked the best for me is the same as what works for Sam (and consequently, what he teaches to his Evo School students).

Anyway, without further ado:

Me:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1w7B8eTW-7U"]OVR 3/30/13 - STX FR-S - Andrew - YouTube[/ame]

Sam:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNK1HpcOpOI"]OVR 3/30/13 - STX FR-S - Sam - YouTube[/ame]

I'll be running the car again next weekend to do some more testing and tuning to get it ready for the NJ Pro. Should have the EcuTek installed by then as well.

[Aznsky]

Nice! We were talking about your guys' runs this weekend. STX should be really exciting this year.

Will you be at the OVR test and tune next weekend? I"ll be there helping a friend with his RX-8. I'll try to stop by and say hi and check out the car, maybe I can get a ride?

[apexaddict]

Originally Posted by Aznsky

Nice! We were talking about your guys' runs this weekend. STX should be really exciting this year.

Will you be at the OVR test and tune next weekend? I"ll be there helping a friend with his RX-8. I'll try to stop by and say hi and check out the car, maybe I can get a ride?

Sure, I'll be there, just find the red #14.

A couple more notes from Saturday that I forgot to mention:

Regarding the "pedal dance" - I didn't try this, and I really don't think that I need to. Neither Sam nor myself felt like there was anything in the TCS system that was holding the car back, and we both drive with a decent amount of slip angle. People had mentioned in the other threads that they had complaints about the slip light going off and feeling the TCS kick in even when it's supposed to be off-off (holding the button down), but I have never felt this when I've autocrossed the car in any trim. It may very well be speed-dependent, as the majority of those complaints seem to come from track guys. Terminal speed at any autocross usually isn't more than 60-65mph, which on a road course is a relatively low-speed corner.

We also had data going on a MaxQ, which was fairly spotty due to technical issues with the PDA, but we at least got our best runs in. I found it particularly interesting that grip peaked at just around 1.2g, which is not that far off of what Sam's Grand Sport made at Dixie on A6s. Of course, the average G on the GS is much, much higher than the FRS' average (and that's arguably the more important metric) but it was an interesting data point nonetheless.

[xwd]

The pedal dance thing was mainly to defeat the electronic brake distribution when trail braking deep into track corners. Simmons I know tried it in his car and it made his car go into ice mode pretty much constantly. I don't think it's really any benefit to autocross. I didn't really have any issues even in the wet on A6s a couple weeks ago and the car was all over the place.

[Simmons]

Originally Posted by dwx

The pedal dance thing was mainly to defeat the electronic brake distribution when trail braking deep into track corners. Simmons I know tried it in his car and it made his car go into ice mode pretty much constantly. I don't think it's really any benefit to autocross. I didn't really have any issues even in the wet on A6s a couple weeks ago and the car was all over the place.

Actually, my car would get Ice mode with or without the dance. I do notice the little car light come on during AutoX when I use a inside camera, but not sure how much it is hurting the run?

Simmons

[apexaddict]

Originally Posted by Simmons

Actually, my car would get Ice mode with or without the dance. I do notice the little car light come on during AutoX when I use a inside camera, but not sure how much it is hurting the run?

Simmons

I've seen the light, too, but it seems inconsistent. During the winter, I had gotten the car luridly sideways in the snow and not seen it come on, but I've also had the car just step out slightly at an auto-x and it goes off. I don't feel anything kicking in either way, though.

I've read that it's possible there is an "electronic LSD" type of aid that is engaging the brakes when the light goes off - again, I haven't felt this ever happen. I wonder if the programming for this was embedded in the ECU somewhere, but it never actually activates? I have no idea. I'm not too worried about it.

[Sam Strano]

I have to say something here, and it's gonna be pretty blunt too, but I think it needs said.

There are lots of places that sell parts. I get it, many of us even sell the same parts (except my bar of course). The difference here is that none of those places have my experience or proven track record setting up cars do to this, and do it well. I've been seeing this pedal dance stuff a lot, and frankly ignored it. For this reason: The car did nothing any different than what's expect. Ice mode is something ALL cars with ABS can have happen. And it's a common complaint for many, but yet it's never an issue for me. I don't go insane with brake pads (which can cause issues), and I don't dive bomb corners (which can cause ice mode issues).

Remember I have one of these cars, I bought it for the expressed purpose of learning about it and how to set it up. What I learned I can't tell everyone, there have already been at least 3 or 4 folks who I trusted with various bits of information I figured out who then didn't get their stuff here (two cases being matters of who was going to give stuff to them for the best deal). I'm here to make a living, and the way I see it, what I have to offer is worth something. It's setup information, and I can't just give it away. Please note I'm not asking for anything extra for that information, just your business... and my pricing is very fair too.

I work in reality, not what if's. I know some think this pedal dance thing is magic. Ok. I look at what the car does, how it acts vs. what I want. Like Andrew, we see no intervention. Nothing happens that isn't 100% in line with the input given, even in a car with NO stability controls. We also both drive our cars daily, and all winter long (in PA and OH). I can guarantee you we slide them around constantly in the snow too.

[Dezoris]

I just talked with Sam today and ordered the front bar.
I have a few month project going, and while it involves autox and some track, my main concern is not creating a garage queen, been there done that.

One of the reasons I will be choosing Strano here is because, there is something far more critical only experience teaches you, driver is everything.

I believe Sam and Andrew are doing something that's more grassroots but more cost effective and just blatantly honest.

At the end of the day, whether you spend a couple hundred or thousands on a car like this, the results are usually just a pile of 2 dollar Chinese made trophies. There is no glory to be had in hobbyist competition, just self satisfaction.

I hope more people can turn to this thread and threads like it and use the same approach. I certainly will be doing my part in the coming months with some exhaustive videos about all of this.

[Dezoris]

Reviewing the autox videos, I looked at Andrew's and Sam's runs.
I notice at the 50 Second mark, Sam came out of slalom and before the left hander, he flicked the car right before entry, were you able to unsettle the car to pick up better turn here or was it a waste?

Andrew did not do this in his video but looked like he was a bit more unsettled going into that segment.

[apexaddict]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

Reviewing the autox videos, I looked at Andrew's and Sam's runs.
I notice at the 50 Second mark, Sam came out of slalom and before the left hander, he flicked the car right before entry, were you able to unsettle the car to pick up better turn here or was it a waste?

Andrew did not do this in his video but looked like he was a bit more unsettled going into that segment.

I think Sam was a bit more ahead of the car than I was in the slalom, and was able to set up the car better for that tight left. On previous runs I was overshooting the entry, and ending up WAY off the inside apex cone. So I cut my losses there and just tried to get on that cone. Going by the data, Sam was a couple MPH faster through that corner.

And thanks for the comments on the build - I think you get what we're trying to do here. Like I said at the start of the thread, I don't think we need to go nuts with throwing parts and money at the car to make it competitive, but there is a lot of value in taking parts that ordinary people can afford and making them work. And this is all being done with stuff that you can get from Sam - you can call him right now and get the exact same parts and setup. There's nothing special being done to this car that won't be available to Sam's customers in some way.

[apexaddict]

Time to blow the dust off of this and provide a few updates.

NJ Pro: This was an important event because it would be the first major one that the car would see with some real STX competition. And it went even better than I could have imagined, even with a lot of odds against me. I was showing up with a relatively under-prepped car, on RS3s from 2011, and I'm not great at the ProSolo format in general. That being said, I had a great battle with Jeff Hurst in all three sessions, and led every session until I managed to throw down two hero runs in the Sunday heat and scrape by with the win by .075. This was the first STX win for any twin at a major Tour or Pro.

Sat morning:


Sat afternoon:


Sun morning (final):


The handling of the car was fantastic, and we guessed right on the NJ setup straight away. It did anything I wanted it to, and went anywhere I pointed it. The balance remains to be very similar to a smaller, slower Corvette - turn-in is really crisp and direct, then exiting the corner is simply a matter of steering through it with the throttle. Which I like. Sam and I have eerily similar driving styles and preferences, and usually what works for him also works for me.

I also learned that the complaints about Hankooks not working in the cold is somewhat of a myth. Yeah, the first run (or couple of runs at a Pro) is kind of a throwaway, but after that, they start to come in and then only get marginally better with more heat. I was convinced I wasn't going to go much faster (if at all) on Sunday morning, but to my own surprise, I was able to.

Shelly Monfort also codrove the car in L3 (which got bumped to L2) and ended up taking the win there as well. Shelly is going to continue driving the car at Pros throughout the season and continuing to pester L2 and L3. She took to the car really well, and definitely had room left to improve after an "oopsie" moment of not turning the traction control off on Sunday morning.

Best runs from NJ:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFypc85CrgA"]2013 NJ ProSolo - STX FRS - Andrew Best Runs - YouTube[/ame]

Following this event, I knew that Phase 1 (that is, getting the handling and tune sorted) was a success. But after putting the car on the scales and coming out at 2670 - a full 70lbs heavier than Simmons' car - I decided that weight savings would have to be the next step. Thankfully, this was easy and inexpensive - a used Nameless muffler delete, a 1.5lb Shorai lithium-iron battery, and a Perrin pulley have served to save about 60lbs for less than $300 without any real effect on drivability.



I also decided to grab some new RS3s in preparation for Spring Nationals at the end of the month. I wanted to try the Rivals, but the damned 245/40/17s got pushed back *again* to the middle of June.



That being said, I am going to be doing some tire testing with the Z2s at Spring Nats. I'm not sure what to expect yet, but Sam strongly believes that they are good tires, and he has yet to steer me wrong. Personally, I don't think any of the new tires can beat the RS3 in the dry. Match maybe, but not beat. Of course, this is just based on the dozens of relatively inconclusive tire tests I've seen, but we will see what happens when I get my hands on the Z2s.

[GTB/ZR-1]

GREAT job--Well done & CONGRATS!

[Sccabrz192]

Great Job Andrew, that was certainly a very talented STX class out in NJ.