Vortech Supercharging System Update - More boost, more POWER!

[Darryljr11]

Originally Posted by 2forme

The AFR isn't necessarily related to the kit so much as the tune.

Gem dynoed the new compressor design. 239whp @ 8.5 psi.

The tune comes with the kit right? When i say kit that include the tune.

[Darryljr11]

This thread has gotten too intense and non-informative lol. I think i will just contact vortech myself.

[2forme]

Originally Posted by staycrushing

i am a businessman, its people like this that are counterproductive to product development. when someone has a lot of posts on a forum people usually think... "oh my god he is one of the top guys here." when someone like that posts up negative remarks or calls out a big company that is trying to reach out directly and on a more personal level to consumers to promote their kit it just backfires because some guy wants to get off from e-thugging.

no one wins in this situation, the company receives a negative view from this idiots comments, the guy looks like a tool and then the person that says something back to the guy "me"... is "that guy" that decided to respond.

i am pretty mad not gonna lie... this guy has absolutely no idea how much r/d that vortech has put into this kit alone... it is also their transition into the import scene in full force and they have a group of diehard enthusiasts that work there really pushing for this. it is an honor to be a part of their marketing plan and absolutely love my kit, cant wait for the 9psi set up!!!

but when people come in and say stupid crap like it is a "defective" product... it really rustles my jimmies.

oh no... it didnt hit the 300hp on 91 pump gas... they tuned it a certain way so that it can pass cali emmisions and become CARB approved... what other FI kit out on the market can do that....? exactly... NONE.

they will have a 9psi VORTECH tune... visconti hit the advertised claim with their old kit, perrin is tearing shit up too with theirs and i believe are hovering around 13-14psi now with a wastegated kit...

hmmmmmm.

Well, on the other side of the fence, you have also have people (and perhaps other vendors) who were ... exaggerating ... the kit's capabilities. I don't remember Vortech themselves making any claims. But certain people started a really BIG hype machine well before hand (bashing other vendor kits of entirely different technologies, posting false dyno comparisons, etc).

As a business, you don't want that kind of attention, either.

Now, was the product defective? Not really. It made power, just not as much as the hype machine generated. I have all the respect in the world for Vortech for doing something about it and actually offering "free" upgrades to those who bought the original kit. That's an awesome move. My only issue was where they sent the "weaker" kit to a customer just a week before releasing the "stronger" kit. But like what was said, various departments don't necessarily talk to each other about things going on. I've personally never worked a company that didn't communicate things like that, but apparently it exists.

[2forme]

Originally Posted by Darryljr11

The tune comes with the kit right? When i say kit that include the tune.

If you get the tuner kit (cheapest option), it doesn't come with a tune. It's JUST the hardware. You will be responsible for getting the ECUTek license and tune from one of the vendors here.

That said, Visconti seems to have gotten the most out of this kit from the dyno's I've seen. He also sells the kit with a tune package.

[djdnz]

Originally Posted by Darryljr11

The tune comes with the kit right? When i say kit that include the tune.

http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/page.php?id=30190

The full kit comes with ECUTEK and a Vortech tune, which will be 9psi and CARB approved. That one is MSRP: $5687.95

The tuner kit comes without ECUTEK and without a tune. MSRP for that is: $4298.95

You can buy it through other tuners, who include their own tune and ECUTEK which is a bit less conservative than the Votech tune, but is not CARB approved. Those vendors include, but not limited to Perrin and Visconti.

Street prices are usually a bit lower than MSRP

[Darryljr11]

Originally Posted by 2forme

If you get the tuner kit (cheapest option), it doesn't come with a tune. It's JUST the hardware. You will be responsible for getting the ECUTek license and tune from one of the vendors here.

That said, Visconti seems to have gotten the most out of this kit from the dyno's I've seen. He also sells the kit with a tune package.

Im getting the full kit not the tuner kit

[Darryljr11]

Originally Posted by djdnz

http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/page.php?id=30190

The full kit comes with ECUTEK and a Vortech tune, which will be 9psi and CARB approved. That one is MSRP: $5687.95

The tuner kit comes without ECUTEK and without a tune. MSRP for that is: $4298.95

You can buy it through other tuners, who include their own tune and ECUTEK which is a bit less conservative than the Votech tune, but is not CARB approved. Those vendors include, but not limited to Perrin and Visconti.

Street prices are usually a bit lower than MSRP

Im getting the full kit. Maryland is a CARB emissisions state apparently and i want a "set it and forget it" approach since the car is my daily driver. Do you have a link to any recent dynos of the kit?

[civicdrivr]

Originally Posted by djdnz

You can buy it through other tuners, who include their own tune and ECUTEK which is a bit less conservative than the Votech tune, but is not CARB approved. Those vendors include, but not limited to Perrin and Visconti.

Wait a second, if I were to buy this kit from another vendor, I won't get the CARB sticker?

Sent from my Nexus 4

[djdnz]

Originally Posted by civicdrivr

Wait a second, if I were to buy this kit from another vendor, I won't get the CARB sticker?

Sent from my Nexus 4

Not exactly, if you buy the vendors special version of the kit you won't get the CARB sticker. IE you buy from vendor X, who sells a version with a smaller pulley and a custom tune.

But if you go to a vendor and purchase exactly what Vortech is selling (their FULL vortech tuned kit, not tuned by someone else) - then it will be CARB certified.

Presumably... if you're sneaky... you can buy the vortech kit, get the CARB approval, and then down the road I suppose but don't endorse, possibly get Perrin or Visconti's tune/smaller pulley and no one would really be the wiser. But that's just hearsay and you didn't hear that from me.

Originally Posted by Darryljr11

Im getting the full kit. Maryland is a CARB emissisions state apparently and i want a "set it and forget it" approach since the car is my daily driver. Do you have a link to any recent dynos of the kit?

There is no recent dyno with the latest hardware, you will have to wait until April 1st according to their website. Expect something that looks like the older graphs, but makes it to 250whp and more torque.

[catharsis]

Originally Posted by 2forme

Well, on the other side of the fence, you have also have people (and perhaps other vendors) who were ... exaggerating ... the kit's capabilities. I don't remember Vortech themselves making any claims. But certain people started a really BIG hype machine well before hand (bashing other vendor kits of entirely different technologies, posting false dyno comparisons, etc).

As a business, you don't want that kind of attention, either.

Now, was the product defective? Not really. It made power, just not as much as the hype machine generated. I have all the respect in the world for Vortech for doing something about it and actually offering "free" upgrades to those who bought the original kit. That's an awesome move. My only issue was where they sent the "weaker" kit to a customer just a week before releasing the "stronger" kit. But like what was said, various departments don't necessarily talk to each other about things going on. I've personally never worked a company that didn't communicate things like that, but apparently it exists.

I normally just lurk, but this is pathetic. You're complaining about 10whp. 240 vs 250. Do you really think you're gonna notice the difference when you get on the throttle? Also the "weaker" kits are getting upgraded for free to all customers. Whats the problem? Clearly its in the early stages and it needed some refinement. A little rushed yes, but not defective and not broken and it happens all the time in the aftermarket world.


signed,

an adult

[2forme]

Originally Posted by catharsis

I normally just lurk, but this is pathetic. You're complaining about 10whp. 240 vs 250. Do you really think you're gonna notice the difference when you get on the throttle? Also the "weaker" kits are getting upgraded for free to all customers. Whats the problem? Clearly its in the early stages and it needed some refinement. A little rushed yes, but not defective and not broken and it happens all the time in the aftermarket world.


signed,

an adult

That's what I said? Not sure if you're calling me pathetic or just saying that it's pathetic in general. Reason I ask, is because you go on to say the exact same thing I did...

240 is on the newer blower. The 4 people who dynoed the older blower got 225ish. Most had exhausts, too.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by staycrushing

after doing a quick glance at your posts it seems all you do is hang out on the forced induction forum of this site and comment and/or post against various kits including this one.

are you planning on actually buying one of these kits or are you just here for shits and giggles?

The only kit I've said anything against was this one. I've asked questions of about the AVO kit that could have come off as veiled criticisms, but certainly weren't and I'm pretty sure the people I was asking understood that. If they didn't, my apologies as I have nothing but respect for the AVO kit and most of the other turbo kits I've seen. The only thing I've said against this kit is that it looked like the compressor was running way outside of it's efficiency island. Given that they are upgrading the compressor, it stands to reason I was right.

Now does that make it defective, maybe, maybe not. I've stated my case twice now because people feel the need to dredge is back up. I'm not gonna bother again.

As for why I'm posting in this thread, I'm here because I'm very interested in the system. This is the same reason I've been here all along. But it didn't take long before I started to realize something was fishy. So I started to prod to find out if I was right or wrong and if so why. The more I asked, the more things became hush hush. I highly doubt I made any difference in Vortech's decision to upgrade the compressor, but I appreciate you insinuation that I may have. Right now, I'm awaiting a few results to make a more informed decision but yes I have every intention of buying something. I'm still not sure which one though.

Now about Vortech's push into the import market... They already sell kits for the 350z & G35, as well as many Honda's. They used the same V3sci for all of those kits and I think it would have been a great match for this car. It would have left a ton a headroom available and wouldn't have required any new designs/parts. I understand that they probably put a metric fuck ton of r&d into this which is why I'm asking questions. I really wish they would tell us why they came to the conclusion that they needed a different compressor.

[Huehuecoyotl]

No one should be calling anyone or any system pathetic.

This kit may suck,

this kit may be one of the best options out there, if peak HP isnt your only goal
Its clear as day to me, and likely perrin and Visconti that the OLD kit made 240whp at 8.5psi The NEW kit also makes 240whp, at 8.5 psi go figure, why am I not that surprised? its not like the 8.5psi of one kit has that much more drag than the other.LOL


So,What is the fuss about? some guys may have pulled 225whp out of the old kit, other may have pulled more, just talk to Visconti...what is this "vortech needs to make right " BS?

I dont want to get involved in any controversy, but want to point out, this is the only kit in SC land that has been at all proven- thats shipping and folks are getting the kit, not as a ongoing design. Its done.

I mean what are you really gonna buy a SC off a smallish shop with the hope that its better? that youre gonna get the same deep pocket warranty as a bigger shop? I dont see anyone rocking any other brand of SC, so I dont get the issues that some people with Vortech and how they are here to offer us a great kit. Its okay we have all heard you there is no added bonus in the reiteration I see going on here...especially when its guys who dont own the kit and havent spent a cent keep raising a fuss. its like -really? So you have an opinion. Thats very nice.

Those guys who want the extra power of a turbo, have at it. I cant wait to see you all at the track. I want to see who runs hot and who doesnt too. I think it is one thing to do a few pulls on a dyno, but another to do 4 track sessions in triple digit heat.
Lets see how I do at the track in the weeks ahead, its getting hot in PHX so it should be a good gauge.

A 10 hp difference is easily attributable to HP, tuner, tires, temp, fuel etc. Its sad folks are so busy attacking a kit that just came out whose potential has yet to be explored or tested. Untill you all see dynos and drivability, its unclear what systems work and what dont on the track, which is where the men and boys get separated really efficiently.


as for the "the 4 people who dyno'd the old blower" statement, this is not adding any light to their variables, car, weather, gas, tuner etc. Tune matters, same hardware, I have way different feeling car when running perrin vs vortech tunes-same exact hardware setup- only difference is software; since its all test for me i cant make any comments for better or worse as what i run is not production tune.

Both stg1 and stg2 vortech kits will make 240whp with the right tune and variable set
Perrin has shown the upper limit of the stg2 kit to be 300whp
My goal is short of that by some, so lets see...

[civicdrivr]

Originally Posted by djdnz

Not exactly, if you buy the vendors special version of the kit you won't get the CARB sticker. IE you buy from vendor X, who sells a version with a smaller pulley and a custom tune.

But if you go to a vendor and purchase exactly what Vortech is selling (their FULL vortech tuned kit, not tuned by someone else) - then it will be CARB certified.

Presumably... if you're sneaky... you can buy the vortech kit, get the CARB approval, and then down the road I suppose but don't endorse, possibly get Perrin or Visconti's tune/smaller pulley and no one would really be the wiser. But that's just hearsay and you didn't hear that from me.

Ive pm'd Brian for clarification on this. I hope to hear back soon.

Sent from my Nexus 4