Susupension Thread

[skeeler]

Andrew,

I work in Laurel, so I'm very excited to hear that a shop so near to me and with experience like yours is interested in developing parts for this car.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by verlumpt

I will be putting ASTs on my FR-S. I've been using their products in both autocross, road course, and on my personal RallyCross car with great success. Heck I"ve been considering putting on of their motorcycle shocks on my SV650n

A great middle road setup that for me has been proven to be super reliable and to perform really well.

I've never used AST. They make the 5300 for my ITR but for 6k I'd probably go with Mugen or Spoon N1s (Showa Dampers/Swift springs)... I'd love to drive a set though just to see how they are

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

I've never used AST. They make the 5300 for my ITR but for 6k I'd probably go with Mugen or Spoon N1s (Showa Dampers/Swift springs)... I'd love to drive a set though just to see how they are

i used to think that revalved bilsteins were the way to go. i would never have bilstien do the revalving but places like stewart development or fac cat motorsports really know what they are doing. when i got my first ride in a miata with some ast suspension my mind was blown. i could almost make a blind guarantee that they are better than the mugen spoon products but that would be stupid of me. i think the moral of the story is just go with what you know is winning races. ohlins seems to make car products with limited travel but an otherwise amazing product. i dont know how bilsteins just last forever. once you get into that penske, vorshlag, koni race level im sure its just a matter of personal favorites

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by fatoni

i used to think that revalved bilsteins were the way to go. i would never have bilstien do the revalving but places like stewart development or fac cat motorsports really know what they are doing. when i got my first ride in a miata with some ast suspension my mind was blown. i could almost make a blind guarantee that they are better than the mugen spoon products but that would be stupid of me. i think the moral of the story is just go with what you know is winning races. ohlins seems to make car products with limited travel but an otherwise amazing product. i dont know how bilsteins just last forever. once you get into that penske, vorshlag, koni race level im sure its just a matter of personal favorites

Yeah that's the thing, I've driven Showa's high end stuff and it's amazing. I'd love to test the ASTs but a 6k gamble is a bit much vs a 5k sure bet.

In the end I'd probably really just run Penskes and custom springs

[NESW20]

Originally Posted by verlumpt

I will be putting ASTs on my FR-S. I've been using their products in both autocross, road course, and on my personal RallyCross car with great success. Heck I"ve been considering putting on of their motorcycle shocks on my SV650n

A great middle road setup that for me has been proven to be super reliable and to perform really well.

let me know when and i'll head back to NE for an autocross with you and that other freakishly fast guy.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Yeah that's the thing, I've driven Showa's high end stuff and it's amazing. I'd love to test the ASTs but a 6k gamble is a bit much vs a 5k sure bet.

In the end I'd probably really just run Penskes and custom springs

i cant blame you when it comes to our hard earned dollars.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

Do you guys do any custom valving or anything like that? Examples of what you've done?

I've love to see a dyno of the stock dampers and have someone determine the spring rates. I'd gladly send a set in to you for testing but I likely won't be one of the first to buy the car (I have zero intention of paying MSRP, let alone above that..).

If you want some hard-core suspension info, I picked up Racetech's Motorcycle Suspension Bible a while ago.

http://www.amazon.ca/Race-Techs-Moto.../dp/0760331405

Freakin' epic. Geometry is irrelevant to us, but the shock info is astounding. Valving, shim stacks, collapsing needle valves, high/low speed, coatings, etc... Plus they have practical rebuilding section that could apply to some more advanced automotive race shocks.

I'm also looking into spring frequency as a target (derived from spring rate, installed rate, sprung/unsprung weight, tire flex...) and managing weight transfer now too.

With the low CoG and the talk of 'driver managed' F/R distribution, I get the impression that this may be softly sprung (but adequately damped, I'll assume), with roll managed partly by the low CoG and bars, leaving more room for front/back transfer by driver input?

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Dimman

If you want some hard-core suspension info, I picked up Racetech's Motorcycle Suspension Bible a while ago.

http://www.amazon.ca/Race-Techs-Moto.../dp/0760331405

Freakin' epic. Geometry is irrelevant to us, but the shock info is astounding. Valving, shim stacks, collapsing needle valves, high/low speed, coatings, etc... Plus they have practical rebuilding section that could apply to some more advanced automotive race shocks.

I'm also looking into spring frequency as a target (derived from spring rate, installed rate, sprung/unsprung weight, tire flex...) and managing weight transfer now too.

With the low CoG and the talk of 'driver managed' F/R distribution, I get the impression that this may be softly sprung (but adequately damped, I'll assume), with roll managed partly by the low CoG and bars, leaving more room for front/back transfer by driver input?

i hope the cog is low enough to offset any issues with the cars roll center. its totally an unfounded concern but i get the idea that this kinda gimmicky and is going to cater to what car people want and not what makes a great drivers car. also i hope some one is nerdy enough to make a nice suspension calculator like shaikh did for miatas

[Ryephile]

Originally Posted by fatoni

... its totally an unfounded concern but...

Indeed. There's no need to put the cart before the horse.

If people get serious with this car and put their calipers where their keyboards are, there'll be data available to say with confidence the chassis needs X, Y, and/or Z to improve its handling for your application.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Indeed. There's no need to put the cart before the horse.

If people get serious with this car and put their calipers where their keyboards are, there'll be data available to say with confidence the chassis needs X, Y, and/or Z to improve its handling for your application.

i know i konw but i just have this fear that the technology has surpassed the sport. looking at things like the evo, ms3 and gtr i just get the feeling that cars no longer have to obey the laws of physics. we dont live in a world where screaming itrbs and light weight can go head to head with computer controlled traction and turbos. i just wonder what they are gonna do to keep this exciting to people. i have a feeling that everybody who wants a light weight sports car already has one. lotus is redesigning the whole company because this didnt work. the car is already too big for me. i think my next one will be a used elise

[CSOCSO]

soooo... other subaru model's coilovers, springs, shock wont fit under the frs/brz?
or its too soon?

[WhiteGDB]

Same suspension layout, but totally different chassis so I doubt parts will be interchangeable with other Suby models.

[Kiwi]

Even if it is interchangeable, I think the major difference in the chassis means it won't be anywhere near optimal.

[Gardus@Supersprint]

I hope to be the lucky bastard to get one of the first cars and go to KW in Germany to supply the development car.
A customer of ours with a BMW 1M did the same thing... KW3 clubsport for free...