FR-S vs S2000

[blur]

Originally Posted by fatoni

making compromises in the name of fun is exactly what a sports car is and these arent race cars. i dont know how you can say this car that you havent sat in is going to have any advantage of one of the most visceral modern cars. i hope the frs is going to be a great car but i just dont see it being better than the honda in any capacity other than passenger capacity

They ARE supposed to be race cars. The S2000 "Club Racer" and the FRS-R(race?) are designed to be competitive stock class cars in HPDE and AutoX. And you are right I can't judge the FRS before driving it, but we're all speculating here about how it would compare. :happy0180:

Also, the nurburgring race proved that the FR-S is competitive with the S2000, even if it is down on power. So not all of it is speculation.

[Mr.Jay]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

You guys are missing my point. I never said a convertible defines a sports car. I just agreed with Fatoni's point that a hardtop doesn't make a sports car and that F1 cars don't have a top just like a s2k.

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I love how you brought logics in. In F1 the cars are more like roadsters too.

you missed the point we never said a roadster defines a sports car we think its questionable that someone would compare a roadster to a F1 saying they have more in common or hell even compare a production car to a F1 car is kind of illogical


The CR is a factory released race ready car and will no doubt be more car than the FRS is however the only downside I see is the FRS will have cheaper mods in comparison to the S2k and their hefty price tags for mods.

[chopstickz]

I guess you can't really call them sports cars... I would call them affordable semi-sports cars though.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by blur

They ARE supposed to be race cars. The S2000 "Club Racer" and the FRS-R(race?) are designed to be competitive stock class cars in HPDE and AutoX. And you are right I can't judge the FRS before driving it, but we're all speculating here about how it would compare. :happy0180:

Also, the nurburgring race proved that the FR-S is competitive with the S2000, even if it is down on power. So not all of it is speculation.

modified i guess but i think it really boils down to what we each consider race cars. in my opinion a race car is something that isnt daily driven and isnt street legal. saying a car is a race car because of an in its name is just wrong. i think we can both agree that the matrix xrs isnt a race car. either way i just dont think this car is going to have as hard an edge as the honda. i guess well wait and see

[leechungsr]

Originally Posted by blur

Also, the nurburgring race proved that the FR-S is competitive with the S2000, even if it is down on power. So not all of it is speculation.

Keep in mind the CR ran 2 seconds faster on Tsukuba (with no additional power from the standard S2000). Not sure how it would translate into the Nurburgring, but you can assume the CR would be significantly faster than the standard AP1.

Driving both cars high speed stability is much improved over the standard AP1, not to mention again the ridiculous grip. The aero bits really work, you can feel a huge difference over the standard car.

[ap5512]

Originally Posted by vang

Both comparisons made were daft.

Just because a car has a fixed roof, that doesn't mean it is more track oriented. Those unfamiliar with the chassis design of the S2000 should do a little searching. The X-bone frame of the S2000 was well-designed and provided the roadster with more torsional rigidity than most hardtop sports cars. Also, S2000 does not = F1 racecar because it is a convertible. Just think, the convertible Chrysler Sebring and convertible Toyota Solara are even less sporty than a Toyota Sienna SE (aka swagger wagon).

The S2000 is an amazing sports car with fun and responsive as top priority. The FT86 is suppose to have the same goals in mind, which is why I'm interested. If there were to ever be a turbocharged FT86 model, I think I'd switch over without a doubt.

Completely agree with you on this one Vang. Honda has often said the the S2000 was F1 inspired (although, I'm not sure which components or design besides the high revs). I used to own a 06 S2k. I loved every moment I drove that car. I have never sat in anything else that handles so well and was built so well. The feeling of driving a S is completely different but that could be due to the fact that it's a striped down car with inefficient cupholders, vtec, no backseat, twitchy, and snappy. It's definitely a solid car. But like you said if the Toyabaru cars have the same goals in mind, I think it will be a great car like the S2K.

Yes, the FRS/BRZ is definitely more practical but I personally think it will come close to the S2000 handling which is why I am interested in maybe purchasing one (after a test drive that is..). If I can get a close experience to that of a S2K...then Im definitely buying one. If it's the opposite, then I may just buy another S2K or save enough money for a Cayman S.

Guess we'll find out when it soon.....cheers :happy0180:

[Luvzgod]

I also have a 2003 s2k. I am also considering the frs/ft86/brz. After reading everything I could find on the frs, it seems the size, the handling, and the reliability factor will be about the same. Granted the frs has a back seat but if you check the specs on height, width,and length they are extremely close. My big problem and concern as it seems to be with almost every person is the lack of power. Everyone says put a turbo on it or a supercharger. I have gone that route before. It should bother everyone that a car touted as a sports car can be possibly outrun by a 2011 Toyota rav4 limited with the v6. Why does Toyota and Subaru think that it is okay for a light weight sporty coupe to get outran to 60 or to the quarter mile by some suv, truck, or station wagon in their own lineup? I would think that a car company labeling a vehicle as a sports car would at least want it to be faster than their own Toyota Tundra V8.

[Luvzgod]

I know it's not always about hp; it's important to have a great handling car; but come on a car with 200 hp. I have had wonderful 200hp cars. I loved my Toyota MR2 Turbo; but it was a 1991 model. I loved my Honda Civic Si; but it was a 2000 model. The frs/ft86/brz will be coming out in 2012. Where is the progress? If we spend our 25000 to 30000 dollars on this car when it comes out we are going to be doing good to not get passed by a redneck in his jacked up pickup. The car looks beautiful, it may handle as beautifully as my s2000; but if it's too slow to compete with anything other than miatas, 200 hp vws, and the occasional civic Si, that will be sad. I guess I was just hoping for better.

Sorry for being so long-winded but I have spent way too much time pondering and getting excited about this car. I still hope Toyota surprises us with around 240-260hp and not the reported 200hp.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Luvzgod

I know it's not always about hp; it's important to have a great handling car; but come on a car with 200 hp. I have had wonderful 200hp cars. I loved my Toyota MR2 Turbo; but it was a 1991 model. I loved my Honda Civic Si; but it was a 2000 model. The frs/ft86/brz will be coming out in 2012. Where is the progress? If we spend our 25000 to 30000 dollars on this car when it comes out we are going to be doing good to not get passed by a redneck in his jacked up pickup. The car looks beautiful, it may handle as beautifully as my s2000; but if it's too slow to compete with anything other than miatas, 200 hp vws, and the occasional civic Si, that will be sad. I guess I was just hoping for better.

Sorry for being so long-winded but I have spent way too much time pondering and getting excited about this car. I still hope Toyota surprises us with around 240-260hp and not the reported 200hp.

just buy a mustang

[Buggy51]

Originally Posted by Luvzgod

I know it's not always about hp; it's important to have a great handling car; but come on a car with 200 hp. I have had wonderful 200hp cars. I loved my Toyota MR2 Turbo; but it was a 1991 model. I loved my Honda Civic Si; but it was a 2000 model. The frs/ft86/brz will be coming out in 2012. Where is the progress? If we spend our 25000 to 30000 dollars on this car when it comes out we are going to be doing good to not get passed by a redneck in his jacked up pickup. The car looks beautiful, it may handle as beautifully as my s2000; but if it's too slow to compete with anything other than miatas, 200 hp vws, and the occasional civic Si, that will be sad. I guess I was just hoping for better.

Sorry for being so long-winded but I have spent way too much time pondering and getting excited about this car. I still hope Toyota surprises us with around 240-260hp and not the reported 200hp.

That's why I doubt it'll be over 23k (and even that's a high note)

[Luvzgod]

Originally Posted by fatoni

just buy a mustang

That could and would be taken as an insult by some people but I appreciate all cars for what they are; and right now Ford is making one of the best Mustangs they have made in many years. Their new v6 w/305 hp is a drastic improvement over previous generations. However many here along with myself have greatly enjoyed the import scene; therefore, I guess I, along with many others, will just have to wait and see. The FRS/FT86/BRZ is much better looking than the mustang. But this would digress from the forum heading and for now I will continue to enjoy my S2000.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Luvzgod

That could and would be taken as an insult by some people but I appreciate all cars for what they are; and right now Ford is making one of the best Mustangs they have made in many years. Their new v6 w/305 hp is a drastic improvement over previous generations. However many here along with myself have greatly enjoyed the import scene; therefore, I guess I, along with many others, will just have to wait and see. The FRS/FT86/BRZ is much better looking than the mustang. But this would digress from the forum heading and for now I will continue to enjoy my S2000.

i didnt mean that as an insult. the current mustang is a good car that i expect to both out power and out grip the frs.

[nrclptcnsmniak]

I think the objective of Subaru/Toyota is exactly what they said. "pure driving pleasure". I really dont think this car is trying to out compete anybody performance wise. They said it themselves we werent worried about numbers. We wanted a car that was lightweight and fun to drive. As for OP with your dillemma. Test drive the FR-s or BRZ when it comes out then make your decision. If it were me... I would take the BRZ only because im a subaru fan. But I also would not be surprised if the BRZ puts close performance numbers to the s2k which was way more expensive than the expected price of the BRZ. Talk about bang for your buck! ^_^

[nrclptcnsmniak]

Originally Posted by Luvzgod

I know it's not always about hp; it's important to have a great handling car; but come on a car with 200 hp. I have had wonderful 200hp cars. I loved my Toyota MR2 Turbo; but it was a 1991 model. I loved my Honda Civic Si; but it was a 2000 model. The frs/ft86/brz will be coming out in 2012. Where is the progress? If we spend our 25000 to 30000 dollars on this car when it comes out we are going to be doing good to not get passed by a redneck in his jacked up pickup. The car looks beautiful, it may handle as beautifully as my s2000; but if it's too slow to compete with anything other than miatas, 200 hp vws, and the occasional civic Si, that will be sad. I guess I was just hoping for better.

Sorry for being so long-winded but I have spent way too much time pondering and getting excited about this car. I still hope Toyota surprises us with around 240-260hp and not the reported 200hp.

Right but I dont think subaru/toyotas main concern was straight line speed. If you dont want to get passed up by a redneck in a truck or a 200hp vw then buy another car? I am sure this car is going to hold its own though. I guess it just depends on what you want from a vehicle. I could care less about being passed up on the freeway. I never go passed 80 mph anyways ^_^.. but i have hopes of more hp too down the road.