my brz vs my evo x

[shyong]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

I was looking for data points as far as what the speeds actually are, but thanks for trying.

Not exactly the information you're looking for.

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/scion_fr-s.html

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/mitsubis...gsr_evo_x.html

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by shyong

Not exactly the information you're looking for.

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/scion_fr-s.html

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/mitsubis...gsr_evo_x.html

Beats the Evo around Streets of Willow...

Not quite what I'm looking for, but good effort and thank you regardless.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

Beats the Evo around Streets of Willow...

Not quite what I'm looking for, but good effort and thank you regardless.

Yeah. The X SE closes the gap, but it's still a hair behind the FR-S's time. Maybe later after work I'll check on Motor Trend/Road & Track/Car & Driver track tests for both cars where they at least happened on the same track. Usually their stuff is pretty detailed with speeds clocked at certain locations, so maybe that might help answer some questions.

[shyong]

You may have to experience it for yourself unless someone's done a side by side comparison on a specific track which I cannot find on the net. However, I'd like to see the data at Laguna on both cars.

[orthojoe]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

I was looking for data points as far as what the speeds actually are, but thanks for trying.

Well, I've got an AiM Solo DL datalogger, and telemetry from Thunderhill, Sears Point, and Laguna Seca when I had my Evo. Once I take the BRZ to the track, I can overlay the graphs using racestudio2. I can tell you right now it won't be pretty, though. The BRZ is not a performance car. Lots of people here on this forum don't seem to realize that. The BRZ/FRS outputs slow lap times.

Originally Posted by shyong

Not exactly the information you're looking for.

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/scion_fr-s.html

http://fastestlaps.com/cars/mitsubis...gsr_evo_x.html

The problem with this website is that you are comparing lap times from different drivers of different skill levels. Not a real comparison. There's no way an FRS/BRZ is faster than an Evo X at any track, given a good competent driver.

Originally Posted by shyong

You may have to experience it for yourself unless someone's done a side by side comparison on a specific track which I cannot find on the net. However, I'd like to see the data at Laguna on both cars.

I'll have that for you after March 2nd.

[shyong]

Originally Posted by orthojoe

The problem with this website is that you are comparing lap times from different drivers of different skill levels. Not a real comparison. There's no way an FRS/BRZ is faster than an Evo X at any track, given a good competent driver.



I'll have that for you after March 2nd.

Yes, you're absolutely correct about the very broad variables for the track times listed for both cars.

Definitely post your results when you get a chance to run the brz.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Originally Posted by shyong

Yes, you're absolutely correct about the very broad variables for the track times listed for both cars.

Definitely post your results when you get a chance to run the brz.

While that's true, we have to be fair and can't necessarily dismiss the numbers. It's damn near impossible to have had the two cars you want to compare to have been tested at the same track on the same day under the same conditions. And even then, there could still be variances within the same tests if one of the cars is underperforming, like how the first batch of 2008 Evo Xs had issues with their stock tunes that really hurt its acceleration (hence the 5+ second 0-60 times and the high-13/low-14 second quarter-mile times with trap speeds below 100 in the first several reviews) or how the IS-F had a less-than-stellar lap time at Car & Driver's comparison test at VIR one year and a significantly better time at a later year (though it had slight suspension updates, but they didn't seem like things that would make that big of an impact).

But speaking of the BRZ, it actually had a faster lap time (1:30.32) than the FR-S did (1:31.15) on the same day.

[orthojoe]

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

While that's true, we have to be fair and can't necessarily dismiss the numbers.

Yes we can. Those lap times posted are a mish mash of pro times reported in magazines and amateurs who could be absolutely horrible drivers.

This is why I got annoyed when robispec posted a picture of their car 'keeping up' with a C6 ZR1. In a properly driven car, that should NEVER happen. Pobst runs 1:51 at LS with a BRZ, and 1:33 with a ZR1. The ZR1 driver that robispec was following was a HORRIBLE driver, considering robispec was running 1:48 that day.

Now we have people on the forums thinking, yeah, a modified FRS will hang with a ZR1. No. You're delusional if you think that's the case.

Do you guys honestly think that an FRS/BRZ will outlap an Evo? The torque/power/AWD system will win at any track. Lap times are NOT what our cars are about.

The last time I took my Evo to Laguna Seca, it was only my second time there and I was running street tires (I stopped bringing the car there because it wouldn't pass 92dB sound limit). I ran 1:49. Pobst runs 1:51 in a BRZ. I'm no Pobst. I'm just an amateur. I outran Pobst with an Evo. That should tell you something.

Sorry guys, but the FRS/BRZ is not about lap times. That's not why I bought the car.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Only I'm allowed to call my slow car slow!

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

I was looking for data points as far as what the speeds actually are, but thanks for trying.

Originally Posted by orthojoe

I can tell you right now it won't be pretty, though. The BRZ is not a performance car. Lots of people here on this forum don't seem to realize that. The BRZ/FRS outputs slow lap times.

Orthojoe is right, it won't be close in most corners. The Evo X also has a big tire advantage, stock v. stock. Here is sector data at VIR from CD's lightning lap. Sectors don't correlate with corners, but if you look at VIR's layout and see what they define as sectors, you should be able to tell what's going on:

Sector 1: Peak grip / Exit Speed
Evo X SE: 0.96 g / 68.2 mph
BRZ: 0.89 g / 63.2 mph

Sector 2: Entry/Exit Speeds
Evo X SE: 113.7 / 102.0
BRZ: 105.2 / 104.6

Sector 3: Entry/Exit Speeds
Evo X SE: 82.8 / 67.1
BRZ: 81.0 / 62.2

Sector 4: Entry/Exit Speeds
Evo X SE: 68.3 / 81.4
BRZ: 66.4 / 80.1

Sector 5: Entry/Exit Speeds
Evo X SE: 74.4 / 92.3
BRZ: 78.6 / 87.0

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...r-times-page-8

You can see the BRZ's tire disadvantage by comparing peak lateral grip in sector 1, which is basically a large hairpin turn. Would be interesting to see the data on equal tires.

[EvoXDD]

This was my thread. I created it to let people know how I, an avid autox'r with plenty of first place region trophies and also with plenty of people better than me in the state and a seasoned (not expert or even great, maybe 6/10 with that being a civilian not pro scale)road course driver with lots of logged track hours, like and compare MY TWO cars.

Sorry for the run on sentance.

I have a 391hp/392tq heavily modded but stock turbo far from stock suspension tuned by me Evo x, and now an approx 190/175 (guessing using dynojet as my guesstimater in my head) 2013 limited brz with a hand full of mods power and suspension.

And it has become a pissing ground for several people to argue and degrade the point and enjoyment I was getting out of what started out my thread. I have never seen a thread that has gone/been this bad on this wonderful forum that has a plethora of nice people with good knowledge.

I have read it is in the "super car", using that term very loosely personally, category but truthfully I DON'T CARE, nor do I care what you have all been arguing about. I have been rather silent about it to this point but after reading the email I get every day from this thread today I am sick of it. If I wanted a true "super car" trust me i could and would go out and buy one. But I have a passion, a love, a niche for modding, tuning, racing, experimenting with my own custom ideas and I do very well with it all. If I bought a "super car" it would sit in the garage always waxed and sealed and dusted and would only come out on sunny days and I wouldn't let my wife or son in it for the chance the may scuff the door getting out. That would be absolutely a waste of money, and garage space to ME.

With all that said, and this thread ruined, could a moderator please delete the entire thing, or delete all the pitty crap and lock it cause I no longer get enjoyment out of it, and no one is learning anything or helping to lean one way or the other to buying either car.

Thanks in advance moderator.

[n2oinferno]

Originally Posted by EvoXDD

This was my thread. I created it to let people know how I, an avid autox'r with plenty of first place region trophies and also with plenty of people better than me in the state and a seasoned (not expert or even great, maybe 6/10 with that being a civilian not pro scale)road course driver with lots of logged track hours, like and compare MY TWO cars.

If that's your attitude you should've requested it be locked after your first post. Instead you put it up for public discussion by putting it out there. There is no "my thread" on an open forum. It's everyone's thread, you're just the topic creator and the spark of the discussion.

Speaking as one from experience, if you want it to go away it's best to report a post in the thread and request with explanation there. The mods do the best they can, but they're not omnipresent.

[King Tut]

Originally Posted by EvoXDD

handling: the BRZ goes where i tell it, when i tell it....until i turn off traction control then it is just hella fun but not being used to rear wheel drive it is closing in on uncontrollable. Can't imagine trying to autox this thing, although i am sure it is a LOT of fun to do so.
The evo does not break loose no matter what. i take turns doing 100mph and it just rolls right through them with a nice throttle out.

power: the evo i can have at the speed limit by mid 2nd gear at the latest, where the brz seems it needs almost 4th to get to the speed limit. there is some through you back in your seat moments with it, but if i go WOT in the evo and put a $100 bill on the dash, you would still leave the car broke lol.

looks: the BRZ seems to be more "VIP" status and really looks sleek and sexy where the evo just looks mean and raw. I get a lot more girls (even though i am married so could care less) looking at the BRZ than i do the evo. The evo i get so much sausage giving me thumbs up and people trying to race me in there civics, all the way to their corvettes and such.

Nothing like the sound of a spooling turbo and flames coming out the back of a car when you are stomping on some domestic "muscle" car though!

I don't think this thread should be deleted. We would lose vital information like the above. Cliff notes:

1. The BRZ is uncontrollable.
2. The Evo never breaks loose even in 100 mph corners.
3. The BRZ is so slow it takes till 4th gear to get to 55 mph where the Evo can do it by the middle of 2nd.
4. The Evo has $100 on the dash speed.
5. The BRZ is a VIP like Lexuses and Infinitis.
6. The BRZ gets more chicks than the Evo.
7. The Evo gets raced by sausages in Civics and Corvettes
8. The Evo stomps domestic "muscle" car.
9. The Evo is a super car.

[orthojoe]

Originally Posted by EvoXDD

This was my thread. I created it to let people know how I, an avid autox'r with plenty of first place region trophies and also with plenty of people better than me in the state and a seasoned (not expert or even great, maybe 6/10 with that being a civilian not pro scale)road course driver with lots of logged track hours, like and compare MY TWO cars.


what started out my thread. I have never seen a thread that has gone/been this bad on this wonderful forum that has a plethora of nice people with good knowledge.

That would be absolutely a waste of money, and garage space to ME.

........Congrats, you're and avid cone dodger. You can make another thread to talk about yourself.... or you can get over yourself....