BMW talk

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by RaceR

Yeah so would I. But that just shows how small minority us car enthusiasts really are. And that the typical car buyer actually don't know much. Which is why ALL car manufacturers focus more on trying to reach a wider audience.

And this is really why I think that if manufacturers want to sell niche cars, they need to seriously start thinking about pouring more money into aesthetics.

The FRS/BRZ was a disappointment in this regard, at least for me it was. It looks snazzy and gets attention because nothing else on the road looks quite like it, but let's face it, the rear end is incredibly ugly. The side profile looks okay but the front bumper isn't that great. The headlights and hood are the only truly attractive bits imo. Compare with the concept, which was extremely sexy and unique.

Ultimately most people have no clue what is under the hood, nor remotely any clue on how it all functions. They just see the outside of the car, and if a higher price tag is being asked, something on the outside of the car better show it.

I don't mean wings and all, there are a million functional duct ideas that can be implemented to make a car look less drab (and increase performance marginally). A simple thing like wrapping the C pillars inward a little more or having flying buttresses looks really cool and improves aero. Don't force the enthusiast into using some gaudy body kit, make the car sleeker from the factory. This obviously costs quite a bit of money, but I think people are willing to buy impractical cars if they are really that cool, and a souped up SUV or van is never going to be cool. X5M, Cayenne Turbo, are you joking me?

Of course there is also sound. Remove a baffle somewhere, and it'll be civilized but a little more growly.

Forgive my rant, my opinions are sometimes completely irrational.

[RaceR]

Rants are fine.
I actually think the twins look really good! But the concepts looked better. Most concepts do.

Cant understand the design of the headlamps on the new 1-series tough. (F20/F21 hatcback sold in EU) Most find them quite ugly. It does not look that bad with the m-package. But its not a beauty either.

The cool thing about the BMW "i" cars seem to be that they actually will look quite a lot like the concepts. A bit modern and fresh. Suits the cars.

Originally Posted by serialk11r

And this is really why I think that if manufacturers want to sell niche cars, they need to seriously start thinking about pouring more money into aesthetics.

WARNING OFF-TOPIC STUFF:
You might cringe by this car. But you familiar with the Opel/Vauxhall Adam? Not sure it if will be sold in the US. Dont think its on sale yet even in the EU.
But that is probably the new "niche" small car. Extreme customization in terms of look and style and individuality.



[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wMJBmnRf0o"]!NEW! Opel ADAM in Paris - Fresh, individual and chic (HD) - YouTube[/ame]


Many fancy og good pictures here. Press "neste" for "next picture".

Check out this webpage. Buying a car is cool. You get cool hip and relaxing music. And you can make the car suit every individual or style..
http://www.vauxhall.co.uk/microsite/...ery.html#/home
One part of me so wants to make fun if it. Another wants to buy a car.. :p (dont judge me)

I actually think its a bit cool. And the concept is very good.
But say the style series in a gay voice (no offence to gay people). Adam JAM, Adam GLAM, Adam SLAM..

It might be the new niche market.... Trendy and thousands of customization possibilities.

I actually wish the GT86 had some decent options like that. Rims, tires, interior stuff, aesthetics, lots of performance stuff. Would be nice to have OEM equipment of your choice fitted on the car from the factory at a reasonable price.
I think it would fit Scion to try out such a thing. Toyota could become less boring, and also make their cars appeal more to a younger audience than retired people. :p

[serialk11r]

Yes, I like the BMW i cars very much. They have some very bold features, rather than the usual rectangular slab. If just one winglet or scoop makes it to production I will cheer.

One area I wonder why manufacturers don't try to put a little more effort into is the rear glass/C pillar area. Now I know flying buttress pillars cost money to develop, but what about simple things like rear glass that wraps around? I hate how most cars have just a more or less rectangular piece of glass sitting in the rear window. For FR sports cars, how about torque tube + transaxle/ cooling in the back? How much more money is that? I just feel like nothing interesting happens in the lower end of the market anymore. The FRS is considered really neat because it has RWD, but there's nothing really interesting about the formula imo.

Maybe I'm just too much of a nerd who sees value in things that don't actually bring much to the table in terms of performance.

[RaceR]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

The FRS is considered really neat because it has RWD, but there's nothing really interesting about the formula imo.

Nowdays RWD sport cars are more of a dying breed it seems. Especially one that is well built overall and with LSD. It also have good throttle response, which is rare! Low cog. Its relatively light. It does not have all that "safe understeer" that most cars have. Low grip tires. And all at a reasonable price (in most countries) with good looks. That whole package makes it interesting.
LSD - only enthusiasts wants and needs that
NA- not right in these times. Turbo is more efficient (I would have preferred turbo due to Co2 taxes.)
Tires - More usually equals better
RWD- Buliding a FWD on an already existing platform would be cheaper

Just buliding RWD car is more rare, and Toyota/Subaru did so much more right. (if it was not for BMW there would not be sold many new RWD cars in EU)

The thing with RWD cars are that from a production point of view they are inferior in terms of cost, practicality, weight and drivetrain loss compared to a FWD with combustion engine. RWD (driver) cars are more of a niche market. Because they are mostly just made to be sport cars or to have a better driving experience than their FWD "rivals".

A good thing I see with EV technology is that it might change drivetrain layout back to towards RWD. It may become more mainstream in the future again. RWD seem to be better in EV cars in terms of cost and practicality (I think) And it does not seem like weight and drivetrain loss are a disadvantage in a RWD EV. Its probably easier and more desirable to produce EV cars with RWD too.
Im I the only one having those thoughts? Just look at the i3. "Easy to make" with RWD. A car of that size would not have been possible to make RWD and with a decent weight distribution if it had a heavy combustion engine in the front. Electric drivetrain made that possible.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNDNmFeJTUw"]BMW I3 Concept, how it's built, with a body on frame - YouTube[/ame]


The Koreans might become a bit of a game changer in the future tough. Kia/Hyundai are really in attack mode. Kia might actually become a BMW rival if they opt for RWD sporty cars. Which is a possibility.

[RaceR]

Blog: Inside a carbon-fibre factory

We get a look around BMW’s new project ‘i’ carbon-fibre plant in Washington

BMW is about to need a lot of carbon-fibre. Both the i3 - which goes on sale in the middle of next year - and the i8, which follows a year later, have entire body cells made from the stuff – and it’s not a cheap material to make, either.

We all know the benefits – it’s up to 50 per cent lighter and stronger than steel and aluminium, it absorbs energy brilliantly in an accident (any Formula One driver who’s had a high-speed smash can verify this one) and doesn’t corrode and fatigue like metal. But high costs and lengthy manufacturing times have limited its use to hi-end cars like McLarens and Lamborghinis.

BMW is planning to change all that, though, by manufacturing carbon-fibre-reinforced plastic components from scratch, and en masse, in a series of dedicated plants dotted around the world. We had the opportunity to visit a brand-new $100m factory – a joint venture with carbon-experts SGL – in Moses Lake, Washington, where spools of carbon-fibres are produced before being shipped back to Germany and turned into parts.

“Once both production lines are in place, we’ll make around 3,000 tonnes of carbon fibres a year - around 8 per cent of the world’s total production - and there’s space for four more lines on the existing site and an option to buy 60 acres more,” Dr Joerg Pohlman, managing director of the BMW-SGL partnership, told us.

A crucial competitive advantage for BMW is the intelligent positioning of the Moses Lake plant. Located nearby on the Columbia River are two enormous hydroelectric dams, which supply 100 per cent of the factory’s substantial energy requirements at just three cents a kwh – a quarter of the normal price. “This cheap, sustainable energy is the difference between being it making financial sense and not,” Pohlman admitted.

Inside the factory itself, the production line has more in common with the textile industry than cars. It begins in the creel area where boxes of 40km long 100-strand strips of precursor (a by-product of crude oil imported from Japan) are fed onto rollers and ‘combed’ into neat 50-strand strips. From here they are fed through a series of six increasingly hot ovens, which first oxidise and then carbonise the glossy strands, turning them from white to jet-black.

The material is then shocked in a high-voltage bath to rough up the edges and coated in a light resin before being rolled onto 9kg spools. These are then shipped to another factory in Wackersdorf, Germany, to be knitted and shaped into the 30 parts that, once glued together, make the i3’s passenger cell.

“Our goal is to match the cost of aluminium,” Pohlman revealed. “We’re not there yet, but compared to the carbon currently used in the roof of the M3, the new material we’ll use in the ‘i’ cars is a third of the price to produce.”

Looks like the future for carbon-fibre is getting brighter and brighter..

[White Shadow]

Originally Posted by RaceR

Cant understand the design of the headlamps on the new 1-series tough. (F20/F21 hatcback sold in EU) Most find them quite ugly. It does not look that bad with the m-package. But its not a beauty either.

Yeah, the headlights look horrible, but then again, the same thing was true of the 1-series coupe too. I remember the first time I saw a 1M coupe up close and I immediately thought to myself that they shouldn't have made the headlights so big. It would have looked so much better if the headlights were more squashed instead of all that extra room on the top & bottom. Overall, the 1-series is an ugly little car, but at least it has that "bulldog" look to it. Or maybe I should say a bulldog with frog eyes. LOL

[Wes B.]

Originally Posted by RaceR

^

Can hope for M2 CSL.. Would probably be the closest thing.

I just hope they can replicate the spirit of the original CSL.

[RaceR]

Originally Posted by White Shadow

Yeah, the headlights look horrible, but then again, the same thing was true of the 1-series coupe too.

Not the best angle.. I think it looks quite good. That is the E87. The old 1-series.

The new 1-series (F20/F21) have not been released in the US.


With m-package. Does not look too bad in the 3-door version. But does not look that good when looking at it from the front.

But these 1-series(/2-series) sedan renders looks very good in my opinion!

[RaceR]

Originally Posted by Wes B.

I just hope they can replicate the spirit of the original CSL.

In a modern car.. Dont think that will be possible... sadly..
The spirit will be in the old car. We can hope a newer car would stay true to some of the heritage.

[RaceR]

1M Coupe looks great here!

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEvpnKRLDO4"]BMW 1M - Walls - MPowered Performance Part 1 - YouTube[/ame]

[White Shadow]

Originally Posted by RaceR

Not the best angle.. I think it looks quite good. That is the E87. The old 1-series.

Yes, I realize that. LOL My point was that the 1-series headlights were ugly before too, which is why I posted a close-up of that 1M headlight. The first time I saw a pic of the new headlights was this one, and I thought it looked even worse:




Anyway, the cock-eyed look reminds me a lot of the last 6-series headlights, which I've never liked.

[Texas BRZ]

Originally Posted by RaceR

1M Coupe looks great here!

For a long time, I was really regretting missing out on the boat for ordering a 1M when it was first released... But then I was taken as a passenger in it with an Instructor last month...

... I'll have to admit that the car didn't feel as sporty as I'd thought it would be. It felt more like higher-performance 1 series, compared to a sports car with more feel to it. I wasn't driving it, so maybe I can't speak with accuracy.

Love the way the car looks though...

[White Shadow]

Originally Posted by RaceR

1M Coupe looks great here!

Yeah, I remember laughing at that video a while back when it was posted on another forum. So fake that it's comical.

[White Shadow]

Here's how they should have done the headlights: