supercharger or turbo?

[KurtP]

Originally Posted by Coheed

Although I do agree with this for the most part, I have to disagree with the remarks to power production.

I've seen several 2.0L engines making over 400whp with a supercharger. And a lot of them don't push over 14psi.

A Supercharger can make over 350whp. But it takes the supporting mods to do so.

I would love to see a mustang dyno showing a 4cyl with over 400whp not using e85. ill be surprised to see one. If there is, my guess is its a honda k20 with huge cams revving to 9k or more with at least a semi built motor.

E85 is a great fuel but i dismiss it entirely because its an extremely inconsistant and not available within an hour of me.

I think 350 is do able with the vortech blower at 15 psi, 93+meth, 8500revs and a set of cams. But a centrifugal supercharger will always have less tq than a turbo.....

[Jesse@JDLAutodesign]

I've never been a fan superchargers on small displacement motors. With that said i'm also not a fan of large turbo's for street cars and road race cars. I wanted to do something different for our turbo kit. I love twin scroll turbo's, the driveabilty is awesome and the throttle response is almost instantaneous with some of the newer technology smaller turbos. Alittle preview..billet wheel, dual bb, twinscroll goodness

[2forme]

Originally Posted by Jesse@JDLAutodesign

I've never been a fan superchargers on small displacement motors. With that said i'm also not a fan of large turbo's for street cars and road race cars. I wanted to do something different for our turbo kit. I love twin scroll turbo's, the driveabilty is awesome and the throttle response is almost instantaneous with some of the newer technology smaller turbos. Alittle preview..billet wheel, dual bb, twinscroll goodness

If you can provide the same fit/finish, ease of install, and relative price point of the AVO... you may have a winner.

[Jesse@JDLAutodesign]

Originally Posted by 2forme

If you can provide the same fit/finish, ease of install, and relative price point of the AVO... you may have a winner.

It will be more expensive. The turbo is quite a bit different and not cheap. With that said it should still be comparable or less than the other options out. As for fit/finish i think it will speak for itself I should be able to post up alot more info in 2-3 weeks.

[FreshFRS]

Originally Posted by KurtP

I would love to see a mustang dyno showing a 4cyl with over 400whp not using e85. ill be surprised to see one. If there is, my guess is its a honda k20 with huge cams revving to 9k or more with at least a semi built motor.

E85 is a great fuel but i dismiss it entirely because its an extremely inconsistant and not available within an hour of me.

I think 350 is do able with the vortech blower at 15 psi, 93+meth, 8500revs and a set of cams. But a centrifugal supercharger will always have less tq than a turbo.....

I've seen it. '03 s2k with a rotrex c38-91 a2w intercooler, Toda 305 Vtec killers, 445whp at 8400 315tq 9000rpm forget what pulley he was using but the thing was beast. hytech header and 3" catback. also my old s2k ran chevron 94 only gt35r on stock compression, 2.2L though 580whp at 7800rpm 385tq both on mustang dyno's. i've seen k20s hit 400whp+ as well. EJ20's as well.

[KurtP]

Originally Posted by Jesse@JDLAutodesign

I've never been a fan superchargers on small displacement motors. With that said i'm also not a fan of large turbo's for street cars and road race cars. I wanted to do something different for our turbo kit. I love twin scroll turbo's, the driveabilty is awesome and the throttle response is almost instantaneous with some of the newer technology smaller turbos. Alittle preview..billet wheel, dual bb, twinscroll goodness

Nice. Looks like a precision billet compressor hooked up to a EVO 10cm TS hotside. No shortage of options for good performance across a wide range of preferences using the EVO based units, and their TS housings are well proven to generate boost quickly and hold top end.

What's your plan for running the EL TS manifold pipes? Up the front like P&L?

There will be plenty of the cheap garbage ebay style turbo kits out there for this car as the race to be "first" runs rampant. If you are going to make a TS/DBB turbo set up do it right. Short exhaust manifold piping and schedule 10 stainless and a welder who isnt looking for part time work after getting fired for being unable to weld storm drains.I would hope the subaru community has seen enough cracked turbo manifolds over the last 12 years to know its pretty much a requirement. Hopefully someone decides to race for being "best". I dont want a $3800 turbo kit. I want a $6000 turbo kit that's done right.

[KurtP]

Originally Posted by FreshFRS

I've seen it. '03 s2k with a rotrex c38-91 a2w intercooler, Toda 305 Vtec killers, 445whp at 8400 315tq 9000rpm forget what pulley he was using but the thing was beast. hytech header and 3" catback. also my old s2k ran chevron 94 only gt35r on stock compression, 2.2L though 580whp at 7800rpm 385tq both on mustang dyno's. i've seen k20s hit 400whp+ as well. EJ20's as well.

I've seen plenty of turbo's go over that mark, ive never seen a blower do it. 400 is cake for a turbo 4. I suppose the rotrex -91 with 305 cams could do it. heck its the blower TTS Superchargers use on v8's and, iirc, the largest one Rotrex makes.

Id still be interested in seeing the S/C'd set up and know how much boost he ran.

[FreshFRS]

Originally Posted by KurtP

I've seen plenty of turbo's go over that mark, ive never seen a blower do it. 400 is cake for a turbo 4. I suppose the rotrex -91 with 305 cams could do it. heck its the blower TTS Superchargers use on v8's and, iirc, the largest one Rotrex makes.

Id still be interested in seeing the S/C'd set up and know how much boost he ran.

i'm trying to find the dyno sheet he gave me but i think it's on my old computer that doesnt run anymore i would think he was over 20psi, and yeah c38-91 is huge for a 2L but it works well.

[KurtP]

Not going to get me to hate If there is a way to bolt a Rotrex -91 to this thing at push 20psi that would be a pretty sweet ride! Ill do some google-fu for it later.

[FreshFRS]

Originally Posted by KurtP

Not going to get me to hate If there is a way to bolt a Rotrex -91 to this thing at push 20psi that would be a pretty sweet ride! Ill do some google-fu for it later.

too high of compression in our cars, however i think someone was looking at relocating the alternator and putting rotrex in that spot, a c30-91 i think.

here is a 500whp on 17psi C38-81 [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-ybnqqC0Ak"]TTS S2000 500 whp Rotrex Race dyno run. - YouTube[/ame]

[Jesse@JDLAutodesign]

Originally Posted by KurtP

Nice. Looks like a precision billet compressor hooked up to a EVO 10cm TS hotside. No shortage of options for good performance across a wide range of preferences using the EVO based units, and their TS housings are well proven to generate boost quickly and hold top end.

What's your plan for running the EL TS manifold pipes? Up the front like P&L?

There will be plenty of the cheap garbage ebay style turbo kits out there for this car as the race to be "first" runs rampant. If you are going to make a TS/DBB turbo set up do it right. Short exhaust manifold piping and schedule 10 stainless and a welder who isnt looking for part time work after getting fired for being unable to weld storm drains.I would hope the subaru community has seen enough cracked turbo manifolds over the last 12 years to know its pretty much a requirement. Hopefully someone decides to race for being "best". I dont want a $3800 turbo kit. I want a $6000 turbo kit that's done right.

The turbo is up front...placement is different than the P&L and the Full Blown kits however. The manifold is 1.25" sch 40. We've done enough of these things over the past 7-8 years to have a good understanding of what it takes to keep them together in all environments (my car will see lots of track time in the hottest region of the country)

It won't be a $6000 kit (will still be <$5000) but won't include a tune. I think anyone turbocharging this car should be on a dyno with a tuner in their region.

[KurtP]

i think you are doing it right. not sure if there is enough room to do a low mount up front, but that would be pure win....

Cant wait to see it.

[Captain Insano]

Twin scroll goodness....

[JoeBoxer]

Sounds like an excellent start, how about starting a new thread so updates for the JDL kit can be all in one place?