FR-S not the FT-86?

[ToyotaObsession]

Originally Posted by Type[R]+

just seems he totally messed up the article.

The more I read it, the more I think it is either suggesting a redesign due in 2015, or Toyota releasing FT86 in USA in 2015. If he's just suggesting Toyota releasing the FT86 in 2015 (globally?) he's WAY off the mark lol!

At the moment it's FT86, but yes, nothing is suggesting FT86 as a final name either. FR-S would be cool! I know here in Australia, Toyota has trademarked just '86'. The Celica name is still being thrown around here too.

I think he just some words on a screen and people are believing it.

Why in the world would Toyota release the Car as a Scion, then 3 years later release the same damn car as Toyota without doing anything?

I don't know why people are so resistant to the idea that Toyota has a long term plan and that plan includes,

Scion = Young and sporty (tC, FT86, Someday perhaps Supra)
Toyota = Trucks and practical, maybe some sporty models (Camry SE, Sienna, Tacoma, SUV's, etc.)
Lexus = Sporty and Luxurious (Do I need to even give the examples?)

That isn't going to change. You will not see a Toyota Sports car in the states, perhaps ever. Any new sports cars will either be Scion or Lexus. Period, end of story, that's it. Toyota has spent years planning and implementing this.



They aren't naming it Celica anywhere either. Can we put that stupidity to rest also?

[TheMachine]

Originally Posted by Random_Art

That's my understanding. I imagine there's some variation from location to location based on local taxes and tag fees. But, you're supposed to be able to walk on to any lot and find the same car for the same price at any dealer. I haven't personally bought a new Scion, so all my info comes second hand. You'd probably have to talk to someone who has bought their Scion new to really find out.

Here's the page from the Scion website:
http://www.scion.com/#/pure-price-barcode

Let me clarify the bolded section. Pure Pricing means that the advertised price is the price you pay. So if dealer 1 advertises the FR-S at MSRP, they must sell it at MSRP, if dealer 2 advertises it at MSRP -$500, they must sell it at MSRP -$500. It can be priced differently from dealer to dealer, but it must be advertised at a price and must be sold at that price.

[WingsofWar]

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

I think he just some words on a screen and people are believing it.

Why in the world would Toyota release the Car as a Scion, then 3 years later release the same damn car as Toyota without doing anything?

I don't know why people are so resistant to the idea that Toyota has a long term plan and that plan includes,

Scion = Young and sporty (tC, FT86, Someday perhaps Supra)
Toyota = Trucks and practical, maybe some sporty models (Camry SE, Sienna, Tacoma, SUV's, etc.)
Lexus = Sporty and Luxurious (Do I need to even give the examples?)

That isn't going to change. You will not see a Toyota Sports car in the states, perhaps ever. Any new sports cars will either be Scion or Lexus. Period, end of story, that's it. Toyota has spent years planning and implementing this.



They aren't naming it Celica anywhere either. Can we put that stupidity to rest also?

I totally agree with this, Toyota has a 10 year plan obviously with this car. In the states it will stay as a Scion.

The ONLY way i can see for Toyota to release the FT86 as a Toyota states side several years after the Scion FR-S release, is because Scion dissolved and is no longer a company that brings out cars. This scenario could happen because of the situation the company is in, but the chances are still very slim for the company to completely dissolved and assimilated back into Toyota in 5 years. Scion has all the resources available to them, they just need better project planners and execution of their advertisements.

I strongly hope a future Celica upgrades as a badge and moves away from Toyota on to Lexus. I can see Celica and Soarer engineering in a close-knit giving them a stronger definition in the company.

[Random_Art]

Originally Posted by TheMachine

Let me clarify the bolded section. Pure Pricing means that the advertised price is the price you pay. So if dealer 1 advertises the FR-S at MSRP, they must sell it at MSRP, if dealer 2 advertises it at MSRP -$500, they must sell it at MSRP -$500. It can be priced differently from dealer to dealer, but it must be advertised at a price and must be sold at that price.

ah

[82mm 4g63]

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

I think he just some words on a screen and people are believing it.

Why in the world would Toyota release the Car as a Scion, then 3 years later release the same damn car as Toyota without doing anything?

I don't know why people are so resistant to the idea that Toyota has a long term plan and that plan includes,

Scion = Young and sporty (tC, FT86, Someday perhaps Supra)
Toyota = Trucks and practical, maybe some sporty models (Camry SE, Sienna, Tacoma, SUV's, etc.)
Lexus = Sporty and Luxurious (Do I need to even give the examples?)

That isn't going to change. You will not see a Toyota Sports car in the states, perhaps ever. Any new sports cars will either be Scion or Lexus. Period, end of story, that's it. Toyota has spent years planning and implementing this.



They aren't naming it Celica anywhere either. Can we put that stupidity to rest also?

I agree with you completely even with the bold'ed part. Even though it makes me want to close my eyes, cover my ears and yell LALALA CANT HEAR YOU, I still agree with this being Toyota's plan.

However superficial this is, one of the main things about the GTR that I LOVE is that it's still a Nissan, not an Infinity. As cool as the LFA is, as much as I see Supra styling ques from it, and as much as I get the impracticality of selling a $400k Toyota... a Lexus supercar does nothing to interest me.

Just as the Scion brand bores me, the Lexus brand puts me off because of what you know to expect with it. Luxury over practicality, Luxury over performance, Luxury over affordability, and that's fine because Lexus is their flagship Luxo brand. The LFA and ISF are the exceptions to the decades old rule of Lexus.

Toyota is my high school sweetheart and first love. I'll never not be a Toyota fan, but I really hope they don't break the demographics up into brand names. The only thing separating the three brands should be creature comforts and available options, not types of vehicles. There should be economical, practical, sporty, and utility vehicles available to all three brands.

[82mm 4g63]

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

I strongly hope a future Celica upgrades as a badge and moves away from Toyota on to Lexus. I can see Celica and Soarer engineering in a close-knit giving them a stronger definition in the company.

That's a strange idea, what is your reasoning for wanting a Lexus Celica? I would like to see the Celica return as a Toyota, but have a compact sports coupe that shares with the Celica platform to compete with the Audi TTs.

I'm very anti rebadging, just like I am very anti realigning sports teams. lol

[Type[R]+]

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

They aren't naming it Celica anywhere either.

How would you know?

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

Can we put that stupidity to rest also?

why is it stupid?

I say 'here' as in 'Australia', just like they trademarked 86 'here'.

[Dimman]

I think what Toyonta needs to do is sit down and solidify what they want their brands to be.

Lexus is a bit confused as it seems to be taking bits of MB when it was more lux, BMW's sport image and Ferrari (LFA), plus Land Rover with the SUVs, but it's not really well integrated throughout their line.

Toyota is sadly probably the dullest brand in the universe right now. There is talk of splitting off Prius into its own brand, so what does that leave for the rest of the Toyota family once economy is gone? They may end up in a bad place in a few years, especially with what the Koreans are doing lately.

And Scion... Long time members may recall some of my anti-Scion rants. I'll try to be constructive this time. If they are going to be the innovative brand, they need to change things up. The iQ and FR-S are good starts, being legitimately different, instead of just marketing experiments in JDM re-badging.

What they should do with Scion products is maintain their rather odd 'total sales aren't important' attitdude, except use it to introduce more 'experimental' types of cars and technologies, that can be evaluated in real life. Then what works can be adapted rather rapidly to Toyota brand products. Key here is to allow some of the engineers to get creative, and also experiment with bringing product to sale more rapidly. 3 year product cycles maybe?

Alternatively they could be hand-me down Lexus models, like what VW did with the City Golf and Jetta. Lexus IS gets a new model, then current one becomes a Scion. Fascia and light re-styles, some de-contenting, maybe powertrain changes previous V6 becomes current L4, V8 to V6, etc... I wouldn't mind a sport-oriented Scion Chaser that was an IS-series car, but with a 180 hp 2ARFE instead of the V6. If they sport-brand them, as very inexpensive BMW competitors they could also go with they all get manual options. Tooling and R&D savings would be astronomical.

My brand changing 2 cents.

[Type[R]+]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Lexus is a bit confused as it seems to be taking bits of MB when it was more lux, BMW's sport image and Ferrari (LFA), plus Land Rover with the SUVs, but it's not really well integrated throughout their line.

It seems they trying to follow the market. Their 'F' line has been very popular now. They bringing out an 'F' in every car model now too, I believe. Lexus trending towards lux performance? They still pushing hybrids too, but I don't know who buys them?

Originally Posted by Dimman

And Scion... Long time members may recall some of my anti-Scion rants. I'll try to be constructive this time. If they are going to be the innovative brand, they need to change things up. The iQ and FR-S are good starts, being legitimately different, instead of just marketing experiments in JDM re-badging.

Seems to be a theme with USA market. Scion, Lexus, Acura, Infiniti, ect...

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Type[R]+

It seems they trying to follow the market. Their 'F' line has been very popular now. They bringing out an 'F' in every car model now too, I believe. Lexus trending towards lux performance? They still pushing hybrids too, but I don't know who buys them?

Seems to be a theme with USA market. Scion, Lexus, Acura, Infiniti, ect...

It was one thing for the Japanese, who were known for economy cars at the time to want to create a new luxury brand, but another for Toyota to create a separate brand aimed at 'youth' that was positioned below Toyota.

[Type[R]+]

Originally Posted by Dimman

It was one thing for the Japanese, who were known for economy cars at the time to want to create a new luxury brand, but another for Toyota to create a separate brand aimed at 'youth' that was positioned below Toyota.

Below as in entry level cheap cars? From the outside looking in (we don't have Scion), it just looks like more hip/cool/trendy then the regular yaris, corolla, ect.

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by Type[R]+

How would you know?


why is it stupid?

I say 'here' as in 'Australia', just like they trademarked 86 'here'.

I believe the Scion tC might use the successor chassis code for the Celica but I need to get around to researching it .

But until then I'm going to be lazy and say tC stands for Toyota Celica...I'm just sayin' .

[WingsofWar]

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

I believe the Scion tC might use the successor chassis code for the Celica but I need to get around to researching it .

But until then I'm going to be lazy and say tC stands for Toyota Celica...I'm just sayin' .

tC = Touring Coupe

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

tC = Touring Coupe

And Toyota Celica = Touring Coupe.